2aHawaii
General Topics => General Discussion => Topic started by: BLKDRGN on September 10, 2013, 10:25:05 PM
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Can we clean our guns in an open garage? Is it legal?
Edit: Let me clarify, not pointing as in aiming at someone walking by. Just cleaning your barrel or something but they think you are pointing it at them. Maybe even just carrying your weapon in your open garage, they can visually see you holding it but not aiming it at them. Will cops take everything away from you and you have to prove it in court or will they say you are on private property so they can't do anything or at least without a warrant?
Reason why I ask is I wouldn't mind from time to time take a gun outside and spray it down in the driveway or go to a friends house and have a cleaning party in his garage. I want to try Balisol one day but for sure I'm not going to spray that in my house.
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Serious question. What do you think would happen if you were to point the gun towards the street and a person walks by. That person then calls the police on you. Do you think you would be arrested and your guns taken away until you prove you were just cleaning the guns?
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Just wondering why you think that would be illegal? As for pointing the gun at an open street with people, that's your responsibility lol
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Just wondering why you think that would be illegal? As for pointing the gun at an open street with people, that's your responsibility lol
I don't know the all the laws regarding guns. Is it legal because it's private property? With that being the case can I set up targets at my house and legally shoot them? Just wondering if anyone heard of a stranger turning them in for seeing someone hold a gun out in the open on their own property?
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#1 - why do you want just anybody walking by the property to see what kind & how many guns you own while cleaning?
#2 - you can clean the guns anywhere on your own property.
#3 - the neighbors have the right to report you to the COPS if they feel the need.
#4 - talking to the neighbors to explain you'll be cleaning guns outside for better ventilation could prevent misunderstandings and false alarms that waste the COP's time.
#5 - Consider certain scenarios. If you have to run into the house for something, can you take them all into the house quickly? Is there a chance a gun could be taken if you run in for another adult beverage? Maybe by a minor? That could be a crime, improperly storing firearms where minors can get to them unsupervised.
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I don't know the all the laws regarding guns. Is it legal because it's private property? With that being the case can I set up targets at my house and legally shoot them? Just wondering if anyone heard of a stranger turning them in for seeing someone hold a gun out in the open on their own property?
There is a law regarding shooting within city limits not sure of exact wording
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I'm no lawyer but shooting your firearms, even on your own property, could be viewed as reckless endangerment especially if there are homes, dwellings, or a city street in the general direction which you'd be shooting. The 4th rule comes to mind in this scenario...be sure of your target and what's beyond it.
If you're worried about the fumes and stuff have you thought about cleaning your stuff at the range? I used to before the days of non-toxic bio-friendly cleaning solutions.
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There is a law regarding shooting within city limits not sure of exact wording
...not sure about Oahu county, but on the big island, there's nothing said in HRS or common law about 'city limits'. Rather, the language prohibits discharging a firearm in a 'residential area'. What is that? They don't define it for a reason. And it is not - as many mistakenly assume - determined by the "Agricultural" or "Residential" zoning of your property. It's all up to the responding officer's discretion if a complaint is called in. If the responding officer feels that the area in which you were discharging your firearm is a residential area then he can arrest you and sequester your weapons, among other things. The next consideration, if you get arrested, is whether or not the prosecutor wants to bring charges against you. That would involve the prosecutor going to your property and making an assessment of the environment in which you were discharging a firearm. If they feel that you were generally too close to a neighbors home or that the direction in which you were shooting was unsafe - relative to the location of the neighbors home or what is or isn't beyond where you were shooting - then they will file charges. Other prosecutorial considerations are firearm type, power, bullet type, natural backstop or not, amount of undeveloped land downrange, etc. Once again this is relatively arbitrary and completely up to the discretion of the prosecutor. However, I would imagine with fair certainty that if what precipitated the officer visiting your property was a neighbor complaining that they heard a bullet HIT, or suddenly saw a bullet ON their property while you were shooting, you will surely get arrested. It's always a gamble, but you can minimize the possibility of getting in trouble if you consider all these things and act wisely.
