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the lead blueprint to shut down ranges (Read 2696 times)

ren

the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« on: October 04, 2022, 11:42:46 AM »
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Deeds Not Words

groveler

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2022, 12:04:12 PM »
Quote from: ren on October 04, 2022, 11:42:46 AM
https://www.kitv.com/news/local/high-levels-of-lead-contamination-found-on-puuloa-shoreline-in-ewa-beach/article_c8488b50-439f-11ed-a798-c75eced5d5b7.html
No thinking persons shits in the bed they live in, but the politicization of
guns is sickening.  Using ANY tactic possible to restrict them is OK
even if it is LA LA Land logic.
I think the pen is mightier than the sword, so these idiots with unlimited
access to "Minds full of mush" , must have permission to practice their trade, be registered, be licensed, and exposed to being red flagged.
Only then will WE be truly safe. /s
 :grrr: :popcorn:



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robtmc

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2022, 12:48:40 PM »
Have thought it was just another lever for the liberals to use for decades since I first heard of such a thing.

Always some fudd or similar comes along to say "No, it really is a problem!"
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Flapp_Jackson

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2022, 12:54:47 PM »
One of the biggest scams on the mainland for decades has been for someone to move  into an area with a range, then petition to have it shut down because of noise and "safety concerns."

The ranges were there before they moved in.  If those were real concerns, they should have chosen to not move there.  That's where most courts dismiss the law suits, but too many other judges have taken the Liberal approach and shut the ranges down.

If it works once, others will continue to try using it.

I notice the person being interviewed is a "long time resident" there.  I imagine they learned from the mainland stories that newcomers don't have the sway that "long timers" do.  Still, I imagine the long timers were there after the range existed, and they should have considered any problems before relocating there.
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"How can you diagnose someone with an obsessive-compulsive disorder
and then act as though I had some choice about barging in?"
-- Melvin Udall

changemyoil66

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2022, 01:01:23 PM »
Quote from: Flapp_Jackson on October 04, 2022, 12:54:47 PM
One of the biggest scams on the mainland for decades has been for someone to move  into an area with a range, then petition to have it shut down because of noise and "safety concerns."

The ranges were there before they moved in.  If those were real concerns, they should have chosen to not move there.  That's where most courts dismiss the law suits, but too many other judges have taken the Liberal approach and shut the ranges down.

If it works once, others will continue to try using it.

I notice the person being interviewed is a "long time resident" there.  I imagine they learned from the mainland stories that newcomers don't have the sway that "long timers" do.  Still, I imagine the long timers were there after the range existed, and they should have considered any problems before relocating there.

Reminds me of Kailua haoles grumbling about their neighbor building a 2nd story as it would block their view. Only to build one themselves, which blocks the other neighbors view.
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Rocky

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2022, 04:23:10 PM »
Quote from: Flapp_Jackson on October 04, 2022, 12:54:47 PM

I notice the person being interviewed is a "long time resident" there.  I imagine they learned from the mainland stories that newcomers don't have the sway that "long timers" do.  Still, I imagine the long timers were there after the range existed, and they should have considered any problems before relocating there.

Long term?
« Last Edit: November 23, 2022, 01:55:46 PM by Rocky »
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“I ask you to judge me by the enemies I have made.”
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Flapp_Jackson

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2022, 04:42:42 PM »
Quote from: Rocky on October 04, 2022, 04:23:10 PM
Long term?
I think not.
What retired military personel do you know that has been a "Long time Resident" anywhere ?

Michael James Plowman
1985 Corpus Christi, TX
Lived in Hawaii in1996 Kapolei and Ewa
2006 Honolulu/Aiea
Memphis, TN 1997-2012
Also Fl, OK, AK and TN

BIG BS Fan (Brian Schatz)

I think his grumble with the lead issue is actually in regards to "Shoreline Stabilization Project at Pu'uloa."

March 18, 2021
Big day for us in the fight against the destruction of the Ewa Shoreline!
Hawaii State Legislature Resolution SCR48 requests the USMC conduct an Environmental Impact Statement before further action is taken in moving forward with the Shoreline Stabilization Project at Pu'uloa.
Please take a moment to the read the resolution and the problem with the current plan should be obvious.
More importantly, please take a few moments to sign in to the testimony website and offer testimony IN FAVOR of this resolution.  You don't even have to offer anything more than "I am in favor of SCR48" if you have nothing else to say.  Every testimony adds up and matters!  If you have never signed in to the legislature website, registration is as simple as providing your name, email address and picking a password.
Testimony must be received within 24 hours of the hearing, so it needs to be entered by 1PM HST on Monday,
Please forward to all potential interested parties!
The resolution can be found here:   https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/measure_indiv.aspx...
You can sign in to testify at the following link:
https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/login/login.aspx


First of all, I was going off the description provided in the article:
"Mike Plowman is a retired Naval Aviator who has lived most of his life in Iraquois Point
and Ewa Beach. He and calls this community home with his wife and two young children."

