2aHawaii
General Topics => Legal and Activism => Topic started by: HiCarry on November 21, 2013, 09:47:30 AM
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Heads up, the legislative session, while not formally underway, has started with a "shot across our bow." Not only are his "facts" in the reso inaccurate, but this type of thing can set the tone for the year. What we need to do, IMHO, is to flood him, and the City Counsil with calls, emails, and letters, as a preemptive strike so we can scare them like we did for last year's instructor liability issue. Here's Mr. Chang's contact info:
ccldistrict4@honolulu.gov or:
530 South King Street, Room 202
Attention of Councilmember Chang
Honolulu, HI 96813
Telephone: (808) 768-5004
Fax: (808) 768-1169
Look for alerts coming from the NRA and HRA, but here's an advance screening of what he plans on introducing:
URGING THE UNITED STATES CONGRESS TO ENACT LEGISLATION NECESSARY TO IMPLEMENT PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA’S “NOW IS THE TIME” PLAN TO REDUCE GUN VIOLENCE.
WHEREAS, violence involving firearms in the United States presents a persistent societal ill that results in approximately 100,000 victims annually, including over 30,000 deaths; and
WHEREAS, the Sandy Hook Elementary School mass shooting in Newtown, Connecticut, which resulted in the death of 20 children and 6 adults, demonstrated the need for stronger laws to prevent gun violence; and
WHEREAS, numerous factors contribute to the occurrence of mass shootings, including unregulated access to assault weapons and assault magazines, insufficient background checks, and needed improvements to our mental health system, among others; and
WHEREAS, semiautomatic assault weapons designed with military features allow for the rapid fire of potentially large numbers of bullets, and are distinguishable from standard sporting firearms by features such as the ability to accept a detachable magazine, pistol grips, and folding or telescoping stocks; and
WHEREAS, semiautomatic assault weapons are frequently used in mass shootings, including the 1993 101 California Street shooting in San Francisco that involved two TEC-9 semiautomatic handguns, and the recent Aurora, Colorado, shooting that involved an AR-15 style semiautomatic assault rifle with a 100-round ammunition drum; and
WHEREAS, The United States Supreme Court has affirmed once and for all that Americans have a right to keep and bear arms. However, as conservative justice Antonin Scalia outlined, the District of Columbia v. Heller decision does not prohibit laws forbidding firearms in places such as schools or regulation of unusually dangerous weapons, nor does it restrict laws prohibiting felons and the mentally ill from carrying guns; and
WHEREAS, unlike most states, Hawaii requires every firearm to be registered, requires every purchaser of a firearm to obtain a license after a background check, and bans assault pistols and large capacity ammunition magazines that can be used with
assault pistols;
WHEREAS, Hawaii has the lowest rate of gun deaths among the states, but 485 people died in Hawaii between 1999 and 2010 from gun violence; and
WHEREAS, stronger laws would lead to a lower number of deaths resulting from gun violence; and
WHEREAS, reasonable restrictions on possession and use of firearms are continually stymied by the gun lobby despite recurring mass shootings across the country and a national consensus to reign in the rampant proliferation of guns; and
WHEREAS, on January 16, 2013, President Barack Obama released the “Now is the Time” plan to reduce gun violence, which involves steps to protect Americans from mass shootings including:
1. Closing background check loopholes to keep guns out of dangerous
hands;
2. Banning military-style assault weapons and high-capacity magazines, and taking other common sense steps to reduce gun violence;
3. Making schools safer; and
4. Increasing access to mental health services; and
WHEREAS, President Obama’s plan to reduce gun violence requires that the
United States Congress pass legislation requiring:
1. Universal background checks for gun sales;
2. The reinstatement and strengthening of the assault weapon ban;
3. Capping ammunition magazines to a ten-round limit;
4. Banning armor piercing ammunition;
5. Providing schools with resource officers and school counselors;
6. Putting more police officers on the street; and
7. Ensuring that health insurance plans cover mental health benefits;
WHEREAS, the United States Congress appears to be unable to agree on any
legislation that would address gun violence issues; now, therefore,
BE IT RESOLVED by the Council of the City and County of Honolulu that it urges
the United States Congress to enact legislation necessary to implement President
Barack Obama’s “Now is the Time” plan to reduce gun violence; and
BE IT FINALLY RESOLVED that copies of this Resolution be transmitted to
President Barack Obama, the President of the United States Senate, the Speaker of the
United States House of Representatives, and members of the Hawaii delegation to the
United States Congress.