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it's just like carrying in your own house. if someone can see you with a gun, its probally illegal and you can be reported. chances are if someone is scared enough, they may dispatch swat to knock down your door! why not try to open carry and see what happens? why insist on tempting the police to shoot you? don't you realize where you live? This isn't a free state like Arizona (god damn I did enjoy living there).
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I clean my guns in my garage. I have the door half way shut though. I m not worried about legal ramifications, I just don't want everyone who passes by to see what I have. Same reason I don't invite strangers into my house. Most thieves know what's in a house before they break in.
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Serious question. What do you think would happen if you were to point the gun towards the street and a person walks by. That person then calls the police on you. Do you think you would be arrested and your guns taken away until you prove you were just cleaning the guns?
play stupid games, win stupid prizes. You already know what would happen. :wave:
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play stupid games, win stupid prizes. You already know what would happen. :wave:
Let me clarify, not pointing as in aiming at someone walking by. Just cleaning your barrel or something but they think you are pointing it at them. Maybe even just carrying your weapon in your open garage, they can visually see you holding it but not aiming it at them. Will cops take everything away from you and you have to prove it in court or will they say you are on private property so they can't do anything or at least without a warrant?
Reason why I ask is I wouldn't mind from time to time take a gun outside and spray it down in the driveway or go to a friends house and have a cleaning party in his garage. I want to try Balisol one day but for sure I'm not going to spray that in my house.
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play stupid games, win stupid prizes. You already know what would happen. :wave:
Hahahaha :rofl: and why would u be pointing it at the street anyways. my theory out of sight out of mind
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It would be wise to not allow your neighbors or those passing by to see your firearms. You never know who is a criminal. Many criminals also work on opportunity and you've just shown them that you own a firearm so they may make a future "appointment" to steal your stuff (without your knowledge, of course).
If you need to clean your stuff outside, get a cardboard box that's larger than your rifle or pistol. To clean your rifle in this large cardboard box, cut a hole on the side so you can insert your cleaning rod. You can use this same large box to easily clean your pistol. This technique allows you to conceal your rifle/pistol from those near your property.
Again, if you don't let people know what you have, then they won't know exactly what to steal from you.
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id worry more about people knowing you have firearms and trying to take them while youre not home.. oops repeated what was above lol
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Serious question. What do you think would happen if you were to point the gun towards the street and a person walks by. That person then calls the police on you. Do you think you would be arrested and your guns taken away until you prove you were just cleaning the guns?
It depends on the person, but it can be interpreted as a threat/harassment..or maybe not. It is really not a yes or no answer. Personally, I wouldn't do it though.
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Hmm, maybe it's best to take up a table at the range and clean my guns there. >:D
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Hmm, maybe it's best to take up a table at the range and clean my guns there. >:D
lol, don't do that...
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lol, don't do that...
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My friends and I used to clean our guns at the range all the time. You do it right at the firing line. Nothing wrong with that.
As long as you don't point a completely assembled firearm at your neighbor.
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I want to try Balisol one day but for sure I'm not going to spray that in my house.
Is there a reason you wont spray Balistol in your house? Isnt it all natural harm free? Smells weired tho
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Hmm, maybe it's best to take up a table at the range and clean my guns there. >:D
So much stink eye if you do that lol. I used to bring one of those little japanese card table woth the metal wire folding legs. Suppose now it's cheaper just to get those $40 white plastic folding tables from Walmart.
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Can we clean our guns in an open garage? Is it legal?
Edit: Let me clarify, not pointing as in aiming at someone walking by. Just cleaning your barrel or something but they think you are pointing it at them. Maybe even just carrying your weapon in your open garage, they can visually see you holding it but not aiming it at them. Will cops take everything away from you and you have to prove it in court or will they say you are on private property so they can't do anything or at least without a warrant?
