2aHawaii
General Topics => Preparedness and Survival => Topic started by: aieahound on September 05, 2013, 10:45:45 AM
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This came up in the classifieds.
I did a search and couldn't find anything so I thought I start a new topic.
What's the ideal prepper currency:
- Gold and Silver
- Cash
- Ammunition
- Food items and water
- Fuel
- TP
- Other
Trying to figure out the poll thing.
Edit:
Figured it out but forgot to add fuel. Dammit !
I guess fuel is other.
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http://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=4377.0 (http://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=4377.0)
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http://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=4377.0 (http://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=4377.0)
They shoulda had a poll. :D
Can't find the dang Lock topic button. >:(
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any item that is useful, reusable, can be use for multiple roles, and tradable is good currency for Preppers. :shaka:
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Because of the ability to dupe, make metals, need to weigh currency, calculate purity and communicate - I don't see gold and silver worth shit. Recently on Money talk (on am radio) the financial guys were saying that there is no real reason to invest in gold, as it has such little value to your portfolio - where there are better options.
They also said that, if you were going to do it, having it on hand would be the only way to go.
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any item that is useful, reusable, can be use for multiple roles, and tradable is good currency for Preppers. :shaka:
A woman?
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A woman?
:rofl: your crazy BATMAN.
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alcohol
cigarettes
ammo
fuel
food
water
......in no particular order. can you imagine not having a cigarette and a beer? people would give up their ammo! :D
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I'm going to have to disagree with you on that one, Chris. gold and silver have always been a representation of an individual's or country's wealth. Also considering that there is a limited supply of both gold and silver within the Earth's crust, as well as the demand for such precious metals in various industrial fields, it is incorrect to believe that there's no actual value in such precious metals. Given the economic history of the world since time immemorial, most of the world's currencies I've always been based in precious metals or stones. As such, it would be safe to assume that it is highly possible that the world will revert back currency or Fiat system based on precious metals and precious stones. This information comes from dependable economists, whom do not try to keep the public blind to what is really going on, and whom do not support what is said in mainstream media.
the reason I tend to ignore opinions from mainstream media sources like real money talk is because they are not presenting all the facts and actions taking place around the world. If there was no point to purchasing gold or silver, why are rising countries like China India and Russia buying a thousands of tons Worth of these metals? if they are worth nothing, why did George Soros demand to be paid in gold when he left his last company? The answer is that Rich investors know that when the economy collapses, or when they manipulate the prices at the correct time, everyone is going to dump their gold and silver due to panic. when this happens, I can guarantee you that rich investors, or at least smart ones, will swoop in and buy up all the gold and silver that will flood the market. while I believe in possessing more useful and functional tangible assets, as well as developing vital skills, I won't take the chance to make a killing or protect my financial security by not having any tangible assets based in gold and silver.
I do agree with you in actually possessing the metal, in hand. Silver stocks are worth shit and won't mean anything when the economy tanks. Those of us who remember silver bonds know exactly what I am talking about.
This may have been true throughout history but the Central Banks have had a hand in changing this big time. We have gotten away from precious metals and now rely on fake paper currency with no real value. If the economy really collapses, most people will have to resort to basic trade for product and services. Let's face it, gold and silver only have value to those who agree it has value. Why do you think the rich turn to gold? Because they all have agreed that it is valuable. Guess what, when the rubber meets the road, us commoners will prize a loaf of bread or bag of rice much more than an ounce of gold. There are plenty of other metals that are far more limited and far more useful, why are the rich not buying those?
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I have a friend who sorta believes in being prepared... I say "sorta", because he has a stash of gold and silver coins, emergency water, and some Wiser freeze-dried food packs, but no guns whatsoever. I'm not sure what the deal is; he doesn't trust Obama, he isn't anti-2A, he acknowledges that a firearm would best protect his wife & baby, his parents used to shoot, and he's gone shooting with me numerous times. He's even mentioned how ammo would be worth investing in since you can buy it without a permit and its value has double or even tripled recently. Unless he had a run-in with the law, which I doubt, I don't see why he doesn't have at least a shotgun for HD. If the world goes to Hell (and I mean really bad, like mass looting and no order whatsoever), I think your gold and silver will be worthless. I didn't know why people rushed out to get beer, toilet paper, and diapers every time we had a tsunami warning until I remembered that the vast majority of people here aren't prepared for even a small scale disaster.
Seriously, we're on an island in the middle of nowhere that is prone to volcanic activity, hurricanes, earthquakes, and tsunami... but I guess when you're getting checks from the government on the regular, that Vizio flat screen TV at WalMart can take priority...
