This was posted on Hawaii News Now. http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/Global/story.asp?S=24049729

I can't believe that Knudsen is still pulling his "bullet finding" bullshit! He's been trying to shut down Koko Head for YEARS!! The examples that the Dept. of Parks and Recreations are using (many of which were supplied by Knudsen), are total fabrications and lies. We all know that there is NO WAY a bullet that hits a metal target can ricochet ALL THE WAY to Queens Gate and Koko Kai, and there is NO WAY that a ricochet has the energy to "pierced the roof of her van at Sandy Beach".

If they continue to restrict the rifle side to only 100 yards, then we may see a decline in shooters at the range. If that happens, we don't have as many signatures in the log books, which serve as a petition to keep the range open. Without continual use of the range, we risk losing it.

The Hawaii Kai neighborhood board is meeting on Tuesday November 26th at 7pm at Hahaione Elementary School. PLEASE come to the meeting to testify or to show support for all of us. The more TRUTH we can give the board, the better our chances are of not having our rights and our ONLY public place to shoot taken away. If you can come and decide to testify, please bring as many facts and statistics about ricochets as you possibly can, and why shooting over 100 yards is essential to the training of all shooters, including hunters, competitive shooters, and recreational shooters alike. We need to keep the focus on why Knudsen and those like him are a bunch of liars, and that the alleged fears of those who are ignorant of firearms, are not physically possible.

Thank you so much in advance to everyone that can and will be there to fight for all of us.

Mahalo,
Devin 

I'm in

At least it's getting some air time so people are informed of the situation and can restore the regular ranges.  They just had to include the sandy beach car incident too.  Remember what happened with that?  Right, nothing.  Hopefully we can get some details from the Monday city official meeting to go with the Hawaii Kai one

I like the idiot liberal's comment on the KHON site about "gun enthusiasts" needing to stop shooting in the air Pancho-Villa Style.

I commented but their moderators deleted it.  Gee, you don't think they have an agenda, do you?

My comment to the KHON online article:

Since the police will not provide evidence to the public until their investigation is over, there can be no rational discussion on this matter. But, that doesn't stop Knudsen from taking his accusations to the public, does it?

When Knudsen says there is evidence, it is circumstantial at best. I wonder if his "evidence" also includes the 70 year old WWII rounds found on the beach that were just casings, an unfired, unloaded bullet with no rifle marks, etc. Even though those "instances" were debunked, he still piles them onto his cart of so-called evidence.

If a round truly ricocheted off a steel target and miraculously cleared the crater to strike a home, the projectile would show evidence of impact with the target. It would be mushroomed, flattened, and/or in pieces. A pointy bullet that hits a steel plate and retains it's shape can not happen.

Does it not seem highly unlikely that this one man has found not one, but three bullets on three occasions in three different locations? What are the odds of that? I can't say he is manufacturing evidence, because what he presents to the Hawaii Kai Neighborhood board doesn't qualify as "evidence".

Everytime Knudsen brings a bullet he claims comes from the range a kitten dies...


please Mr. Knudsen no more bullet lyze...

 ???This was on the news last night.
http://www.khon2.com/news/stray-bullet-into-home-prompts-new-rules

Someone should really call khon and see if they will give some coverage to the other side.  You never know.

Stuff happens...

Here is an MSNBC story about a guy that claims he was shot from a police range 2 miles away.
-- 8/22/2007

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/20397508/?gt1=10252#.UpFDouIud28

Stuff happens...

Here is an MSNBC story about a guy that claims he was shot from a police range 2 miles away.
-- 8/22/2007

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/20397508/?gt1=10252#.UpFDouIud28

Their berm probably isn't over a 1000 ft tall.

Their berm probably isn't over a 1000 ft tall.

True.  And in Oklahoma, they only have 3-4 trees over 20 ft tall! 

???This was on the news last night.
http://www.khon2.com/news/stray-bullet-into-home-prompts-new-rules

I love the "Police and City officials still don't know for sure if the bullet came from the Koko Head Shooting Complex, but they aren't taking any chances."

