Politicians and firearms (Read 1190 times)

Isaac

Politicians and firearms
« on: March 10, 2021, 02:55:49 PM »
Has any one brought up a suggestion that politicians go through the process of firearms training and purchase like regular citizens so they have a clear idea of the laws and regulations already in place. For example not skipping processes just because of their positions.

omnigun

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2021, 03:16:51 PM »
They couldn't skip even if they wanted to.  But I think it was brought up in the past but many politicians have no interest in learning.

Isaac

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2021, 07:06:16 PM »
They couldn't skip even if they wanted to.  But I think it was brought up in the past but many politicians have no interest in learning.
If they have no interest in learning,  they should have no interest in passing laws on something they dont fully understand.

hvybarrels

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Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2021, 07:55:11 PM »
Keep trying. Eventually someone they know will get raped, robbed, or murdered and then you will have your window.

macsak

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2021, 09:53:39 PM »
Has any one brought up a suggestion that politicians go through the process of firearms training and purchase like regular citizens so they have a clear idea of the laws and regulations already in place. For example not skipping processes just because of their positions.

lessons in firearms education (LIFE) has a standing invitation for any lawmaker to attend their handgun safety class for free
there are other groups that are willing to do this too (i teach for HDF, and we would)

ren

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2021, 10:21:21 PM »
If they have no interest in learning,  they should have no interest in passing laws on something they dont fully understand.

lawmakers aren't the brightest - they weren't elected on their keen intellect and experience....look at Karl "Marx" Rhoads

punaperson

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2021, 09:27:29 AM »
Keep trying. Eventually someone they know will get raped, robbed, or murdered and then you will have your window.
Okay, let's see... 76 member of the legislature... 70 of them hardcore anti-self-defense firearms liberty... what's your timeline on "your window" producing legislative outcomes restoring rights?

Including that the standard retort is "If they'd have had a gun in their home (where it would be stored between outside the home carry times) someone in their home would have died or been seriously injured in an "accident" or committed suicide".

punaperson

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #7 on: March 11, 2021, 09:30:24 AM »
If they have no interest in learning,  they should have no interest in passing laws on something they dont fully understand.
Uh, "should"? That word/concept has virtually no cache in actual reality, especially in the political realm.

changemyoil66

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2021, 11:16:21 AM »
There are also those who would use said range XP for their political motives.  "I've been to KHSC before". Or "I've shot an assault rifle in basic training and it should not be in the hands of civilians".

punaperson

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2021, 11:50:59 AM »
There are also those who would use said range XP for their political motives.  "I've been to KHSC before". Or "I've shot an assault rifle in basic training and it should not be in the hands of civilians".
That's (in essence) Tulsi Gabbard's line.

Remember that when she announces for governor/senator as a "moderate" Democrat.

groveler

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #10 on: March 11, 2021, 07:32:10 PM »
That's (in essence) Tulsi Gabbard's line.

Remember that when she announces for governor/senator as a "moderate" Democrat.
In my BMT full auto was strictly prohibited.  But I was USAF.
In all my subsequent annual qualifications where even though I wasn't a security policeman,
I had to pass their qualification test, and still no full auto allowed.
Movies aren't reality, but most Democrats don't seem to know that.
Tulsi would be a death by a thousand cuts, whereas Hirono is death by gas chamber.
I'd prefer death by old age, but that will only happen if we get rid of our Tyrant
Democrats.
Aloha.

punaperson

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #11 on: March 12, 2021, 07:48:21 AM »
I'm sure if you guys take Tulsi and Rhoads and Green and Lee, et al to the range and give them basic training that they will do 180s and become staunch supporters of every aspect of our rights. Be sure and let me know when that happens.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #12 on: March 12, 2021, 02:17:47 PM »
I'm sure if you guys take Tulsi and Rhoads and Green and Lee, et al to the range and give them basic training that they will do 180s and become staunch supporters of every aspect of our rights. Be sure and let me know when that happens.

For decades, I've seen many accounts of anti-gun types state that THEY would never trust themselves with guns, so in turn they don't trust anyone else other than military and police with them.  Projection in its purest form.

Once you give them a chance to handle, load, unload, fire, clean and get to know the firearms they are so scared of, many change their attitudes toward private ownership and use.  They gain an appreciation of how much simpler guns are than they imagined, and how the rules of safety are more important than pistol grips and barrel shrouds.