Introduced by: Stanley Chang
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I went to college with his chief of staff
He will be getting an email within the next few days
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What a crock of crap
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URGING THE COUNCIL OF THE CITY AND COUNTY OF HONOLULU TO TAKE THE ONLY RATIONAL AND LOGICAL ACTION REGARDING THE RESOLUTION PROPOSED BY MR. CHANG
WHEREAS, Mr. Chang's resolution is not only misleading, but factually in error,
BE IT RESOLVED THEREFORE that Mr. Chang's resolution be placed where it belongs, and then flushed.
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This is some serious (expletive) stuff.
It's not really Chang that needs to hear from you as he is the one proposing the resolution and will have a deaf ear (but do include him in your notice of disapproval).
The resolution must pass vote by the remainder of the Counsil, so that is who we must let know that we oppose Changs Bill.
I have collected each of their contact info as well as the area each one represents so you know who your council person is.
At the bottom, I have posted all of the Email addresses together to make it easy to copy and paste all addresses to your Email.
Good to add a reason to your objection, specific to the proposal is best.
i:e
Your "Now is the time" plan includes "Increasing access to mental health services" even though we cannot even sign up for our regular health care ! :wtf:
District 1 - Kymberly Marcos Pine Phone: (808) 768-5001 E-mail kmpine@honolulu.gov Portions of Ewa Villages and Ewa Beach, Kapolei,
Makakilo, Kalaeloa, Honokai Hale, Ko Olina,
Nanakuli, Ma'ili, Wai'anae, Makaha, Kea'au, Makua
District 2 - Ernest Y. Martin Phone: (808) 768-5002 E-mail emartin@honolulu.gov Mililani Mauka,Wahiawa, Mokuleia,Waialua, Haleiwa, Pupukea, Sunset Beach, Kahuku, Laie, Hauula, Punaluu, Kahana, Kaaawa, Kualoa, Waiahole,and Kahaluu
District 3 - Ikaika Anderson Phone: (808) 768-5003 E-mail ianderson@honolulu.gov Ahuimanu, Heeia, Haiku, Kaneohe, Maunawili, Kailua, Olomana, Enchanted Lake, and Waimanalo..
District 4 - Stanley Chang Phone: (808) 768-5004 E-mail ccldistrict4@honolulu.gov Hawaii Kai, Kuliouou, Niu Valley, Aina Haina, Wailupe, Waialae-Iki, Kalani Valley, Kahala, Wilhemina Rise, Kaimuki, portions of Kapahulu, Diamond Head, Black Point, Waikiki, and Ala Moana Beach Park.
District 5 - Ann Kobayashi Phone: (808) 768-5005 E-mail akobayashi@honolulu.gov Kaimuki, Palolo Valley, St. Louis Heights, Manoa, Moiliili, McCully, and portions of Ala Moana, Kakaako, and Makiki.
District 6 - Carol Fukunaga Phone: (808) 768-5006 E-mail cafukunaga@honolulu.gov Portions of Makiki, Downtown Honolulu, Punchbowl, Pauoa Valley, Nuuanu, Alewa Heights, Papakolea, Fort Shafter, Moanalua, Halawa, Aiea, Kalihi Valley, and portions of Liliha and Kalihi.
District 7 - Joey Manahan Phone: (808) 768-5007 E-mail jmanahan@honolulu.gov Kalihi, lwilei, Kalihi Kai, Mapunapuna, Salt Lake, Aliamanu, Hickam, Foster Village, Ford Island, and Sand Island.
District 8 - Breene Harimoto Phone: (808) 768-5008 E-mail bharimoto@honolulu.gov Lower Aiea, Pearlridge, Waimalu, Newtown, Pearl City, Seaview, Crestview, Waipio Gentry and Waipahu.
