Observations of Home Invasion (Read 20221 times)

Growler67

Observations of Home Invasion
« on: October 06, 2011, 03:47:47 PM »
From my formaer Gun Club:  http://www.whistlingpinesgunclub.com/index.php/2011/09/our-observations-on-a-home-invasion/

Of course in Colorado, there is the "Make My Day Law" which has NO duty to retreat and if deemed a justified shoot you are free from criminal prosecution.
Practice does NOT make perfect. Perfection is an Ideal and thus cannot exist in the real world. To seek perfection is to set yourself up for failure. Instead, strive for Excellence. Excellence is an attainable goal - Coach George Yamamoto, Mililani High School, RIP

vooduchikn

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2011, 06:54:41 PM »
From my formaer Gun Club:  http://www.whistlingpinesgunclub.com/index.php/2011/09/our-observations-on-a-home-invasion/

Of course in Colorado, there is the "Make My Day Law" which has NO duty to retreat and if deemed a justified shoot you are free from criminal prosecution.

Castle Doctrine.

Hawaii has it too.
Relax, I've banned myself..

Growler67

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2011, 06:59:41 PM »
I understood Hawaii has a duty to retreat.  Maybe I misunderstood.
Practice does NOT make perfect. Perfection is an Ideal and thus cannot exist in the real world. To seek perfection is to set yourself up for failure. Instead, strive for Excellence. Excellence is an attainable goal - Coach George Yamamoto, Mililani High School, RIP

vooduchikn

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2011, 07:13:42 PM »
I understood Hawaii has a duty to retreat.  Maybe I misunderstood.

It used to.
Relax, I've banned myself..

Kingkeoni

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2011, 07:21:59 PM »
I understood Hawaii has a duty to retreat.  Maybe I misunderstood.

It used to.

Hawaii has a duty to retreat outside of your home.

Inside your noise, there is no such obligation.
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Pizzo

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2011, 07:29:20 PM »
I understood Hawaii has a duty to retreat.  Maybe I misunderstood.

It used to.

Hawaii has a duty to retreat outside of your home.

Inside your noise, there is no such obligation.
I thought that even inside the residence you had to give the "intruder" option of retreat before using deadly force?? Did that change recently, or has it always been that way?

vooduchikn

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2011, 07:39:43 PM »
I understood Hawaii has a duty to retreat.  Maybe I misunderstood.

It used to.

Hawaii has a duty to retreat outside of your home.

Inside your noise, there is no such obligation.
I thought that even inside the residence you had to give the "intruder" option of retreat before using deadly force?? Did that change recently, or has it always been that way?

Changed right before last GOV left office. 
Relax, I've banned myself..

Pizzo

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2011, 07:47:48 PM »
I understood Hawaii has a duty to retreat.  Maybe I misunderstood.

It used to.

Hawaii has a duty to retreat outside of your home.

Inside your noise, there is no such obligation.
I thought that even inside the residence you had to give the "intruder" option of retreat before using deadly force?? Did that change recently, or has it always been that way?

Changed right before last GOV left office.
Ok, thanx....that's good info to know!!  :shaka:

vooduchikn

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #8 on: October 06, 2011, 08:10:27 PM »
Of note is there are home invasions here, but not a reported use of the Castle Doctrine yet.... :wacko:
Relax, I've banned myself..

Cougar8045

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #9 on: October 06, 2011, 08:12:53 PM »
This is a very good question.  As I understand that law, outside your home you are required to retreat if you can do so in perfect safety.  Inside your house, it sounds like pretty standard use of deadly force self-defense law.  I haven't seen anything like some other states with stronger Castle Doctrines have, for example, in some states, if someone has broken into the structure you're occupying then deadly force is authorized.  If I'm not mistaken, I believe that Hawaii's Castle law only protects you from civil suits if you the shoot is deemed justified.
I'm just a fluffy white bunny rabbit who lost his way. 

"If a thief be found breaking in, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him. ..."  -Exodus 22:2

Travboi

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #10 on: October 06, 2011, 10:08:49 PM »
This is a very good question.  As I understand that law, outside your home you are required to retreat if you can do so in perfect safety.  Inside your house, it sounds like pretty standard use of deadly force self-defense law.  I haven't seen anything like some other states with stronger Castle Doctrines have, for example, in some states, if someone has broken into the structure you're occupying then deadly force is authorized.  If I'm not mistaken, I believe that Hawaii's Castle law only protects you from civil suits if you the shoot is deemed justified.

i also thought i can only shoot if the invader is trying to kill,rape, etc.

vooduchikn

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #11 on: October 06, 2011, 10:10:09 PM »
This is a very good question.  As I understand that law, outside your home you are required to retreat if you can do so in perfect safety.  Inside your house, it sounds like pretty standard use of deadly force self-defense law.  I haven't seen anything like some other states with stronger Castle Doctrines have, for example, in some states, if someone has broken into the structure you're occupying then deadly force is authorized.  If I'm not mistaken, I believe that Hawaii's Castle law only protects you from civil suits if you the shoot is deemed justified.

i also thought i can only shoot if the invader is trying to kill,rape, etc.

