1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics (Read 24594 times)

drck1000

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #60 on: November 18, 2019, 12:06:14 PM »
NF ATACR?  :worship:

Which mount are you using?
Geissele extended mount. Ended up needing the extended version to get the eye relief I wanted.

new guy

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #61 on: December 05, 2019, 03:59:28 PM »
Nice.

Did you go with 1.54 or 1.93 height?

How much did it weigh?

Mahalo!
Your mindset is your primary weapon. - Jeff Cooper

drck1000

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #62 on: December 05, 2019, 04:33:08 PM »
Nice.

Did you go with 1.54 or 1.93 height?

How much did it weigh?

Mahalo!
The standard height.  The tall height mounts (1.93" and 2.04") are only for the 30 mm tubes.  Or at least that I found when I was shopping around.  Ended up with the extended length and 0 MOA cant as recommended by Geissele. 

Which reminds me, I actually have a standard length one that I ordered when it was on sale and the extended was on backorder.  The extended ended up coming in before the optic, so ended up working out.  Good thing too because needed the extended length to get the desired eye relief.  Now I have an extra mount for a 34 mm optic.  Haha

I didn't weigh the optic and/or mount, but the combo is heavy.  Or at least heavier (by 1 lb) than my setups with just red dot. 

Will be doing more testing with various ammo combinations.  I'm pretty hyped based on what I've seen with the ammo that I've tested so far though. 

new guy

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #63 on: December 05, 2019, 05:23:14 PM »
Thanks for the info, brother.

NF ATACR 1-8 weighs 21oz, and from what I could find, Geissele mount weighs 7.2oz, so overall weight looks like 28.2oz, on paper.

I'm awaiting a Kahles K16i (16.9oz) and Scalarworks 1.93" Leap mount (5.4oz) so that should put overall weight at 22.3oz, but with 2x less magnification.

From what I've read, it sounds like 1.93 will place the center of your optic at the same height as an EOtech EXPS... hope I don't end up regretting the taller mount!
Your mindset is your primary weapon. - Jeff Cooper

drck1000

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #64 on: December 05, 2019, 08:32:00 PM »
Thanks for the info, brother.

NF ATACR 1-8 weighs 21oz, and from what I could find, Geissele mount weighs 7.2oz, so overall weight looks like 28.2oz, on paper.

I'm awaiting a Kahles K16i (16.9oz) and Scalarworks 1.93" Leap mount (5.4oz) so that should put overall weight at 22.3oz, but with 2x less magnification.

From what I've read, it sounds like 1.93 will place the center of your optic at the same height as an EOtech EXPS... hope I don't end up regretting the taller mount!
Kahles K16i has some really good reviews.  I believe Garand Thumb and Sage Dynamics.  The Kahles and Vortex Razor HD were on my shortlist.  I also considered the S&B Short Dot and USO 1-8.  The last two were pretty hard to find in stock.  The Kahles somewhat as well. 

There were a number of reasons I went with the NF and performance at 1x red dot was really high up there.  The Vortex was similar weight to the NF.  I was concerned about weight, but not a big factor when I was deciding which to buy.  If I had shot my current setup before buying, I might have factored weight higher.  Haha

My red dots are lower 1/3, so I was interested in the 1.93" height for the mount.  I decided early on to go with the Geissele mount.  After shooting my setup, I think I would be good with the higher mount.  While the height is ok, I sometimes found myself sort of having to have a lower cheekweld to get the clear edge-to-edge view when shooting the NF, especially at 8x.  1x was more forgiving. 

I'd bet that you'll be happy with the Kahles.  Please update here once you complete your LPVO setup.   :thumbsup:

new guy

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #65 on: December 05, 2019, 11:42:23 PM »
will do.

my search resulted in the same 3 lpvos you mentioned, plus the Steiner P4Xi, Leupold Mk 6, and Minox ZP8.

i wanted good illumination, durability, but glass clarity, weight, eye box, and fov (and cost, of course!) were my biggest concerns, so I ended up ordering the Kahles w/ SM1 reticle.

i like your setup; ATACR was a close second, and the Geissele mounts sound like they are bombproof, and i like their aesthetics.

we should do a side-by-side comparison, just to compare thoughts, after i get squared away.  :shaka:
Your mindset is your primary weapon. - Jeff Cooper

drck1000

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #66 on: December 06, 2019, 11:12:15 AM »
will do.

my search resulted in the same 3 lpvos you mentioned, plus the Steiner P4Xi, Leupold Mk 6, and Minox ZP8.

i wanted good illumination, durability, but glass clarity, weight, eye box, and fov (and cost, of course!) were my biggest concerns, so I ended up ordering the Kahles w/ SM1 reticle.

i like your setup; ATACR was a close second, and the Geissele mounts sound like they are bombproof, and i like their aesthetics.

we should do a side-by-side comparison, just to compare thoughts, after i get squared away.  :shaka:
Ahh. Yeah, the Leupold MK6 was high up there too. I think the reticle mostly ended up turning me away. I was looking for similar, with 1x red dot performance one of the highest.