Reason why I ask is I wouldn't mind from time to time take a gun outside and spray it down in the driveway or go to a friends house and have a cleaning party in his garage. I want to try Balisol one day but for sure I'm not going to spray that in my house.
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Don't you have cars in your garage? That blocks 90% of the view from the street.
Why would you stain your driveway with black oily gunk?
Ballistol smells good. It's mostly mineral oil and it is non-toxic and bio-degradable.
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My friends and I used to clean our guns at the range all the time. You do it right at the firing line. Nothing wrong with that.
As long as you don't point a completely assembled firearm at your neighbor.
I'm just salty. My friend and I went to the rifle side one early one morning and was on a waiting list. Then sat behind a bunch of guys that shot 3 shots inbetween cease fires and sat and talked story. Then there was a guy that cleaned his gun for about a 1 1/2 hour without even shooting his gun. IMO if you have the ability to clean your gun at home, you should. This wasn't a barrel break in procedure he was doing either. Is there a rule saying you cannot do that? No, but I think that it is rude to do so when there is a long waiting list. Like I stated earlier, this is my personnal opinion. :shaka:
I do clean my guns and reload in the garage, and I carry while I do it. I leave the garage half open and have a industrial type fan mounted to circulate air. Someone would have to lay down in my driveway to get a clear view inside.
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wait what? sorry jacking my own thread. are we supposed to be breaking in our barrels? I've never heard of doing that. I never did that to any of our guns.
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wait what? sorry jacking my own thread. are we supposed to be breaking in our barrels? I've never heard of doing that. I never did that to any of our guns.
I don't do it. I do a initial cleaning prior to use and call it good, some people like to do it to ensure they get the most accuracy out of their new rifle. It's debatable if it is beneficial to do a barrel break in.
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[quote author=ImKu link=topic=10938.msg106992#msg106992 date=1378937658
I do clean my guns and reload in the garage, and I carry while I do it. I leave the garage half open and have a industrial type fan mounted to circulate air. Someone would have to lay down in my driveway to get a clear view inside.
[/quote]
If I understand this correctly, you say you carry while cleaning and reloading? What is the purpose that you would need to carry a gun while cleaning a gun or loading? There may be something I'm not aware of but should I be carrying while I'm cleaning my guns or loading?
BTW, I clean my guns and reload outside my house.
I just need clarification. Is it legal to carry on your own property like that? I've read the the thread Do you home carry. Some do and some don't for personal reasons. I don't carry because there is no need to.
Thanks in advance to anyone who answers my questions.
Aloha
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Guys, go ahead and clean em in the garage but would you just not point the dang barrel outside the garage or at people??? You know not to do that already!
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Guys, go ahead and clean em in the garage but would you just not point the dang barrel outside the garage or at people??? You know not to do that already!
It's not pointing it at people who pass by. It's an open garage as in 3 sides are open with no walls or garage door.
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It's not pointing it at people who pass by. It's an open garage as in 3 sides are open with no walls or garage door.
I think you would be fine. I've cleaned some guns outside before (spraying etc.) no big deal. If you don't make a deal of it, I don't think other people will make a deal of it either. And, like you said, big difference between sitting there cleaning / scrubbing and pointing a gun at someone :P. Only the later will get you screwed.
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If I understand this correctly, you say you carry while cleaning and reloading? What is the purpose that you would need to carry a gun while cleaning a gun or loading? There may be something I'm not aware of but should I be carrying while I'm cleaning my guns or loading?
BTW, I clean my guns and reload outside my house.
I just need clarification. Is it legal to carry on your own property like that? I've read the the thread Do you home carry. Some do and some don't for personal reasons. I don't carry because there is no need to.
Thanks in advance to anyone who answers my questions.