"Most of his life" is a little ambiguous, but even if he's retired at 45, that might still be 22+ years in Hawaii.

To answer the question asked, I served with an Air Force Officer in Oklahoma in the mid-1980s.  He was on his last tour of duty.

As a Hawaii-born local, he managed to serve his entire career in Hawaii until he was within 3 years of retirement.  So, the Air Force decided for whatever reason to have him complete his career in Oklahoma.  He was given the choice: early retirement or OK for the remainder.

Interestingly, I moved to Hawaii in 1993, and lo and behold, he was working as a civilian in the office I came to work for.  Go figure.

Anyway, just because you're in the military doesn't mean you're a Haole. 

It also doesn't mean you were relocated every few years.  I was in the AF for almost 10 years and had 2 assignments:  OK and VA.  I worked in OK with a major who started with the AWACS program in 1976, and all of his assignments were in AWACS support:  OK, Okinawa, Seattle and OK.  That's over 26 years before he finally had to retire since he didn't make O-5.

I know another who wanted to remain in one place, so they switched units several times.  As long as there's a need to fill a vacancy, and you have the qualifications, and it saves the military having to move you unnecessarily, it can happen.

If you've researched the individual and found that he's not telling the truth, then we'll call him a liar.  Otherwise, I have to go off his comments as quoted.
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"How can you diagnose someone with an obsessive-compulsive disorder
and then act as though I had some choice about barging in?"
-- Melvin Udall

ren

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #7 on: October 04, 2022, 05:06:35 PM »
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Deeds Not Words

hvybarrels

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #8 on: October 04, 2022, 08:13:53 PM »
Installed my new optic and it looks really nice, but need 50 yards and no neighbors to sight it in.

 :(
« Last Edit: October 04, 2022, 09:27:43 PM by hvybarrels »
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Empty barrels make the most noise.

Rocky

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2022, 08:03:29 AM »
Quote from: Flapp_Jackson on October 04, 2022, 04:42:42 PM
First of all, I was going off the description provided in the article:
"Mike Plowman is a retired Naval Aviator who has lived most of his life in Iraquois Point
and Ewa Beach. He and calls this community home with his wife and two young children."

"Most of his life" is a little ambiguous, but even if he's retired at 45, that might still be 22+ years in Hawaii.

« Last Edit: November 23, 2022, 01:55:24 PM by Rocky »
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“I ask you to judge me by the enemies I have made.”
                                                           Franklin D. Roosevelt

RSN172

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2022, 08:54:18 AM »
Quote from: hvybarrels on October 04, 2022, 08:13:53 PM
Installed my new optic and it looks really nice, but need 50 yards and no neighbors to sight it in.

 :(
Move BI. Most of the lots in my subdivision are 1071 ft X 125 ft.  My lot is one of the few more rectangular at approximately 266x490 ft. There are far more lots vacant than occupied.
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Happily living in Puna

Mr. Farknocker

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2022, 08:59:03 AM »
What I'd like to see are the lead test results from beach areas around the range and randomly throughout the Island coupled with report of the activity near the beach over the last century.
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Rocky

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2022, 05:02:05 PM »
Quote from: Mr. Farknocker on October 05, 2022, 08:59:03 AM
What I'd like to see are the lead test results from beach areas around the range and randomly throughout the Island coupled with report of the activity near the beach over the last century.
How about  lead test results from popular fishing beach areas ?  ::)
Shore casters throwing 4-8 oz's per round.
Big guns (sliders) tossing 8-12 oz rounds  :shake:
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“I ask you to judge me by the enemies I have made.”
                                                           Franklin D. Roosevelt

drck1000

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #13 on: October 05, 2022, 05:32:23 PM »
Quote from: Rocky on October 05, 2022, 05:02:05 PM
How about  lead test results from popular fishing beach areas ?  ::)
Shore casters throwing 4-8 oz's per round.
Big guns (sliders) tossing 8-12 oz rounds  :shake:
Exactly what I was thinking.  My mom used to teach in that area, so used to surf, fish, and dive near there.  TONS of lead that "caught Oahu".  So much at one point people were diving to collect and resell.