District 9 - Ron Menor Phone: (808) 768-5009 E-mail rmenor@honolulu.gov Waikele, Village Park, Royal Kunia, Mililani Town, West Loch, Iroquois Point, and portions of Ewa Villages and Ewa Beach.
kmpine@honolulu.gov, emartin@honolulu.gov, ianderson@honolulu.gov, ccldistrict4@honolulu.gov, akobayashi@honolulu.gov, cafukunaga@honolulu.gov, jmanahan@honolulu.gov, bharimoto@honolulu.gov, rmenor@honolulu.gov
Remember, if your not part of the solution, you're part of the problem ! :shaka:
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Mahalo rocky
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It's not a bill but a resolution, or somewhat of a promise. It is important but I think it serves as a gaugeof public sentiment for proposed anti gun bills. I interpret it as his soap box he is trying to build with anti gun rhetoric so it is imperative we dismantle it :thumbsup:
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Kid is also running for congress
Bill means nothing except for him blowing his own horn about kissing Kenyan okole
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.
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Ren I stand corrected (again :oops:), it's a resolution.
Nice work NewGuy . :thumbsup:
Quick eye to see the time continuum
Could be because .....
Hawaii firearms registrations shot up more than 70 percent in 2012, while gun violence continued a four-year decline, according to a new state Department of the Attorney General report. :o
“While there has been a tremendous increase in firearm registration activity in Hawaii since 2000, the annual trends for both the number of firearm-related violent crimes and the proportion of violent crimes involving firearms relative to other weapon types remained stable within a low and narrow range through 2007, and decreased substantially from 2008 through 2012, during which time registration activity increased the most sharply,” the Department of the Attorney concluded.
Officials processed a record 21,864 state and county firearm permits in 2012, the report found. One year before, that number was 15,375.
Hawaii law allows multiple long guns to be registered under one permit. That brought the total number of firearms registered in 2012 to 50,394, a 73 percent increase from the previous record high of 36,804 firearms registered in 2011.
http://hotair.com/greenroom/archives/2013/07/24/in-hawaii-gun-ownership-rises-while-violent-crime-falls/ (http://hotair.com/greenroom/archives/2013/07/24/in-hawaii-gun-ownership-rises-while-violent-crime-falls/)
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Sent an email. What really burns me is that he's my councilman
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Hope you did'nt vote for him, then you'd be more "burn't"
If you did, hope you let him know he won't get your vote (or your friends and family's vote ) for him running for congress ! :wave:
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See below :grrr:
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Kid is also running for congress
Bill means nothing except for him blowing his own horn about kissing Kenyan okole
Agreed 100%
:thumbsup:
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I know that the hardest thing to do when setting the record straight is spending the time to find the facts to support your side.
I am a retired old cranky guy with nothing to do, >:( so here it is.
Check out the sites or just glean what you want from here.
http://www.cityrating.com/crime-statistics/hawaii/honolulu.html (http://www.cityrating.com/crime-statistics/hawaii/honolulu.html)
Records pedia
http://recordspedia.com/Hawaii/Crime-Statistics (http://recordspedia.com/Hawaii/Crime-Statistics)
Total Crime
Between 1999 and 2008 there were 624,111 total crimes reported in Hawaii (32,612 of them violent). Of the 62,411 crimes that occur a year in Hawaii, almost half happen less than a mile from home. On average, someone is a victim of a crime in Hawaii every 8 minutes. This includes 282 murders, 3,570 rapes, and more than four hundred and eighty-eight thousand thefts (including 74,444 motor vehicle thefts).
Hawaii crime rate fell in 2003
http://archives.starbulletin.com/2004/07/23/news/story1.html (http://archives.starbulletin.com/2004/07/23/news/story1.html)
There were 22 murders in 2003, the lowest number of murders and the lowest per capita murder rate since the state started keeping records in 1975. An analysis of data from county police departments for the years preceding statewide uniform crime reporting, back to 1943, found that the 2003 tally was Hawaii's lowest since 1968 and the smallest per capita murder rate since 1956, three years before statehood.
"We don't have much of a problem here," said Deputy Police Chief Paul Putzulu, of the Honolulu Police Department.