As for KingKeoni's suggestion, it reminded me of this clip from "Spies Like Us"... at around the 1:03 mark... ;D
Spies Like Us - Whats a Dickfer? Chevy Chase & Dan Aykroyd (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eB8sG4smWbo#)
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This may have been true throughout history but the Central Banks have had a hand in changing this big time. We have gotten away from precious metals and now rely on fake paper currency with no real value. If the economy really collapses, most people will have to resort to basic trade for product and services. Let's face it, gold and silver only have value to those who agree it has value. Why do you think the rich turn to gold? Because they all have agreed that it is valuable. Guess what, when the rubber meets the road, us commoners will prize a loaf of bread or bag of rice much more than an ounce of gold. There are plenty of other metals that are far more limited and far more useful, why are the rich not buying those?
There it is. Those other metals aren't widely recognized or even generally available whereas you can go nearly anywhere in the world and exchange say a gold sovereign into goods or whatever local currency or vice versa. Same can be said of diamonds which the rich also convert their digital or paper fiat into for the long haul. It is not easy to forge gold with fake composition though salted bars and rounds can fool (if you stick to known minted coins a simple plastic tool and pocket scale detects fakes quickly and easily). I can't remember all the wanted properties of "real money" but some were: recognizable, concentrated value, transportable, fungible, easily divisable, durable. Barrels of oil sure are hard to store and carry around :) Stocks can go to zero. I bet them radio guys were paper pushers no doubt.
re: Central banks I'd say the opposite is true, the gold they're still buying and hoarding by the ton is the final ultimate insurance policy against ever inflating fiat & never ending political turmoil. oh to have such problems.
oops, re-reading, Q and Bud gets it.
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My goodness mr Q!
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My answer was ammo.
;D
Second choice was TP, for my bunghole. :rofl: :rofl:
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you can use leaves for your bunghole
you cannot use leaves for ammo
http://2ahawaii.com/Smileys/extended/evil.gif (http://2ahawaii.com/Smileys/extended/evil.gif)
My answer was ammo.
;D
Second choice was TP, for my bunghole. :rofl: :rofl:
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you can use leaves for your bunghole
you cannot use leaves for ammo
>:D (http://>:D)
but they will cover the punji stick pit for food. but then you will have to poop eventually. hmmm.
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Good one Q.
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We have to be real in this situation. The economy, and country for that matter, is not going to go apocalyptic overnight. I highlighted an article a few months ago that is basically the outline many of my economist friends presented to me. If you want a modern example of what will happen, look at the weeks and months following the collapse of the Soviet Union, or the crisis in Argentina.
*here is the article : http://www.absolutesurvivalist.com/1/post/2013/06/the-inevitable-collapse-in-simple-terms-and-what-you-will-need.html (http://www.absolutesurvivalist.com/1/post/2013/06/the-inevitable-collapse-in-simple-terms-and-what-you-will-need.html) *
In this sense, yes; it is the rich and powerful who have determined that gold and silver has, based on their perceived intrinsic value. However, it is also these same individuals who, presumably, control most of the services and produced goods we need, and both of these metals, particularly silver, has an extreme demand within the industrial realm. As such, the demand for such metals by these individuals will rise, which will then allow other individuals who possess the metal to trade it in for the goods they need. This is why people believe that once the current fiat currency fails, a new one will arise after the ashes have cleared, which will be based on hard, in-demand assets such as gold and silver; just like it used to be.
Yes, commoners will value necessities in the beginning stages. But after a while, you don't want to live like a commoner. We, as human beings, seek to find the simplest life we can, and I can tell you first hand that having to bust your ass all day, every day is not the life many of us would want to live. If there is a possible way to ensure and/or improve your financial security, so that don't have to struggle as much as the next person, why not take the chance and invest in a few ounces? That is why I believe in investing in some precious metals, as people who have done quite well for themselves have recommended to do so.
With regards to the metals you are talking about, I assume you are talking about metals such as Palladium and Platinum? If so, its simple; they have limited general industrial uses compared to silver, and are not as rare as gold. Although metals like Platinum and Palladium have many uses, they do not have the multiple applicable uses that silver has, such as it's natural antibacterial properties; i.e. people using silver coins in their milk to extend its shelf life and prevent bacterial growth. Compared to gold, both these metals have ~ >.010 abundance within the earth's crust, where as gold has ~ > .0010 abundance within the earth's crust. It is basic human psychology that when the supply of something is limited, the demand goes up. You must also understand that if the economy fails, most mechanical industries that utilize Platinum and Palladium have the possibility of failing as well, making these metals useless.
