Wrong, lack of trust is based on past experiences, and I did give an example as well. Are you having a Joe Biden moment?

Of course it is a strawman, you pretended I made two arguments and then attacked them. Not sure why you have to try so hard to argue with me that you make up things to argue over.

But here is some data on the subject, which of course if you were really interested in you would have just asked me instead of assuming I didn't and then attacking me for your fake belief. https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00003-021-01361-x

Wrong.

Past experience is nothing but anecdotal evidence.  By definition, there's nothing scientific, logical or measurable about it.

e.g. I raised 10 pit bulls over 30 years, and i never once had any of them attack me nor my family nor anybody else.  Based on PAST EXPERIENCE, I conclude that i can TRUST pit bulls to not attack anyone.

However ....
Of the 4.5M dog bites treated each year, over 84% were by pets versus strays.  Pit bulls are involved in more dog attacks than any other breed. In fact, the American Animal Hospital Association reports this breed was responsible for 22.5% of bites across all studies. Mixed breeds were a close second at 21.2%. (Mixed may also contain Pit bull genes in significant numbers given the popularity of the breed which may in turn contribute to such a high rate of attacks similar to pit bulls alone).

There is no magic formula for trust.  Do you trust your spouse?  Why?  Because she has never cheated on you in the past?  Seven years later, she starts deleting all the phone call and text data in her phone several times a day.  Does your level of trust change?  By how much? 

As they say in advertising for investments, "Past performance does not guarantee future results."  Your trust can't be quantified or explained by "past experience."  it's a feeling -- period.

Your mistrust in our ability to identify imports that break bans of ingredients is unsupported by the data you provided.  That link demonstrates that the government and safety watchdog groups are, in fact, making a successful effort in tracking those who "lie" about food product information.  Seems to me you just posted a link that supports the opposite of your conclusion that you can't trust that some places won't simply lie.  if they are being caught and monitored, then my trust level would go up.

Ever watch the 80s movie "War Games?"  In the finale, when all the data on the displays told the military we were under thermonuclear attack by the USSR, they instead decided to trust the lead characters telling them it was a simulation.  Even though all the available evidence pointed to an attack, they trusted that the people who knew the computer were telling the truth, and that all the screens and satellite images were false.  It's a movie, but how they made that decision was not fiction.

My answer had to do with color but I hadn't noticed you said appearance. I am not sure what, if any, other benefits there are than cost and color. Actually scratch that, there is at least one food dye that is made from insects so it wouldn't be vegan friendly. Not really a significant benefit to the vast majority of people though.

If it's made from insects, then it isn't "artificial". So why are you bringing that up?  Are you trying to move goal post?

If it's made from insects, then it isn't "artificial". So why are you bringing that up?  Are you trying to move goal post?

Arsenic (As) and Plutonium (Pu) are chemical elements found in nature.  I guess they are safe since they aren't "artificial."

Side note:  It's very difficult to generate 1.21 gigawatts of power without Plutonium.  So, that's a plus for naturally occurring radioactive material.

Arsenic (As) and Plutonium (Pu) are chemical elements found in nature.  I guess they are safe since they aren't "artificial."

Side note:  It's very difficult to generate 1.21 gigawatts of power without Plutonium.  So, that's a plus for naturally occurring radioactive material.

All you need is a Mr. Fusion, it's not hard at all as you can put banana peels in it and a beer can.

All you need is a Mr. Fusion, it's not hard at all as you can put banana peels in it and a beer can.

But, you still need sufficient electricity to get the machine into the future so you can have Mr. Fusion installed, since it's not yet invented.  The hover conversion would also be an option while it's in the shop.

But, you still need sufficient electricity to get the machine into the future so you can have Mr. Fusion installed, since it's not yet invented.  The hover conversion would also be an option while it's in the shop.

easy. We need to invent things that haven't been invented yet. You know what I mean?

easy. We need to invent things that haven't been invented yet. You know what I mean?

We?  You got a mouse in your pocket?   

If it's made from insects, then it isn't "artificial". So why are you bringing that up?  Are you trying to move goal post?

You asked for a benefit to the artificial color. The artificial color could be labeled vegan/vegetarian while the one made from bugs could not be.

Wrong.

Past experience is nothing but anecdotal evidence.  By definition, there's nothing scientific, logical or measurable about it.

e.g. I raised 10 pit bulls over 30 years, and i never once had any of them attack me nor my family nor anybody else.  Based on PAST EXPERIENCE, I conclude that i can TRUST pit bulls to not attack anyone.

However ....
Of the 4.5M dog bites treated each year, over 84% were by pets versus strays.  Pit bulls are involved in more dog attacks than any other breed. In fact, the American Animal Hospital Association reports this breed was responsible for 22.5% of bites across all studies. Mixed breeds were a close second at 21.2%. (Mixed may also contain Pit bull genes in significant numbers given the popularity of the breed which may in turn contribute to such a high rate of attacks similar to pit bulls alone).

There is no magic formula for trust.  Do you trust your spouse?  Why?  Because she has never cheated on you in the past?  Seven years later, she starts deleting all the phone call and text data in her phone several times a day.  Does your level of trust change?  By how much? 

As they say in advertising for investments, "Past performance does not guarantee future results."  Your trust can't be quantified or explained by "past experience."  it's a feeling -- period.