My Favorite via Hawaii Attorney General
Firearm Registrations in Hawaii, 2012
David M. Louie, Attorney General Julie Ebato, Administrator
Russell A. Suzuki, First Deputy Attorney General March 2013
http://ag.hawaii.gov/cpja/files/2013/03/Firearm-Registrations-2012.pdf (http://ag.hawaii.gov/cpja/files/2013/03/Firearm-Registrations-2012.pdf)
Firearm Registration Trends and Firearm-Related Violent Crime Trends
Given the tremendous increases in statewide firearm registration activity throughout the 2000-2012 period, and in particular the major increases reported for the post-2008 period, it is understandable that some readers might at first glance be alarmed, fearing that these increases have necessarily resulted in commensurate increases in firearm-related violent crime trends.
However, as shown in the following figures, such has not been the case. Figure 9 (below) overlays the trend for firearm registrations atop the trend data for firearm-related violent crimes reported to the State’s Uniform Crime Reporting Program (which is also directed by this Department). This analysis reveals that,
while firearm registration activity has increased dramatically, the trend for firearm-related violent crimes has remained fairly stable within a narrow range, and decreased substantially during the same period (2008-2012*) during which registration activity increased the most sharply.
Figures 9 and 10 (next page) demonstrate that, relative to other weapon types, the low prevalence of firearm use during the commission of violent crimes in Hawaii has remained stable for at least the past 18 years in Hawaii, with evidence of becoming even less prevalent since 2007.
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread962292/pg1 (http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread962292/pg1)
Number of firearms owned in Hawaii spikes, nearly same number as state population. :thumbsup:
In 2012, permits totaled 21,864, an increase from 15,375 permits issued in 2011. However, firearms registrations in 2012 were at a tremendous 50,394, up 73 percent from the previous record high in 2011 of 36,804. Since the year 2000, permits have soared an astonishing 336.9 percent and registrations have gone up 370.1 percent.
According to the report, “The violent Index Crime rate in Hawaii decreased 4.8% in 2011, and the property Index Crime rate decreased 4.9%, reaching its lowest level on record for the State of Hawaii.” Those violent crimes include murder, forcible rape, robbery and aggravated assault. Property crimes include burglary, larceny-theft and vehicle theft. Total crime for the state was down nine percent for 2011, setting record lows across the board.
Although there is no way to track the number of firearms that permanently leave the state, independent estimates made during the late-1990s by the Department of the Attorney General and the
City & County of Honolulu Police Department placed the total number of privately owned firearms in Hawaii at roughly one million.
THATS ALOT OF VOTES
The most dissapointing news I found was...
According to the report, “Four private citizens applied for a concealed carry license in the City & County of Honolulu, and one applied in Maui County, and all five were denied at the discretion of the respective county police chief. Some 168 employees of private security firms were issued carry licenses while two were denied.”
SERIOUSLY !
4 CCW Applicants !
Pleeeeeeease tell me it's not true !
Tho I must confess, I and mine are also guilty.
Perhaps if we all applied and let the media know it it may help. Sure would get National recognition.
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What a surprise, he invokes the messiah Obunghole's name many times. Obviously he is the inspiration for this, no? If the bastard was not in office, what is the likelihood this garbage would be here?
And all those Hawaii2A members that voted for the POS, will no doubt cower in silence once again.
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Stanley Chang Suspended by Bar Association
http://www.hawaiifreepress.com/ArticlesMain/tabid/56/ID/9695/Stanley-Chang-Suspended-by-Bar-Association.aspx (http://www.hawaiifreepress.com/ArticlesMain/tabid/56/ID/9695/Stanley-Chang-Suspended-by-Bar-Association.aspx)
Honolulu Councilmember and Congressional candidate Stanley Chang has lost his right to practice law in Hawaii after being suspended from membership by the Hawaii Bar Association.
According to the Bar Association website, Chang, who joined the Bar in 2008, has been suspended for non-payment of dues.
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I got an email from the NRA about this guy... read the document and yes what a crock of shit...