Aloha
I carry on my own property in my garage (attached to the house). Reason I do it is that I do leave the garage door half open. Here's a example: lets say I'm cleaning my guns and some jackwagon thinks it's a good idea to come underneath my garage door for a home invasion and he is armed with gun. There are no exits as I lock myself in (I can use a key to get in the house) the garage to keep the kids out. So, that's why I carry. Chances of something like that happening may be slim to none, but I would rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. I cannot see people passing by (not on a main street) and they cannot see in without laying down on my driveway. I do not home carry otherwise. Only when I have other firearms around or I'm reloading. It may be overkill, but it gives me peace of mind and it is just my preference. As far as the legality of carrying on personal property, I do not have an answer and as I stated I by no means advertise what I am doing or what I have.
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I carry on my own property in my garage (attached to the house). Reason I do it is that I do leave the garage door half open. Here's a example: lets say I'm cleaning my guns and some jackwagon thinks it's a good idea to come underneath my garage door for a home invasion and he is armed with gun. There are no exits as I lock myself in (I can use a key to get in the house) the garage to keep the kids out. So, that's why I carry. Chances of something like that happening may be slim to none, but I would rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. I cannot see people passing by (not on a main street) and they cannot see in without laying down on my driveway. I do not home carry otherwise. Only when I have other firearms around or I'm reloading. It may be overkill, but it gives me peace of mind and it is just my preference. As far as the legality of carrying on personal property, I do not have an answer and as I stated I by no means advertise what I am doing or what I have.
+1
I also carry/reload while I clean my gun in my garage with my door wide open. I do it because I can't legally carry off my property.
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...... As far as the legality of carrying on personal property, I do not have an answer and as I stated I by no means advertise what I am doing or what I have.....
....you can carry loaded firearms on your property.......that was the result of DC v. Heller
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@ImKu, thank you for a real answer. My question could of been taken as a wise @ss type of question. I asked because I was thinking in terms of the possibility of a person coming to my property to solicit. Maybe a person of religious background coming to my door and I approach them with a gun holstered on my person. They may in turn call 911 and I would have to explain why I was carrying a gun while answering the door. To much humbug for me. Over all thanks for you explanation. It makes sense to me.
Aloha, K
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i understand there are some people that have the attitude they have a gun they want everyone to know with the cleaning outside, or wearing tshirts or bumper stickers on their cars stuff like that. Thats fine thats your hoice but i am of the attitude though like some have posted that u dont need to advertise your firearms as you never know who is a criminal and could see you as a target. Thats just my take I think about someone breaking into my house when im not home or when my wife is all alone and i would ever hate to think that I has a part in something like that. just something to think about.
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i understand there are some people that have the attitude they have a gun they want everyone to know with the cleaning outside, or wearing tshirts or bumper stickers on their cars stuff like that. Thats fine thats your choice but i am of the attitude though like some have posted that u dont need to advertise your firearms
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Exactly!
Personally, I don't disclose everything on this forum either.
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I can't understand why anyone would want to draw that kind of attention to their residence anyway. Nobody should know you have any firearms until it's time for them to find out. :shaka:
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It's not pointing it at people who pass by. It's an open garage as in 3 sides are open with no walls or garage door.
I get it, carport. But it's the same thing. Say it's a neighbor who happens to look out the window next door and wham there you are pointing the muzzle right in their direction but guns freak them out so they call it in. Worth it? Keep the muzzle downrange. Put up blocking curtains or tarp at least to keep prying eyes away?
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I always keep a low profile. Neighbors don't need to know what I have and I don't want to be a target for theft or a person of interest
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If the cops do get called, what are they gonna do? From what I have seen, all they will just try to talk you into not doing whatever, open carry on your property, clean your guns out in your own garage, etc... Granted, one has to refrain from communicating a threat and whatnot.
Like the rest, I prefer to keep a low profile.
But if a neighbor wants to be an ass about it, I would just get this sign and post it in my yard.
(http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user5464/imageroot/2012/12-2/gunlist-unarmed.jpeg)
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If the cops do get called, what are they gonna do? From what I have seen, all they will just try to talk you into not doing whatever, open carry on your property, clean your guns out in your own garage, etc... Granted, one has to refrain from communicating a threat and whatnot.