You need to read the law.
Relax, I've banned myself..

2aHawaii

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Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #12 on: October 07, 2011, 03:49:49 AM »
From the way I read the law, it can be a sticky situation. You have to believe the intruder is committing a felony (whatever that means to the normal lay man). As always, consult a lawyer before giving a statement and you feared for your life.
I am not a lawyer.

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Heavies

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #13 on: October 07, 2011, 03:58:06 AM »
This is a very good question.  As I understand that law, outside your home you are required to retreat if you can do so in perfect safety.  Inside your house, it sounds like pretty standard use of deadly force self-defense law.  I haven't seen anything like some other states with stronger Castle Doctrines have, for example, in some states, if someone has broken into the structure you're occupying then deadly force is authorized.  If I'm not mistaken, I believe that Hawaii's Castle law only protects you from civil suits if you the shoot is deemed justified.

i also thought i can only shoot if the invader is trying to kill,rape, etc.

I read it as this.

sirkaiks

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #14 on: October 07, 2011, 07:01:55 AM »
http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2010/bills/SB532_CD1_.pdf

to me it sounds like, if someone is on your property and "any reasonable person" believes a felony is being committed........... shoot the bastard! :thumbsup:

Growler67

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #15 on: October 07, 2011, 07:19:29 AM »
http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2010/bills/SB532_CD1_.pdf

to me it sounds like, if someone is on your property and "any reasonable person" believes a felony is being committed........... shoot the bastard! :thumbsup:

What constitutes a "felony" to the average lay person?  Theft of how much?  It's easy to determine "threat of bodily harm or injury" when someone is agressively coming towards you, but I don't like the idea of having to watch a burglury/theft in progrerss until a specific dollar amount is reached for it to classify the crime as a felony before I open fire.  THAT is too much "Aloha Spirit" and the perp was wrong for entering my home to begin with.
Practice does NOT make perfect. Perfection is an Ideal and thus cannot exist in the real world. To seek perfection is to set yourself up for failure. Instead, strive for Excellence. Excellence is an attainable goal - Coach George Yamamoto, Mililani High School, RIP

sirkaiks

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #16 on: October 07, 2011, 07:56:35 AM »
What constitutes a "felony" to the average lay person?  Theft of how much?  It's easy to determine "threat of bodily harm or injury" when someone is agressively coming towards you, but I don't like the idea of having to watch a burglury/theft in progrerss until a specific dollar amount is reached for it to classify the crime as a felony before I open fire.  THAT is too much "Aloha Spirit" and the perp was wrong for entering my home to begin with.

i agree!

hvybarrels

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #17 on: October 07, 2011, 01:29:44 PM »
I'm not qualified to give legal advice but from the way I understand it you will be arrested no matter what, and generally it's a good idea to not make any statements to the cops until you have a lawyer present. I also heard that it's in your best interest to call 911 if possible BEFORE the confrontation and let them record what happens on the phone so in court they can hear you shouting a warning to the person before you fill them full of jhp's or buckshot. No matter what you'll need to call 911 and describe yourself, tell them that you shot someone invading your house, and probably ask them to do with your weapon when the cops get there.

Also take into consideration that dead people don't make very good witnesses, but follow-up execution-style shots or crushing their skull with a dumbell as they lay there helpless and bleeding will get you a prison term for sure.
“Wars happen when the government tells you who the enemy is. Revolutions happen when you figure it out for yourselves.”

vooduchikn

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #18 on: October 07, 2011, 02:11:34 PM »
http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2010/bills/SB532_CD1_.pdf

to me it sounds like, if someone is on your property and "any reasonable person" believes a felony is being committed........... shoot the bastard! :thumbsup:

What constitutes a "felony" to the average lay person?  Theft of how much?  It's easy to determine "threat of bodily harm or injury" when someone is agressively coming towards you, but I don't like the idea of having to watch a burglury/theft in progrerss until a specific dollar amount is reached for it to classify the crime as a felony before I open fire.  THAT is too much "Aloha Spirit" and the perp was wrong for entering my home to begin with.

 Burglary, Robbery, breaking and entering with the intent to comment afforementioned = felony.
Relax, I've banned myself..

sirkaiks

Re: Observations of Home Invasion
« Reply #19 on: October 07, 2011, 02:24:00 PM »
if i'm reading correctly, in paragraph F, it also says that you don't have to warn the perp... somebody correct me if im wrong please.