I wrote him this:
Mr. Stanley Chang,
I felt compelled to write you concerning the resolution you introduced 13-280. I find it very amusing that you have taken the time to put this little gem together. Clearly you have not a single modicum of knowledge of the issues we face in society today, specifically regarding gun control issues. Perhaps you think you could gain popularity among the sheeple of Hawaii by jumping on the bandwagon of anti gun critics. Let me just point out a few issues with your plan.
First, It is a well known fact that no gun control could have prevented the events that took place at Sandy Hook. Are you so foolish as to believe banning pistol grips and adjustable stocks would somehow magically mean evil has left the world? A small child could even distinguish that those features have nothing to do with making a firearm more destructive. The only thing that could have prevented that act having happened with a firearm would be complete and total disarmament of the American people. The last time a government tried to do this, it was the British empire and needless to say, it did not go so well. I am sure you do not need a history lesson.
Since you proudly admit that your parents came to the United States seeking a better life I find it quite confusing as to what part of the Constitution you did not understand. It is not a pick and choose document. It is what this great nation was founded upon. The 2nd amendment is there specifically to enable the people to arm themselves in the event of the established government failing to do its intended job.
As you were born and raised in Hawaii as I was, perhaps you just do not understand the bigger picture. After-all, Hawaii is not a free state. The powers that be in Hawaii have decided that I should not be able to have the means to defend my life and my loved ones by being able to carry a handgun. Nearly ALL the 50 states provide a means to carry a firearm. Some do not even require any licensing or permits of any sort. You know what? Those states tend to have the lowest crime rates. It all seems mad doesn't it. People running around carrying loaded handguns while they buy groceries or go to buy more crap at wal-mart.
Hawaii does have some of the strictest gun laws in the nation. Do they work? Nope. You cite a couple of prominent shootings, and brag about Hawaii's low gun crimes. Yet you fail to mention the 1999 shooting at Xerox where 7 people were killed. By whom? A person who legally acquired and had registered his firearms in this state, with its stringent background checks. The problem was that a man woke up one day and decided on his own that he was going to take his 9mm handgun to work intent to murder his co-workers. What is going to happen when a person wakes up one day and decides to run people down on the sidewalk with their car? Ban cars that are capable of running over more than 10 people? Ban sidewalks?
I would be truly interested to hear a detailed description of precisely how these proposed laws you support are going to stop this problem. Better yet, instead of doing that. Perhaps your time would be better spent looking at the real issues and more importantly educating yourself on the issues and the facts that concern them. If you really want to save lives how about introducing legislation to permanently revoke drivers licenses from drivers who have repeat DUI arrests. Do you know what the statistics are on number of people killed and car crashes where alcohol is involved as compared to guns? It is staggering.
There is no shame to admit in being wrong. I trust you will further investigate the actual facts of this issue and reconsider your own position. It is not those who go with the current trends that gain the respect of their constituents, but rather those who are willing to take a stand and go against the trends.
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Well done HaoleB :thumbsup:
Could you post the NRA Email ?
If you gotta go Dem, Go Ikaika.
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http://www.nraila.org/legislation/state-legislation/2013/11/hawaii-honolulu-city-councilman-stanley-chang-introduces-anti-gun-resolution.aspx?s=&st=10475&ps= (http://www.nraila.org/legislation/state-legislation/2013/11/hawaii-honolulu-city-councilman-stanley-chang-introduces-anti-gun-resolution.aspx?s=&st=10475&ps=)
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I compiled data from the FBI Uniform Crime Reports (1995 -2012) for the State of Hawaii.
The first number = year.
The second number = total murders.
The third number = murders involving firearms.
Fourth number = firearm murders as a % of all murders.
1995; 56; 25: 44.64%
1996; 38; 16; 42.10%
1997; 46; 15; 32.60%
1998; 24; 6; 25.00%
1999; 43; 22; 51.16% (7 people killed in the Xerox shooting)
2000; 33; 7; 21.21%
2001; 31; 7; 22.58%
2002; 23; 10; 43.47%
2003; 22; 8; 36.36%
2004; 31; 6; 19.35%
2005; 20; 2; 10.00%
2006; 21; 7; 33.33%
2007; 12; 3; 25.00%
2008; 25; 11; 44.00%
2009; 21; 8; 38.09%
2010; 24; 7; 29.17%
2011; 7; 1; 14.28%
2012; 13; 3; 23.07%
Total firearm murders for this 18 year period is 164.