If I didn’t just spend a bunch on other stuff, I’d be tempted to put together another LPVO upper with a Kahles or Vortex. Haha. I have a lower that is “needing” and upper.

Ya, side-by-side would be awesome.

jase90

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #67 on: December 09, 2019, 03:05:36 PM »
Christmas came early for me.

drck1000

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #68 on: December 09, 2019, 03:17:57 PM »
Christmas came early for me.
Nice!  I have that same leveling tool, but the Geissele mount has a tapered section below the scope body that didn't leave enough room.  So I ended up using bubble levels. 

How do you like it so far?  I think I might try more ammo testing on mine this weekend.

jase90

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #69 on: December 09, 2019, 03:33:00 PM »
Nice!  I have that same leveling tool, but the Geissele mount has a tapered section below the scope body that didn't leave enough room.  So I ended up using bubble levels. 

How do you like it so far?  I think I might try more ammo testing on mine this weekend.

The Arisaka Leveling Wedge was amazing. With the rifle level the Arisaka Wedge got the level bubble dead center. Nightforce did a great job keeping everything on the same plane. I might drop a plumb bob later to double check the reticle, cause I'm OCD lol.

I'm lucky Larue gave me a flat surface under the rings. I've heard not all scope bases can't use the wedge because some having beveled edges or slanted spines. I didn't even take that into account when I bought the mount. I lucked out.

I haven't shot with the optic yet, only the irons on the rifle. I can't wait to zero it. The glass is ridiculously clear. Like ACOG clear. The edges of the picture are crazy crisp. It's like putting on prescription glasses. The clarity carries all the way to max magnification too. Which is something I'm not used to. I've never dropped this much dough on glass before so I'm stoked with the quality.

drck1000

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #70 on: December 09, 2019, 03:52:16 PM »
The Arisaka Leveling Wedge was amazing. With the rifle level the Arisaka Wedge got the level bubble dead center. Nightforce did a great job keeping everything on the same plane. I might drop a plumb bob later to double check the reticle, cause I'm OCD lol.

I'm lucky Larue gave me a flat surface under the rings. I've heard not all scope bases can't use the wedge because some having beveled edges or slanted spines. I didn't even take that into account when I bought the mount. I lucked out.

I haven't shot with the optic yet, only the irons on the rifle. I can't wait to zero it. The glass is ridiculously clear. Like ACOG clear. The edges of the picture are crazy crisp. It's like putting on prescription glasses. The clarity carries all the way to max magnification too. Which is something I'm not used to. I've never dropped this much dough on glass before so I'm stoked with the quality.
Regarding the wedge, yeah.  When I got started with the Geissele mount, I was like "wtf! The wedge isn't gonna fit".   >:(  :(  ;D  It did take me quite a while until I got the rifle and optic level to where I was happy.  My bubble levels weren't as fine as I would have wanted.  I ended up mounting the scope for a class that I had not planned for, so just went with it.  I may do more checking later as well.  I did some visual verification of the levelness/plumbness and it seems ok. 

I hear ya on the price.  The optic was one of the most expensive single item that I have.  I only have a Vortex Viper PST to compare this against, but very different applications.  That said, I probably will end up taking both to the range to compare.  They overlap in the 4-8x range. 

There were a couple of LPVOs at the rifle class that I went to recently.  I believe one was a Vortex Strike Eagle and another might have been Primary Arms (I think in the $200-300 range).  I didn't get to try either, but both looked through mine and said that clarity was noticeably better.  To the point where the guy with the Vortex said he's gonna upgrade to the NF.  I was gonna try a less expensive one to start with, but ended up going for the gusto on this one. 

Looking forward to hearing what your thoughts are after you get to shoot it!  Have to compare notes with new guy as well with his Kahles. 

macsak

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #71 on: December 09, 2019, 04:24:49 PM »
Christmas came early for me.

nice
what cal.?

jase90

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #72 on: December 09, 2019, 05:29:00 PM »
nice
what cal.?