Like the rest, I prefer to keep a low profile.
But if a neighbor wants to be an ass about it, I would just get this sign and post it in my yard.
(http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user5464/imageroot/2012/12-2/gunlist-unarmed.jpeg)
I need one of those!
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I always keep a low profile. Neighbors don't need to know what I have and I don't want to be a target for theft or a person of interest
+1
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If the cops do get called, what are they gonna do? From what I have seen, all they will just try to talk you into not doing whatever, open carry on your property, clean your guns out in your own garage, etc... Granted, one has to refrain from communicating a threat and whatnot.
Like the rest, I prefer to keep a low profile.
But if a neighbor wants to be an ass about it, I would just get this sign and post it in my yard.
(http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user5464/imageroot/2012/12-2/gunlist-unarmed.jpeg)
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :thumbsup:
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#1 - why do you want just anybody walking by the property to see what kind & how many guns you own while cleaning?
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Hmm, maybe it's best to take up a table at the range and clean my guns there. >:D
Its not illegal and I dont think theres anything wrong with that. Ironic that we cry about more gun regs but we want to regulate what shooters do at the range?! Like I said get rid of the benches. Want one? Bring your own. Ive seen a few benchrest shooters. Besidea when do you "train" off a bench anyways.
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....you can carry loaded firearms on your property.......that was the result of DC v. Heller
I would try, and highly encourage you, to re-read that opinion. I have not seen anything that says home is the same as property. Cops can walk all day "in" your property, but not in your home. There is a fairly substantial difference.
Something to think about for those "carrying" outside the home without a permit:
1.) Are you absolutely sure that you are not in violation of the Federal Gun Free School Zones act?
2.) Are you absolutely sure that two California cases have not affected your ability to carry or the definitions of what is considered public property in terms of the GFSZ?
Something to think about for carrying with a permit, but with reciprocity:
1.) Are you exempt from GFSZ laws? Or does the permit require it to be from the State that you are currently in.
I would encourage some of you to go research the Thesus case (you can find a bit of information on Calguns.net), as it has some direct implications on GFSZ type stuff, even if it is out of CA.
For instance, if you were in CA and opened your garage while carrying a firearm, the garage would now be considered public property. The lack of a fence surrounding your property would make the entire property fall under the public footage calculation.
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I would try, and highly encourage you, to re-read that opinion. I have not seen anything that says home is the same as property. Cops can walk all day "in" your property, but not in your home. There is a fairly substantial difference.
Something to think about for those "carrying" outside the home without a permit:
1.) Are you absolutely sure that you are not in violation of the Federal Gun Free School Zones act?
2.) Are you absolutely sure that two California cases have not affected your ability to carry or the definitions of what is considered public property in terms of the GFSZ?
Something to think about for carrying with a permit, but with reciprocity:
1.) Are you exempt from GFSZ laws? Or does the permit require it to be from the State that you are currently in.
I would encourage some of you to go research the Thesus case (you can find a bit of information on Calguns.net), as it has some direct implications on GFSZ type stuff, even if it is out of CA.
For instance, if you were in CA and opened your garage while carrying a firearm, the garage would now be considered public property. The lack of a fence surrounding your property would make the entire property fall under the public footage calculation.
....good points, but of course I was answering the question in a general sense. I wouldn't expect someone to think - by my omission of THAT or ANY caveat - that i was stating it would be ok to carry a firearm on one's property while also in violation of a GFZ or other prohibition; nor would I expect the reader to not be wise enough to know THAT particular, and all other limitations and exclusions of a law or policy.
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It was just a general statement as a I know some people do carry and say it's ok.
Some may not even know these things exist!
CA is good as screwing things up with crazy shit too lol.
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One is not guilty unless proven otherwise in a court, and found guilty with conviction.
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One is not guilty unless proven otherwise in a court, and found guilty with conviction.
Unless you happen to be a white-hispanic with a last name that sounds Jewish protecting yourself against a black teen ...