However, many years ago, I was involved in a project to renovate the berms at Puuloa.  I forget which specific range, but it was the rifle range with the furthest shooting positions.  The range wasn't well maintained, with TONS of boolits embedded in the concrete wall behind the target numbers.  But the range masters said no way the Marines were shooting that high above the targets.   ;)  It was ALL ricochets. . .  ::) 

There were void about 5-6" deep in the concrete behind the plywood.  FILLED with mix of lead and concrete rubble. 
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Gordyf

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #14 on: October 05, 2022, 07:49:19 PM »
There is blood in the water with the finding of elevated lead at the range and Ewa beach.
The Surfrider foundation and the rest will know how the build on this. It is what they do best. A Holes.
It will be a feeding frenzy.
The have Osha and the EPA on their side too and will use the rules to the max to force a narrative, and a bunch of
progressives in the legislature and City Council that support the cause along with a Mayor that we never shoulda supported.
We collectively voted them in. Shame on us. 40 % turn out in the last primary?
I voted for him too, but not again.
Lead in the water from fishing weights sure enough. We used to use spark plugs for dunking. They were cheaper to lose and not so polluting
Flapp and Changemyoil, I got no problem with Haoles. I can Identify.
It's azzholes of any color that I have an issue with.
Aloha
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Aloha
Gordy

Flapp_Jackson

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #15 on: October 05, 2022, 07:58:55 PM »
Quote from: Rocky on October 05, 2022, 08:03:29 AM

   Was not jumping on your description, probably should have quoted the article's " "this stretch of shoreline is my home beach for my whole life "

Do not know what "question asked" you are referring to.

    Your personal story regarding the Air Force Officer is not a normal situation and has little to nothing to do with my post.

"What retired military personel [sic] do you know that has been a "Long time Resident" anywhere ?"

My personal story answered your question I reposted for you.

Maybe you meant it rhetorically, but it sure sounded like an accusation looking for a response.
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"How can you diagnose someone with an obsessive-compulsive disorder
and then act as though I had some choice about barging in?"
-- Melvin Udall

Rocky

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #16 on: October 06, 2022, 07:53:35 AM »
Quote from: Flapp_Jackson on October 05, 2022, 07:58:55 PM
"What retired military personel [sic] do you know that has been a "Long time Resident" anywhere ?"

My personal story answered your question I reposted for you.

Maybe you meant it rhetorically, but it sure sounded like an accusation looking for a response.
:thumbsup:
but still an anomaly.
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“I ask you to judge me by the enemies I have made.”
                                                           Franklin D. Roosevelt

Bota-CS1

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #17 on: October 06, 2022, 10:59:52 AM »
Quote from: Flapp_Jackson on October 04, 2022, 12:54:47 PM
One of the biggest scams on the mainland for decades has been for someone to move  into an area with a range, then petition to have it shut down because of noise and "safety concerns."




F*cking Carole Baskins would…..
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No one is coming, it’s up to us.

Legislation should never be about depriving law abiding citizens of something, but rather taking those things away from criminals.

drck1000

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #18 on: October 06, 2022, 11:15:00 AM »
Or like those people who bought condos next to Iolani, where the football field is.  Then complained about the noise from the football games, band practices, etc.   Like moving in next to a train line and petitioning the train line to be moved. . .
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Flapp_Jackson

Re: the lead blueprint to shut down ranges
« Reply #19 on: October 06, 2022, 12:12:14 PM »
Quote from: Rocky on October 06, 2022, 07:53:35 AM
:thumbsup:
but still an anomaly.

Right.  But you did ask the question!   :geekdanc: :shaka:

Ever since the Gramm-Rudman-Hollings Act went into effect in 1985, the military slowed its roll in moving members every 2-3 years.  Of course, deployments to the sandbox increased some requirements as reservists were activated to backfill some who deployed.  In essence, the moves had to be justified by retirements, separations and new billets.  Moving someone because they have 3 years time-on-station was replaced with "who NEEDS to move based on military vacancies?"

I got caught in Gramm-Rudman when it started.  Was at Tinker AFB, OK in 1984.  I hoped to be somewhere else --ANYWHERE else -- by 1987-ish, because OK was not my "cup of tea."  Wound up being reassigned to Langley AFB, VA in 1989.  Five years in a billet that only had a 3-year hold.  The hold was due to the training most new members needed to get up to speed (Computer Programming Unit).  Two years was the average for most to become productive "experts" in their jobs.  So, they didn't want people PCSing in less than 3 years in that billet.

I imagine many others in all services moved much fewer times in their career because of the law.  Of course, I have a pretty vivd imagination!
« Last Edit: October 06, 2022, 12:21:58 PM by Flapp_Jackson »
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"How can you diagnose someone with an obsessive-compulsive disorder
and then act as though I had some choice about barging in?"
-- Melvin Udall
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