.308
Make: Patriot Ordnance Factory
Model: Revolution DI

I'm looking to get their 6.5 Creedmoor upper next year also.

jase90

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #73 on: December 09, 2019, 06:53:49 PM »
Regarding the wedge, yeah.  When I got started with the Geissele mount, I was like "wtf! The wedge isn't gonna fit".   >:(  :(  ;D  It did take me quite a while until I got the rifle and optic level to where I was happy.  My bubble levels weren't as fine as I would have wanted.  I ended up mounting the scope for a class that I had not planned for, so just went with it.  I may do more checking later as well.  I did some visual verification of the levelness/plumbness and it seems ok. 

I hear ya on the price.  The optic was one of the most expensive single item that I have.  I only have a Vortex Viper PST to compare this against, but very different applications.  That said, I probably will end up taking both to the range to compare.  They overlap in the 4-8x range. 

There were a couple of LPVOs at the rifle class that I went to recently.  I believe one was a Vortex Strike Eagle and another might have been Primary Arms (I think in the $200-300 range).  I didn't get to try either, but both looked through mine and said that clarity was noticeably better.  To the point where the guy with the Vortex said he's gonna upgrade to the NF.  I was gonna try a less expensive one to start with, but ended up going for the gusto on this one. 

Looking forward to hearing what your thoughts are after you get to shoot it!  Have to compare notes with new guy as well with his Kahles.

I have a Vortex Strike Eagle 1-6 on my cheap PSA 556 build and a Trijicon ACOG on another POF but in 556 chambering.

My biggest complaint about the Strike Eagle was the edge distortions as you slowly move up the magnification spectrum. The glass is clear at 1X but as I turn the mag up the edges start to distort eventually creeping it's way almost all the way to the edges of the reticle at 6X. Shootable at 6X but anything on the sides of the reticle is warped and distorted. Apples to oranges though, and not really fair cause I'm comparing a $400 optic to a $2000+ one lol.

The ATACR is like a Trijicon ACOG with variable magnification. It makes life so much brighter than it actually is. The Nightforce is like a vacuum for light, even during dusk it's just soaks up so much ambient light and gives you such a clear picture. It's hard to explain lol.

I never thought I'd buy an optic of this class but figured since this was my only .308 rifle I'd give it something that allowed me to squeeze the most potential out of the round while still having close range utility.

It was between the Nightforce ATACR or the Trijicon VCOG when I was choosing and optic. I liked the rugged housing of the VCOG but the reticle and the ability to zero out the turrets on the Nightforce was what sold me.

I would like to replace the Strike Eagle on my PSA one day with a Trijicon Accupower 1-8 and compare that to the Nightforce. I'm interested to see how much better or if it's even better than the LPVOs in the $1000 - $1500 range.

I'll definitely let you know how great or not great she shoots when I get her to the range.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2019, 07:52:48 PM by jase90 »

Bota-CS1

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #74 on: December 09, 2019, 07:43:52 PM »
What do you guys prefer in your LVPOs?  First or second focal plane and why?

I started off using second focal plane LVPOs and found their Aimpoint-like brightness to be a huge plus, I found shooting at a power that the LVPO wasn't zero'd under made things more challenging. It was easy to hold-off to compensate, but I found that I didn't want my POI obscured especially if I'd zero'd the optic at 100 and was shooting at 50 or closer.
No one is coming, it’s up to us.

Legislation should never be about depriving law abiding citizens of something, but rather taking those things away from criminals.

drck1000

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #75 on: December 10, 2019, 05:14:05 PM »
I have a Vortex Strike Eagle 1-6 on my cheap PSA 556 build and a Trijicon ACOG on another POF but in 556 chambering.

My biggest complaint about the Strike Eagle was the edge distortions as you slowly move up the magnification spectrum. The glass is clear at 1X but as I turn the mag up the edges start to distort eventually creeping it's way almost all the way to the edges of the reticle at 6X. Shootable at 6X but anything on the sides of the reticle is warped and distorted. Apples to oranges though, and not really fair cause I'm comparing a $400 optic to a $2000+ one lol.

The ATACR is like a Trijicon ACOG with variable magnification. It makes life so much brighter than it actually is. The Nightforce is like a vacuum for light, even during dusk it's just soaks up so much ambient light and gives you such a clear picture. It's hard to explain lol.

I never thought I'd buy an optic of this class but figured since this was my only .308 rifle I'd give it something that allowed me to squeeze the most potential out of the round while still having close range utility.

It was between the Nightforce ATACR or the Trijicon VCOG when I was choosing and optic. I liked the rugged housing of the VCOG but the reticle and the ability to zero out the turrets on the Nightforce was what sold me.

