Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules (Read 828 times)

changemyoil66

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #20 on: May 13, 2024, 11:04:40 AM »
The other two have not had charges filed.

And why is that?

ren

Deeds Not Words

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #22 on: May 13, 2024, 08:14:57 PM »
Everyone should be held accountable.   Including biden and Hillary.

https://youtube.com/shorts/5NGrkt-9nRM?si=ocDFaDZor6MbOHMh

So .... which is it?  "Everyone should be held accountable", or it's okay because Biden and Clinton "have not not had charges filed?"

You can't have it both ways -- not with all the evidence on the record against both of them.

I believe in due process, but so far the only process seems to be "turn a blind eye for democrats -- all others get crucified."
"How can you diagnose someone with an obsessive-compulsive disorder
and then act as though I had some choice about barging in?"
-- Melvin Udall

macsak

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #23 on: May 15, 2024, 07:29:58 AM »
strongest case?


Funny that instead of this case, their strongest case, going first they lead with the BS cases.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #24 on: May 15, 2024, 12:15:29 PM »
strongest case?

I considered the photo being made public was at a minimum unprofessional and at worst a fabrication.  The photo of the supposedly classified docs didn't need to be taken at all.  There are regulations forbidding photography of, or in the vicinity of, classified material. 

Having the photo published was completely improper as it was part of an active investigation.  The only conclusion is the picture was intended to give the public the wrong impression before the facts were even known.

This all makes perfect sense.  If the cover sheets were already used, it would have made it far less likely they were mishandled and moved to improper storage -- especially if this many classified docs existed and had cover sheets.

Any search team planning to recover classified paper docs would have come prepared with coversheets and proper containers.  For TS, the rules are pretty specific.
"How can you diagnose someone with an obsessive-compulsive disorder
and then act as though I had some choice about barging in?"
-- Melvin Udall

eyeeatingfish

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #25 on: May 15, 2024, 09:31:41 PM »
first of all, the cases are in 4 different jurisdictions, so they cannot coordinate the order
B- you are implying that these prosecutions are being driven by one group, which the democrats deny  >:D
3- all the cases are BS, even this one you call the "strongest case" is being held indefinitely due to the problems with the handling of the files...

I think the timing is too obvious for democrats to claim they weren't coordinated at some level however I would suspect that there was competition amongst themselves as well so they can get recognition.

Having said that, I think the classified documents case is the easiest to prove. If they had picked one or two specific charges, instead of the dozens they threw at him, they could have made it much easier to get their case to trial quickly. If all they went with was the refusal to return the classified documents they would have had a very easy charge to prove

I think the classified document case does have actual merit to it though unlike the others which are really stretching to justify a charge.

macsak

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #26 on: May 15, 2024, 10:35:25 PM »
really?
you are doubling down?
the case is indefinitely on hold
the DOJ admitted they mishandled the documents, that they broke protocol to take the pictures, they put the top secret covers on non-secret docs
and so on, and so on, and so on...

I think the timing is too obvious for democrats to claim they weren't coordinated at some level however I would suspect that there was competition amongst themselves as well so they can get recognition.

Having said that, I think the classified documents case is the easiest to prove. If they had picked one or two specific charges, instead of the dozens they threw at him, they could have made it much easier to get their case to trial quickly. If all they went with was the refusal to return the classified documents they would have had a very easy charge to prove

I think the classified document case does have actual merit to it though unlike the others which are really stretching to justify a charge.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #27 on: May 15, 2024, 11:33:41 PM »
really?
you are doubling down?
the case is indefinitely on hold
the DOJ admitted they mishandled the documents, that they broke protocol to take the pictures, they put the top secret covers on non-secret docs
and so on, and so on, and so on...

#nuance
#NotNecessarily
#NotProvenInCourt
"How can you diagnose someone with an obsessive-compulsive disorder
and then act as though I had some choice about barging in?"
-- Melvin Udall

changemyoil66

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #28 on: May 16, 2024, 09:23:19 AM »
I think the timing is too obvious for democrats to claim they weren't coordinated at some level however I would suspect that there was competition amongst themselves as well so they can get recognition.

Having said that, I think the classified documents case is the easiest to prove. If they had picked one or two specific charges, instead of the dozens they threw at him, they could have made it much easier to get their case to trial quickly. If all they went with was the refusal to return the classified documents they would have had a very easy charge to prove

I think the classified document case does have actual merit to it though unlike the others which are really stretching to justify a charge.

What one or 2 specific charges?

ren

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #29 on: May 16, 2024, 09:39:20 AM »
I think the timing is too obvious for democrats to claim they weren't coordinated at some level however I would suspect that there was competition amongst themselves as well so they can get recognition.

Having said that, I think the classified documents case is the easiest to prove. If they had picked one or two specific charges, instead of the dozens they threw at him, they could have made it much easier to get their case to trial quickly. If all they went with was the refusal to return the classified documents they would have had a very easy charge to prove

I think the classified document case does have actual merit to it though unlike the others which are really stretching to justify a charge.

Have you handled classified documents?
Deeds Not Words

eyeeatingfish

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #30 on: May 16, 2024, 09:42:34 PM »
really?
you are doubling down?
the case is indefinitely on hold
the DOJ admitted they mishandled the documents, that they broke protocol to take the pictures, they put the top secret covers on non-secret docs
and so on, and so on, and so on...

