AR Stripped Lower Registration: Other or Pistol (Read 5095 times)

Rico808

Re: AR Stripped Lower Registration: Other or Pistol
« Reply #40 on: June 24, 2022, 07:23:57 PM »
UPDATE:

I purchased at stripped lower through LGS to be registered as a pistol.

Shared my plans. AR pistol, BOLT-Action, & Detachable 10 Round Magazine.

All parties were on board.

I’m safe as the bolt action disqualifies it as an “assault pistol”

"Assault pistol" means a semiautomatic pistol that accepts a detachable magazine and has two or more of the following characteristics:
     (1)  An ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip;
     (2)  A threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward hand grip, or silencer;
     (3)  A shroud that is attached to or partially or completely encircles the barrel and permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the second hand without being burned;
     (4)  A manufactured weight of fifty ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded;
     (5)  A centerfire pistol with an overall length of twelve inches or more; or
     (6)  It is a semiautomatic version of an automatic firearm;
but does not include a firearm with a barrel sixteen or more inches in length, an antique pistol as defined in this section, or a curio or relic as those terms are used in 18 United States Code section 921(a)(13) or 27 Code of Federal Regulations section 478.11.

I was safe…SO I THOUGHT.

LGS informs me that HPD contacted him & informed him that if I wished to continue with the pistol registration that the magazine HAS to be WELDED, no matter the action is. “Because the upper can be easily changed.” Also the welding has to be done by a type 7 gunsmith and a ATF form must be filed. ALL HAS TO BE DONE PRIOR TO ME BEING ABLE TO START MY PTA.

Bah Humbug 🤦🏾‍♂️

Living life on the edge. Just trying to spread my 2A wings as far as I can.

When you stand for nothing, you fall for everything

Flapp_Jackson

Re: AR Stripped Lower Registration: Other or Pistol
« Reply #41 on: June 24, 2022, 07:54:19 PM »
UPDATE:

I purchased at stripped lower through LGS to be registered as a pistol.

Shared my plans. AR pistol, BOLT-Action, & Detachable 10 Round Magazine.

All parties were on board.

I’m safe as the bolt action disqualifies it as an “assault pistol”

"Assault pistol" means a semiautomatic pistol that accepts a detachable magazine and has two or more of the following characteristics:
     (1)  An ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip;
     (2)  A threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward hand grip, or silencer;
     (3)  A shroud that is attached to or partially or completely encircles the barrel and permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the second hand without being burned;
     (4)  A manufactured weight of fifty ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded;
     (5)  A centerfire pistol with an overall length of twelve inches or more; or
     (6)  It is a semiautomatic version of an automatic firearm;
but does not include a firearm with a barrel sixteen or more inches in length, an antique pistol as defined in this section, or a curio or relic as those terms are used in 18 United States Code section 921(a)(13) or 27 Code of Federal Regulations section 478.11.

I was safe…SO I THOUGHT.

LGS informs me that HPD contacted him & informed him that if I wished to continue with the pistol registration that the magazine HAS to be WELDED, no matter the action is. “Because the upper can be easily changed.” Also the welding has to be done by a type 7 gunsmith and a ATF form must be filed. ALL HAS TO BE DONE PRIOR TO ME BEING ABLE TO START MY PTA.

Bah Humbug 🤦🏾‍♂️

That's BS.   They are violating the law ... which you posted.

Their rationalization doesn't hold water.   There is nothing in the law that prohibits having parts that "could be combined" into an illegal firearm.  I believe that's called Constructive Possession -- possessing the parts and having them in close proximity so as to be able to construct an illegal firearm.  This usually applies to parts like full auto sears.

Any rifle LOWER with a legal UPPER can be "easily changed" with an illegal UPPER whether the lower is a rifle or pistol.  The upper has nothing to do with the function of the firearm until you actually fit them together.