Total firearm murders from 1999 through 2010 is 98.
So, the remaining 387 (485-98=387) deaths must be attributed to suicides, justifiable homicides, LEO activities?
Also, did you notice that the Reso identifies the time period spanning 1999 to 2010?
12 years is an awkward period of time to reference... unless you are intentionally trying to manipulate the numbers.
If this clown is trying to curry favor with POTUS, he must not have see POTUS' latest approval ratings.
Attaboy, Councilman Chang... way to try to tie your dinghy to a sinking ship and alienate your constituents!
If you have time, check Hawaii against Vermont for statistics.
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Just spoke with Breene Harimoto, Councilman of District 8. He will be voting NO if this really goes to hearing. :thumbsup:
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I'm waiting for people to start saying,
"Stop encroaching on our rights or else..."
I think we are getting to the point beyond letters and rallies; People need to start turning up the heat on the politicians.
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anyone else notice "assault magazines"?
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I went to college with his chief of staff
He will be getting an email within the next few days
it's going to be difficult not putting in the letter at some point, "i know i didn't go to hahvahd law school like you did, but i watched schoolhouse rock when i was a kid, and i'm pretty sure the "i am just a bill, living up on capital hill" episode never involved a city council resolution"
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it's going to be difficult not putting in the letter at some point, "i know i didn't go to hahvahd law school like you did, but i watched schoolhouse rock when i was a kid, and i'm pretty sure the "i am just a bill, living up on capital hill" episode never involved a city council resolution"
or
"i know you don't have to listen to my input, it's not like i'm a member of the hawaii bar association- oops, never mind"
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Sent an email to him, "my" Councilman. Blegh.
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I'm waiting for people to start saying,
"Stop encroaching on our rights or else..."
I think we are getting to the point beyond letters and rallies; People need to start turning up the heat on the politicians.
<insert cynicism>
well, when you're a Democrat in Hawaii ...nothing will happen
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The funny thing is that "assault weapons" and "assault magazines" probably accounted for none of the 485 deaths since 1999 so this bill would have NO effect on that number. and besides, I bet that 485 figure includes police shootings, thereby making it totally bogus. I could be wrong but those libs really like to lump together all kinds of irrelevant figures.
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Where do we go to apply for CCW?
Maybe we should have a CCW Hawaii day. Everyone take off and go the police station and apply in large numbers. Maybe even get some press so they know Hawaii is not really a CCW state.
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You know, I'm really really sick and tired of these lying politicians and their false statistics and absurd claims about gun control laws and causality and crime rates. The problem is that most people they are addressing don't know and probably don't care that they are being duped by ignorant/incompetent deceitful liars. Like Mr. Chang's resolution, I have received numerous responses from my U.S. Congressional Representative, Tulsi Gabbard, full of lies about gun control and crime rates. Her view, of course, is that fewer guns, especially those bad black guns ("assault weapons"), means fewer crimes. How many times can I send her the real stats and she just lies right back at me?
Here are the FBI stats for 2012 for Violent Crime Rate (VCR) comparing several small states, including Hawaii. You'll note that Hawaii does not rank best in any category, and clearly ranks worse than states that have liberal gun ownership and gun carry laws. So where's their friggin' causality argument now?! If they really believe that gun laws determine the crime rates, then Hawaii ought to emulate the gun laws of states that have lower violent crime rates, correct? That'd be "Constitutional Carry".
I apologize if the formatting of the stats does not transfer cleanly to the forum...
VCR Murder rape robbery assault
Delaware 547.4 6.2 26.5 162.7 352
Hawaii 239.2 2.1 20.5 74.7 141.9
Idaho 207.9 1.8 30 15.2 160.9
Maine 122.7 1.9 28 31.8 61
Montana 272.2 2.7 37.7 19 212.8
North Dakota 244.7 4 38.9 18.7 183.1
Rhode Island 252.4 3.2 27.4 67.9 153.9
New Hampshire 187.9 1.1 34 35.7 117
South Dakota 321.8 3 70.2 19 229.7
Vermont 142.6 1.3 19.3 17.9 104.2
Virginia 190.1 3.8 17.7 57.5 111.1
Source: FBI Uniform Crime Data for 2012.