Yes, there are issues the prosecution and courts have to deal with it but it is premature to think the case is dead.

macsak

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #31 on: May 16, 2024, 09:48:02 PM »
please show me where i said the case is dead

you said the case was "the easiest to prove" and the "strongest case"
if that were true, wouldn't it be further along than the rest of the cases?

Yes, there are issues the prosecution and courts have to deal with it but it is premature to think the case is dead.

eyeeatingfish

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #32 on: May 16, 2024, 09:50:02 PM »
What one or 2 specific charges?

Refusing to turn over the classified documents when instructed to.

Establishing that Trump knowingly removed documents which were classified is a much harder burden to prove than refusing to return them when ordered.

Imagine a cop stopped you with a stolen backpack. In order to prosecute for the theft of the backpack he would have to prove you took the back pack or you received the back pack knowing it was stolen. However if the cop informed you that the backpack was stolen and he had to recover it but you refused he then has pretty much all he needs to make a theft case against you because the cop knows you have knowledge it is stolen and are still keeping it. I am sure being classified does make it a little more complicated but my example illustrates why using this one charge alone makes the prosecution so much simpler than proving he moved the boxes, made misleading statements, tried to delete security footage, etc.

eyeeatingfish

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #33 on: May 16, 2024, 09:57:28 PM »
please show me where i said the case is dead

you said the case was "the easiest to prove" and the "strongest case"
if that were true, wouldn't it be further along than the rest of the cases?

Out of all the other cases, this one is the easiest to prove. Easy in comparison doesn't mean easy as a standalone case. The other cases are just that bad that this one is by far much stronger.

It could be further along if prosecutors had picked one simple charge instead of the 37 they hit him with. If all they were doing was proving they told Trump to give the documents back and he refused most of the hurdles they are trying to overcome would be removed.

Do you disagree with my position that this case is the strongest? Do you think one of the other cases are stronger?

changemyoil66

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #34 on: May 17, 2024, 07:35:11 AM »
Refusing to turn over the classified documents when instructed to.

Establishing that Trump knowingly removed documents which were classified is a much harder burden to prove than refusing to return them when ordered.

Imagine a cop stopped you with a stolen backpack. In order to prosecute for the theft of the backpack he would have to prove you took the back pack or you received the back pack knowing it was stolen. However if the cop informed you that the backpack was stolen and he had to recover it but you refused he then has pretty much all he needs to make a theft case against you because the cop knows you have knowledge it is stolen and are still keeping it. I am sure being classified does make it a little more complicated but my example illustrates why using this one charge alone makes the prosecution so much simpler than proving he moved the boxes, made misleading statements, tried to delete security footage, etc.


Hahahhaha, I figured this would be the repy. Someone wasn't paying attention at all to what's what.

changemyoil66

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #35 on: May 17, 2024, 07:36:02 AM »
Out of all the other cases, this one is the easiest to prove. Easy in comparison doesn't mean easy as a standalone case. The other cases are just that bad that this one is by far much stronger.

It could be further along if prosecutors had picked one simple charge instead of the 37 they hit him with. If all they were doing was proving they told Trump to give the documents back and he refused most of the hurdles they are trying to overcome would be removed.

Do you disagree with my position that this case is the strongest? Do you think one of the other cases are stronger?

You have no idea how they try to win.  The anti 2a lawyers do the same tactic. Guess what I'm referring to.

macsak

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #36 on: May 17, 2024, 08:27:39 AM »
the .gov admitted that they sent the boxes to trump on their own
the trump people did not request all that was sent
the .gov notified the trump people that there might be documents there that were not supposed to be there
the trump people secured the documents and were making arrangements for disposition when the .gov made the raid
the .gov was shown where the items were, yet they still searched melania and barron's rooms
the .ogv brought along covers and took pictures, which is not protocol
they covered non top secret items with covers in the pictures, which were used to make trump look bad falsely
and so on
and so on
and so on

but yeah, keep up about it being easiest to prove...

Out of all the other cases, this one is the easiest to prove. Easy in comparison doesn't mean easy as a standalone case. The other cases are just that bad that this one is by far much stronger.

It could be further along if prosecutors had picked one simple charge instead of the 37 they hit him with. If all they were doing was proving they told Trump to give the documents back and he refused most of the hurdles they are trying to overcome would be removed.

Do you disagree with my position that this case is the strongest? Do you think one of the other cases are stronger?

eyeeatingfish

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #37 on: May 17, 2024, 09:59:37 PM »

Hahahhaha, I figured this would be the repy. Someone wasn't paying attention at all to what's what.

Feel free to point out anything I said that is incorrect.

eyeeatingfish

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #38 on: May 17, 2024, 10:00:26 PM »
You have no idea how they try to win.  The anti 2a lawyers do the same tactic. Guess what I'm referring to.

I do know how they try to win. In an overzealous manner, blind to how they are shooting themselves in the foot

eyeeatingfish

Re: Trump classified documents trial indefinitely postponed, judge rules
« Reply #39 on: May 17, 2024, 10:01:47 PM »

but yeah, keep up about it being easiest to prove...

Some of the things you mentioned are procedural mistakes from my understanding. Doesn't look good but not necessarily going to sink the case.
Some of the other issues really are going to depend on the facts of the case, such as searching the other rooms.

As far as Trump people were "making arrangements" I question this one. Doesn't seem like a lot of prep to call the FBI and tell them come pick the stuff up, but maybe I am missing something there.

So you think the other cases are easier to prove?
« Last Edit: May 17, 2024, 10:33:55 PM by eyeeatingfish »