I'd ask for that information in writing from HPD.  Getting the information secondhand from a LGS could be problematic.  Did you not learn already that even gun dealers get it wrong? (refer to your previous LGS who required your rifle permit for the transfer)

Truth, when not sought after, rarely comes to light.  -- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

I need some new conspiracy theories. All my old ones turned out to be true.

Hamburger Helper only works if the hamburger really wants to be helped.

Rico808

Re: AR Stripped Lower Registration: Other or Pistol
« Reply #42 on: June 24, 2022, 08:24:21 PM »
That's BS.   They are violating the law ... which you posted.

Their rationalization doesn't hold water.   There is nothing in the law that prohibits having parts that "could be combined" into an illegal firearm.  I believe that's called Constructive Possession -- possessing the parts and having them in close proximity so as to be able to construct an illegal firearm.  This usually applies to parts like full auto sears.

Any rifle LOWER with a legal UPPER can be "easily changed" with an illegal UPPER whether the lower is a rifle or pistol.  The upper has nothing to do with the function of the firearm until you actually fit them together.

I'd ask for that information in writing from HPD.  Getting the information secondhand from a LGS could be problematic.  Did you not learn already that even gun dealers get it wrong? (refer to your previous LGS who required your rifle permit for the transfer)

Oh yes, I definitely learned that from my previous LGS.

& I agree with what you said. You can’t stop a person from doing something because he/she MIGHT do something illegal later on.

What stops a person from doing something illegal? The law and the persons choice to follow it.

It’s just how I see it. Others may see it differently 🤷🏾‍♂️
Living life on the edge. Just trying to spread my 2A wings as far as I can.

When you stand for nothing, you fall for everything

Flapp_Jackson

Re: AR Stripped Lower Registration: Other or Pistol
« Reply #43 on: June 24, 2022, 08:34:54 PM »
Oh yes, I definitely learned that from my previous LGS.

& I agree with what you said. You can’t stop a person from doing something because he/she MIGHT do something illegal later on.

What stops a person from doing something illegal? The law and the persons choice to follow it.

It’s just how I see it. Others may see it differently 🤷🏾‍♂️

If they can't show you the law that requires all bolt action AR pistols have a welded mag, then ask them about constructive possession and where that is in the law.

If they are going to go down that road, they need to change the law.  Right now, if your pistol AS PLANNED conforms to a legal AR pistol, that is all you need to do.

If they persist, you  need to address this to the new police chief, the police commission and the AG.  Explain that they are preemptively claiming you could break the law, so you need to take your build in a direction you don't want to go to satisfy the Firearms Division -- even though what you're planning is 100% within the law.
Truth, when not sought after, rarely comes to light.  -- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

I need some new conspiracy theories. All my old ones turned out to be true.

Hamburger Helper only works if the hamburger really wants to be helped.

hotkarl4u

Re: AR Stripped Lower Registration: Other or Pistol
« Reply #44 on: June 26, 2022, 05:31:51 AM »
Someone mentioned a PCC being legal at 5.5” but according to the laws posted above I don’t see how you could get away with one being legal.  Am I missing something? 

Flapp_Jackson

Re: AR Stripped Lower Registration: Other or Pistol
« Reply #45 on: June 26, 2022, 11:10:30 AM »
Someone mentioned a PCC being legal at 5.5” but according to the laws posted above I don’t see how you could get away with one being legal.  Am I missing something?

A PCC (Pistol-Caliber Carbine) uses a bullet that is designed for a pistol, normally 9mm or .45 ACP.

An AR pistol will normally be .223/5.56, which is a rifle-caliber round.  Rifles can be carbines (rifle caliber firearm with short barrel).  That alone doesn't make it a PCC -- the caliber bullet is a factor.

What we are talking about here is an AR pistol that doesn't meet the HRS 134 definition of "Assault Pistol."
Truth, when not sought after, rarely comes to light.  -- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

I need some new conspiracy theories. All my old ones turned out to be true.

Hamburger Helper only works if the hamburger really wants to be helped.