I would like to replace the Strike Eagle on my PSA one day with a Trijicon Accupower 1-8 and compare that to the Nightforce. I'm interested to see how much better or if it's even better than the LPVOs in the $1000 - $1500 range.

I'll definitely let you know how great or not great she shoots when I get her to the range.
The edge to edge clarity is also what the guy who had one mentioned.  I should have tried his optic to see for myself. 

I also wasn't considering spending as much as I did when I started looking at LPVOs.  I think my initial ceiling was the Vortex Razor HD.  That said, I would still like to try a side-by-side with the scopes in that price range.  I was actually really close to getting the Vortex Razor HD and then my search when on hold for a bit.  I am sure I'd be happy with the Vortex Razor HD.  Or even others in that price range or lower.  However, now that I went with the NF first, I dunno.   ;D

drck1000

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #76 on: December 10, 2019, 05:30:42 PM »
What do you guys prefer in your LVPOs?  First or second focal plane and why?

I started off using second focal plane LVPOs and found their Aimpoint-like brightness to be a huge plus, I found shooting at a power that the LVPO wasn't zero'd under made things more challenging. It was easy to hold-off to compensate, but I found that I didn't want my POI obscured especially if I'd zero'd the optic at 100 and was shooting at 50 or closer.
I have two rifle optics and both are FFP.  However, truth be told, most of the capabilities and advantages of FFP reticles are largely lost/wasted on me as I either don't really utilize their features or use them as intended.  For the LPVO, I don't use the reticle for ranging, or at least not really yet.  I have used the ranging capability with the Vortex Viper on my Rem 700, but I can't say that is a feature that I would say that I need for that gun.  For that gun since I'm typically shooting paper at known distances.  I have played around with the ranging aspect of the reticle, but that's about it. 

I chose the NF for a bunch of other reasons, no really for FFP.  I really liked the fact that the red dot was 0.35 MOA at 1x and it's transition to 8x to similar to an EoTech reticle along with the elevation and windage holds was interesting.  That said, the eye box forgiveness, red dot-like capability at 1x, proven durability, and optical clarity were the driving features for me. 

Regarding optical clarify, I recall reading about differences between FFP and SFP, but I can't recall exactly the takeaways right now.  I just recall it was a thread on Sniper's Hide where they were comparing the NF to the "usual suspects" of competitors.  A rep from NF ended up chiming in and gave come background on some reasonings behind the whys of the NF, and that included some interesting discussion on FFP reticle of the NF. 

Lots of folks also recommend based on intended purpose.  Many hunters appear to swear one way (I forget which one, but I assume FFP), and I've seen many 3-gun guys mention preference for SFP.   I wasn't interested in either, but I would say 3-gun probably closer to what I "could" envision using my gun with LPVO for. 

new guy

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #77 on: December 14, 2019, 10:54:05 AM »
Love the reticle (EOtech-ish), brightness, and FOV on the Kahles K16i.

Disappointed that, when I dropped it on the scale, it weighs 17.8 oz instead of the 16.9 oz that it was advertised at.

Scalarworks mount (1.93") is also a bit heavier (5.89 oz) than what I thought the website was advertising, but upon review, I noted that the advertised weight pertains to the low mount.

Mount is awesome because it has a built-in leveling screw to decrease time involved with leveling the optic.

... more to come!  :shaka:
Your mindset is your primary weapon. - Jeff Cooper

drck1000

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #78 on: December 17, 2019, 08:14:06 PM »
Love the reticle (EOtech-ish), brightness, and FOV on the Kahles K16i.

Disappointed that, when I dropped it on the scale, it weighs 17.8 oz instead of the 16.9 oz that it was advertised at.

Scalarworks mount (1.93") is also a bit heavier (5.89 oz) than what I thought the website was advertising, but upon review, I noted that the advertised weight pertains to the low mount.

Mount is awesome because it has a built-in leveling screw to decrease time involved with leveling the optic.

... more to come!  :shaka:
Awesome!

Was just checking out the combos with optics that they are offering in the Scalarworks site (similar to combos by Geissele and LaRue) and the pricing looks really good. If they had them in stock tho...

Sucks that the actual weight came out more than you thought. If I were to try another LPVO setup, I’d look to trim some weight off.

Looking forward to seeing how you like it!

new guy

Re: 1-8x (or 1-6x) Optics
« Reply #79 on: January 05, 2020, 01:03:13 AM »
Rumor and innuendo:

Vortex Razor HD Gen III, 1-10x LPVO; 21.5oz; 10.1" long; 3.6" eye relief; 34mm tube.

Hope someone can validate and report back from SS 2020!  :thumbsup:
Your mindset is your primary weapon. - Jeff Cooper