Your mistrust in our ability to identify imports that break bans of ingredients is unsupported by the data you provided.  That link demonstrates that the government and safety watchdog groups are, in fact, making a successful effort in tracking those who "lie" about food product information.  Seems to me you just posted a link that supports the opposite of your conclusion that you can't trust that some places won't simply lie.  if they are being caught and monitored, then my trust level would go up.

Ever watch the 80s movie "War Games?"  In the finale, when all the data on the displays told the military we were under thermonuclear attack by the USSR, they instead decided to trust the lead characters telling them it was a simulation.  Even though all the available evidence pointed to an attack, they trusted that the people who knew the computer were telling the truth, and that all the screens and satellite images were false.  It's a movie, but how they made that decision was not fiction.

More strawmans. I never said anything about our ability to identify imports that break bans.
 

More strawmans. I never said anything about our ability to identify imports that break bans.
 

We can fill volumes and volumes with all the things you should have, could have, but didn't say.

You asked for a benefit to the artificial color. The artificial color could be labeled vegan/vegetarian while the one made from bugs could not be.

This post just answered your own question and showed you've proved yourself wrong. "artificial color could be labeled...". Which means it's still artificial as you used the word "artificial".

Just admit you know no benefit of artificial colors besides presentation and cost.  Since it took you this long and still haven't posted any, I will take it you're wrong again.

We can fill volumes and volumes with all the things you should have, could have, but didn't say.

I could say more but such comments about you would likely get me banned 

This post just answered your own question and showed you've proved yourself wrong. "artificial color could be labeled...". Which means it's still artificial as you used the word "artificial".

Just admit you know no benefit of artificial colors besides presentation and cost.  Since it took you this long and still haven't posted any, I will take it you're wrong again.

You don't make sense. How would I admit I know of no benefit of artificial colors beyond cost and appearance when I just listed the benefit of being labeled vegan? I said there were benefits, you asked for benefits besides cost and appearance. I didn't come up with any significant ones (vegan label isn't significant).  So what? You didn't prove me wrong in anything, I said there were benefits and by your own statement you admit there were benefits. Why are you trying to turn that into an argument? No need to derail another thread, just post your thoughts on the proposed ban.

 

You don't make sense. How would I admit I know of no benefit of artificial colors beyond cost and appearance when I just listed the benefit of being labeled vegan? Why not just accept that and move on with the discussion instead of some desperate attempt at scoring some sort of irrelevant win? You going to hold up your statement that the only benefit is appearance and cost as some sort of trophy or triumph over me? 

I said there were benefits, you asked for benefits besides cost and appearance. I didn't come up with any specific ones (vegan label isn't significant).  So what? You didn't prove me wrong in anything, I said there were benefits and by your own statement you admit there were benefits. Why are you trying to turn that into an argument? No need to derail another thread, just post your thoughts on the proposed ban.

 

We can also label artificial colors "nuclear deterrence" and since no nukes have been released toward another country, it must work.

Of course there are benefits to artificial colors.  Like cost and presentation.  But outside of those, I don't know of any. Which is why I specifically said besides those 2, what are the benefits.  Then you made up some random vegan thing to try to find a way instead of just stating "IDK of any benefits outside of those 2". See how simple things are.  And seeming how long it took you, that would imply that you didn't know of any and needed time to try to find something.

Besides, your vegan statement still doesn't matter cause it affects color/presentation anyways.  So it's still a poor example.

We can also label artificial colors "nuclear deterrence" and since no nukes have been released toward another country, it must work.

Of course there are benefits to artificial colors.  Like cost and presentation.  But outside of those, I don't know of any. Which is why I specifically said besides those 2, what are the benefits.  Then you made up some random vegan thing to try to find a way instead of just stating "IDK of any benefits outside of those 2". See how simple things are.  And seeming how long it took you, that would imply that you didn't know of any and needed time to try to find something.

Besides, your vegan statement still doesn't matter cause it affects color/presentation anyways.  So it's still a poor example.

Nuclear deterrence? Are you having a Joe Biden moment?

What are you even trying to argue? I am not trying to "get out" of anything. I specifically said "I am not sure what, if any, other benefits there are than cost and color." I then threw in the vegan label as an example of a very minor benefit for the sake of technical accuracy.

Nuclear deterrence? Are you having a Joe Biden moment?

What are you even trying to argue? I am not trying to "get out" of anything. I specifically said "I am not sure what, if any, other benefits there are than cost and color." I then threw in the vegan label as an example of a very minor benefit for the sake of technical accuracy.

Since you're not sure and you're unable to post any, you should retract your statement. "There are no benefits to artificial coloring besides color and presentation". It's very simple. Your examples are like usual poor ones.

What's a Joe Biden moment?

Since you're not sure and you're unable to post any, you should retract your statement. "There are no benefits to artificial coloring besides color and presentation". It's very simple. Your examples are like usual poor ones.

What's a Joe Biden moment?

I did post one. You should get your memory checked.
You never qualified how good it had to be, you only say it is a bad example in the face of me proving you wrong. Guess you can't admit that huh?

I did post one. You should get your memory checked.
You never qualified how good it had to be, you only say it is a bad example in the face of me proving you wrong. Guess you can't admit that huh?

Wrong. hahhahaa Thanks for playing.

Wrong. hahhahaa Thanks for playing.

Keep telling yourself that, one of these days you will catch me saying something wrong.

Keep telling yourself that, one of these days you will catch me saying something wrong.

Everyone knows this but you.