Essentially it boils down to this: silver and gold will be worth something to the people in power, and you can use your investments in these metals to trade for things that are of value to you. I suggest reading the article I provided above, as I use that as the template recommended to me by people I wholeheartedly trust on the issue. :shaka:
What I got out of that particular article is that gold and silver are only moderately useful in the scenario presented. My argument is if I have the choice to invest in hard goods (food, ammo, etc.) or gold and silver, guess what? Not going to be gold and silver for me. In a pinch (as mentioned in the article) I will be able to trade my hard goods for not only other goods, but gold and silver as well. An when the gold and silver dry up (as it says it will in the article), I will still have food (if I have prepared properly). If, however, the govt turns on us (as mentioned) or there is lawlessness, then of course I may lose everything (whether it be hard goods or gold and silver). I understand that this one article is not the end all on the subject, but I am just responding in regards to the provided article for the sake of the discussion. For me it is simple, basic necessities will be worth far more than any gold, silver or dollar. The rich can eat their gold while I have food. How much gold have you personally invested in (this is not meant to offend, just the question I always ask anyone who tells me to invest in gold and silver)?
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The value of anything is based on supply and demand.
On an island, the supply is always at risk.
Again, on an island, the worth of an item depends on demand. In a long term SHTF situation, any currency or precious metal will have limited demand. Survival will be the first order of business.
You can't eat money or gold. Some may speculate the bad situation will be short-lived and try to gouge buyers who want whatever the seller has to sell. That won't work long-term. At some point, the seller will need to buy things HE needs, and the currency won't have value.
All the items that have a real purpose in a SHTF situation (food, water, and medicine top the list) will become more valuable as the supply dwindles.
It's all about speculation. Whatever you "hoard" to survive, it should be useful to you AND to others, and have a good chance of becoming scarce at some point.
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alcohol
cigarettes
ammo
fuel
food
water
......in no particular order. can you imagine not having a cigarette and a beer? people would give up their ammo! :D
and i forgot seeds for crops.......just in case. my frig is full of them. ;)
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All good mr Q!
Is that a good OMG or a bad OMG :'(
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Gold and silver will have no value if society no longer functions, there are killing in the streets ala zombie apocalypse style.
However, gold and silver will retain its value as an alternative currency, if society still functions but the fiat paper currency has lost its value Zimbabwe dollar style. Those that hold precious metals and commodities will still retain some value of their assets while those that hold only paper currency will all of a sudden become very very poor.
Any future collapse will more likely be the latter where an economic collapse is felt first. The more a community or society is prepared and continues to function despite the economic collapse, the less vulnerable the society is and the less likely an economic collapse leads into a zombie apocalypse scenario. At that point, it would be more like the former.
In essence, having gold and silver for an alternative currency is good. The more people in a community are prepared for the currency failing, the more likely society continues to function and social anarchy averted. I agree that silver is actually a better currency than gold because you can use silver to buy day to day items while gold might be harder to "get change" for. I can easily buy $30 worth of groceries using a silver oz than buy $30 worth of groceries using a gold oz. The more silver there is in circulation, the hardier a community and society becomes against monetary collapse.
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This is Hawai`i, how is SPAM & WHITE RICE not on the top of everybody's list.
Have you experienced a SPAM n RICE sale at Walmart? WOW
SPAM
White rice
Bud light
we'll forage the rest
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Sticking just to the currency topic, paper dollars will be very important in the beginning of a catastrophic scenario. Problem being is that few will have a lot of cash on hand. Getting more cash from banks who really don't keep that much on hand will probably be compounded with probable bank closures or glitches in the computer systems will make getting more cash very difficult. So if an event occurs, buy off as much as possible with paper dollars while it is still being exchanged. If / when paper dollars become meaningless precious metals such as gold and silver will more than likely become the standard. Again metals should be used strategically just like paper dollars were until they went extinct. Depending the extent of the scenario, over an extended period of time precious metals may become less important as bartering items, so use the metals up wisely to leverage yourself correctly. Also don't think that you will just get away with bartering items. That will take a long time before it becomes the norm. Paper dollars and metals will need to go by the wayside and by then, it may be too long to get by your initial survival time. Bottom line, those without cash and without precious metals on hand had best be very well prepared prior to an event as they will not have the ability to do much as far as purchasing goes until paper money and precious metals become meaningless and that could last a good deal of time, much longer than most people prep for. Think of being prepared in phases and the ability to positively leverage yourself during those phases to maximize your time is what one should be doing. A good amount of cash and metals on hand, in easily traded denominations or amounts. A big bar of silver or gold or all hundred dollar bills is not as ideal as smaller increments as making change is not as realistic. Don't put all of your eggs in one basket. Being diverse gives one a much better outlook to survive.
Also when it comes to trading weapons and ammo, be careful. There might be those who figure out that you have a lot of it and might want to come after it. Heaven forbid one of your own weapons and / or ammo that you traded is used against you. I do not suggest bartering for these items if it is avoidable.
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