If they really cared about safety, they would try to make gun owners safer through providing more ranges and opportunities for practicing advanced skills.  Instead, they always focus on taking the guns away and limiting where we can possess guns.

If we can get them to understand that one thing, we'd be laying a better foundation than exists now.
Surely Not Everybody Was Kung Fu Fighting.

punaperson

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #13 on: March 12, 2021, 03:58:12 PM »
For decades, I've seen many accounts of anti-gun types state that THEY would never trust themselves with guns, so in turn they don't trust anyone else other than military and police with them.  Projection in its purest form.

Once you give them a chance to handle, load, unload, fire, clean and get to know the firearms they are so scared of, many change their attitudes toward private ownership and use.  They gain an appreciation of how much simpler guns are than they imagined, and how the rules of safety are more important than pistol grips and barrel shrouds.

If they really cared about safety, they would try to make gun owners safer through providing more ranges and opportunities for practicing advanced skills.  Instead, they always focus on taking the guns away and limiting where we can possess guns.

If we can get them to understand that one thing, we'd be laying a better foundation than exists now.
There are nearly 20 states that recognize that the fundamental individual natural rights enumerated in the Second Amendment include the right to bear arms outside the home for the purpose of self-defense without requiring any permission of any kind of from any government agency (aka "permitless carry" or "constitutional carry"). THERE IS NOT ONE SINGLE LEGISLATOR NOR EXECTUTIVE (AND LIKELY NO JUDGE) IN ALL OF HAWAII THAT SUPPORTS THAT RIGHT.  (Go ahead, ask Fevella or Gabbard or whoever to introduce such a bill.) There's never gonna be a "foundation" created by any kind of "education" effort that will result in those people actually honoring their oath of office to support and defend the constitution as recognized by those other states.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #14 on: March 12, 2021, 04:13:30 PM »
There are nearly 20 states that recognize that the fundamental individual natural rights enumerated in the Second Amendment include the right to bear arms outside the home for the purpose of self-defense without requiring any permission of any kind of from any government agency (aka "permitless carry" or "constitutional carry"). THERE IS NOT ONE SINGLE LEGISLATOR NOR EXECTUTIVE (AND LIKELY NO JUDGE) IN ALL OF HAWAII THAT SUPPORTS THAT RIGHT.  (Go ahead, ask Fevella or Gabbard or whoever to introduce such a bill.) There's never gonna be a "foundation" created by any kind of "education" effort that will result in those people actually honoring their oath of office to support and defend the constitution as recognized by those other states.

So, you've basically given up.

Gotcha.
Surely Not Everybody Was Kung Fu Fighting.

Bota-CS1

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #15 on: March 12, 2021, 06:17:43 PM »
I can’t remember if it was WA state or someplace else where one legislator proposed an amendment that prohibited lawmaker from passing legislation without training first.
No one is coming, it’s up to us.

Legislation should never be about depriving law abiding citizens of something, but rather taking those things away from criminals.

punaperson

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #16 on: March 13, 2021, 08:53:30 AM »
So, you've basically given up.

Gotcha.
So, you've basically drunk the kool-aid.

Gotcha.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #17 on: March 13, 2021, 11:02:32 AM »
So, you've basically drunk the kool-aid.

Gotcha.

What kool-aid would that be?

Just saying "kool-aid" is meaningless.
Surely Not Everybody Was Kung Fu Fighting.

drck1000

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #18 on: March 13, 2021, 12:24:30 PM »
But, but, but Tulsi was a "weapons expert".  I've heard her say that may times, even in person. 

I personally cannot attest to her proficiency, but I personally know a couple of folks who were in her units (at different times).  Neither of them are "gun guys", but neither was particularly impressed. 

ren

Re: Politicians and firearms
« Reply #19 on: March 13, 2021, 12:32:24 PM »
But, but, but Tulsi was a "weapons expert".  I've heard her say that may times, even in person. 

I personally cannot attest to her proficiency, but I personally know a couple of folks who were in her units (at different times).  Neither of them are "gun guys", but neither was particularly impressed.

A "weapons expert" wouldn't be shooting at the berm with an M9.