I love the "Police and City officials still don't know for sure if the bullet came from the Koko Head Shooting Complex, but they aren't taking any chances."

in other words...we are not sure which car killed this person but we are establishing a curfew on all cars on the same time this person was hit -- we're not taking any chances...but we know it was a car.

Well, if the same morons get elected, we can all expect the same results......

Found the house on Google Earth, kind of an odd angle to hit the side of the house, high on the window, without hitting the eves or the other zero lot-line house... A one in a million ricochet    Must've made an end game turn like the "magic loogie" in that Seinfeld episode     

Anyway, a quick question to prep for the Tuesday meeting:   Is the Koko Crater a sanctioned (read: legal trail)?   I can't find any straight gouge on this, other than it's not listed by our parks & rec department (they list Makapu'u, Aiea Loop, etc.).

Mahalo 

Boomah

Found the house on Google Earth, kind of an odd angle to hit the side of the house, high on the window, without hitting the eves or the other zero lot-line house... A one in a million ricochet    Must've made an end game turn like the "magic loogie" in that Seinfeld episode     

Anyway, a quick question to prep for the Tuesday meeting:   Is the Koko Crater a sanctioned (read: legal trail)?   I can't find any straight gouge on this, other than it's not listed by our parks & rec department (they list Makapu'u, Aiea Loop, etc.).

Mahalo 

Boomah

i guess my take is not unique
i am thinking along the same lines as you are, boom

Anyway, a quick question to prep for the Tuesday meeting:   Is the Koko Crater a sanctioned (read: legal trail)?   I can't find any straight gouge on this, other than it's not listed by our parks & rec department (they list Makapu'u, Aiea Loop, etc.).
Mahalo 
Boomah

No it is not. I don't remember which entity put up trespassing signs there a few years ago (City or State) but they were obviously ignored and taken down. A lot of people use that trail and because of that no one enforces the blatant trespassing. There are more events that cost the CIty money to tend to that illegal trail. Remember that crazy naked knife man? How many times can you count an HFD heli airlifting injured hikers off the trail? If users want to shutter the LEGAL range so they can ILLEGALLY use the trail they probably won't win that argument. Wait - does that some like a liberal argument? 
There are many sources of that bullet that supposedly hit that house. Did the media or the general public consider them? Obviously not. This is analogous to linking a murder involving a gun to any registered gun owner

.

I'm assuming you are going to tell them that kokohead is an unsanctioned trail, and therefore no one should be hiking on it because of safety? Therefore, because they took our plates, we should take the trail?

Good luck; Daniel has been arguing this point for years, and nothing has changed with regards to the trail. In fact, there are more people hiking on the trail than ever before.  If you can recall, knudnuts already tried to use the hiking trail as a talking point against the range, but failed because it was an unsanctioned trail. If that's your play, be careful because this trail is now a major destination for most tourists and locals alike. You may very well motivate these people to have the trail sanctioned, which will cause more problems for the range, if not cause it to shut down completely due to safety concerns. Its important to remember that more people care about kokohead than they do the range.

I personally wouldn't use kokohead as a bargaining chip, because it seems like it may cause more problems than people may think. But that's my 2 cents. 

Ummm, no... I'm just asking the question as I've heard different things from different sources.   Good to know if the "hikers are in danger" argument ever comes up again.   I'm just looking for the facts...

And Thanks Ren, that's what I was wondering... Kind of like Mariners Ridge.   A friend of mine is one of the Air 1 pilots, he's pulled more than a few hikers off of both trails

Boomah

Ummm, no... I'm just asking the question as I've heard different things from different sources.   Good to know if the "hikers are in danger" argument ever comes up again.   I'm just looking for the facts...

And Thanks Ren, that's what I was wondering... Kind of like Mariners Ridge.   A friend of mine is one of the Air 1 pilots, he's pulled more than a few hikers off of both trails

Boomah

Maybe we need to petition the C&C to post signs on the KH trail:

Danger:  Risk of Serious Injury or Death
Koko Head Crater is home to the Public Shooting Range.
Anyone using this trail accepts full responsibility for their own safety beyond this point.

That way, nobody is banned from using the trail, just warned that any stray rounds will not result in a monetary windfall....either for themselves or their survivors.