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Unless you happen to be a white-hispanic with a last name that sounds Jewish protecting yourself against a black teen ...
See...He was found not guilty.
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See...He was found not guilty.
In the media and according to millions of sheeple, he is guilty of murder IN SPITE of the verdict. That's why his "story" regarding a 911 call where he supposedly punched his father-in-law and threatened his soon-to-be-ex-wife with a gun was front page news, while the REAL story (none of that happened, and SHE was the aggressor) hasn't had near the air time.
Every time he gets a speeding ticket, he's in the news, and the fact he is carrying concealed continues to be a major fact stated in the articles.
He's being treated by society as a criminal, even though the evidence and jurors agree he is innocent.
The question becomes, can you be truly found innocent in court if the public and media continue to stalk you as if you were guilty? He's being punished every day of his life, so where does the "innocent until proven guilty" part have any bearing?
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Zimmerman is being treated like a celebrity, (eg. Lindsey Lohan etc. )
Ever watch TMZ ?
And he's dumb enough to publicly tour a gun factory and get into a filmed altercation with his soon-to-be-ex wife while his 15 minutes are still rolling.
while the REAL story (none of that happened, and SHE was the aggressor) hasn't had near the air time.
I didn't know you were there ? Cool.
What really happened ? Tell us.
Sorry for the snide remark, but that almost seems to be your MO in a lot of your responses on this forum Darmok.
You do post some quality posts, but IMO some of your responses need to be tempered.
Fact is Zimmerman's not in prison getting rides on the baloney pony for the rest of his life.
And fact is also it probably has lot to do with he is a white-hispanic with a last name that sounds Jewish protecting himself against a black teen ...
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Zimmerman is being treated like a celebrity, (eg. Lindsey Lohan etc. )
Ever watch TMZ ?
And he's dumb enough to publicly tour a gun factory and get into a filmed altercation with his soon-to-be-ex wife while his 15 minutes are still rolling.
I didn't know you were there ? Cool.
What really happened ? Tell us.
Sorry for the snide remark, but that almost seems to be your MO in a lot of your responses on this forum Darmok.
You do post some quality posts, but IMO some of your responses need to be tempered.
Fact is Zimmerman's not in prison getting rides on the baloney pony for the rest of his life.
And fact is also it probably has lot to do with he is a white-hispanic with a last name that sounds Jewish protecting himself against a black teen ...
Criticizing me and the style of my posts? Really? If you feel bad about the way I write, that's your problem ... not mine. Would you like me to call you a Wahmbulance?
I don't have the time (or desire) to gently wordsmith my posts just to make them politically or socially correct according to somebody's liking. I learned long ago you can't please everyone, so why try?
I have an opinion about many of the comments made here. I enjoy playing devil's advocate. Not to be contrary or argumentative, but to initiate a discussion of the underlying thoughts and facts that caused the commenter to come to the conclusion they stated. It's interesting and thought provoking to take a person's position on an issue and see whether they have thought it thoroughly through.
If you don't like that, then you don't like it. That doesn't mean I should be careful of hurting your feelings, or anyone else's. How many times do people state here, the forum is a place to freely discuss issues and exchange ideas? You think I should temper my responses? Right!
And I'd be glad to discuss the way Lindsey Lohan has been unjustly demonized by the media, and how she was labeled a racist, and how her acquittals represented a miscarriage of justice to the point where Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, and President Obama all felt the need to make public comments against the jury, the state of Florida, and stand your ground laws. How many times have you heard the US Attorney General, Eric Holder, comment on Lindsey Lohen's arrests?
The Zimmerman trial should have never happened. His life will never be the same. The government knew there was no hate crime nor racism on Zimmerman's behalf, but they forced Florida to prosecute in spite of the facts.
Saying he and Lohan are both celebrities is a completely skewed comparison.
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Hey Darmok, just wondering, what was your other forum name before you created this one?
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:stopjack:
Hey Darmok, just wondering, what was your other forum name before you created this one?