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You know, I'm really really sick and tired of these lying politicians and their false statistics and absurd claims about gun control laws and causality and crime rates. The problem is that most people they are addressing don't know and probably don't care that they are being duped by ignorant/incompetent deceitful liars. Like Mr. Chang's resolution, I have received numerous responses from my U.S. Congressional Representative, Tulsi Gabbard, full of lies about gun control and crime rates. Her view, of course, is that fewer guns, especially those bad black guns ("assault weapons"), means fewer crimes. How many times can I send her the real stats and she just lies right back at me?
Ms. Gabbard is an exception as she has extensive mil training - so she knows what she's talking about.
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I started writing an email to the entire council with the ending "Maybe take a firearms course to learn about firearms, the different types, there are too many politicians out there than write laws without understanding the subject matter even on the most basic level."
Then it got me thinking, what if we we actually gave the NRA course to these politicians for free? I've had folks that were anti-gun until their fired their first firearm and were educated on it change their mind.
I'd offer to pay my council member to take a course if they haven't already done so. Just a thought.
Tulsi Gabbard is just an idiot.. can't fix stupid.
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I started writing an email to the entire council with the ending "Maybe take a firearms course to learn about firearms, the different types, there are too many politicians out there than write laws without understanding the subject matter even on the most basic level."
Then it got me thinking, what if we we actually gave the NRA course to these politicians for free? I've had folks that were anti-gun until their fired their first firearm and were educated on it change their mind.
I'd offer to pay my council member to take a course if they haven't already done so. Just a thought.
Tulsi Gabbard is just an idiot.. can't fix stupid.
Life does this if I'm not mistaken and have an open door/offer. No one has taken them up on it.
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Ms. Gabbard is an exception as she has extensive mil training - so she knows what she's talking about.
Right. She always makes a point of writing about her military service and how that qualifies her to quote erroneous statistics and make false claims about the causal factors in crime rates and firearm restriction laws.
Here is a portion of her latest example, just one paragraph (emphasis added to emphasize her knowledge and experience of firearms as gained through her military experience):
"As a Soldier and Military Police Officer, I have received extensive training and have significant experience in handling a variety of firearms. Having firsthand knowledge of the impact of these weapons, and the devastation they can cause, I do not see any role for military-style assault weapons on our streets and in our communities. This is why I support reinstating the assault weapons ban, and a ban on high-capacity clips holding more than 10 rounds. These provisions replicate the protections that we have already in place in Hawai`i, and which have played a role in our state having the lowest firearm-related homicide rate in the country."
I'm assuming that when she writes "I do not see any role for military-style assault weapons on our streets and in our communities" she has, as was the case in the originally passed-without-exceptions New York state SAFE Act, forgotten to exempt law enforcement from such a ban. Law enforcement certainly has these military-style assault weapons on our streets and in our communities, but they don't call them "assault weapons", they call them "patrol rifles".
I'm doing everything I can to defeat her in 2014. Not that I like the Republicans at all. Where's the libertarian to represent me?
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Hope you did'nt vote for him, then you'd be more "burn't"
If you did, hope you let him know he won't get your vote (or your friends and family's vote ) for him running for congress ! :wave:
No, I didn't vote for him. I will have some choice things to say to him when he comes to "press the flesh"
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Where do we go to apply for CCW?
Maybe we should have a CCW Hawaii day. Everyone take off and go the police station and apply in large numbers. Maybe even get some press so they know Hawaii is not really a CCW state.
I have some questions regarding CCW.
1) Have there really been only 4 applications for CCW ?
Posted on July, 30 2013 @ 09:42 PM @
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread962292/pg1 (http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread962292/pg1)
2) Must I Drop off forms at the Gun registration window or may I have them delivered directly to the Chief of Police ?
Signature at window required or can it be notarized and delivered as above to COP?
3) If delivered directly to the Chief of Police, can the delivery package contain more than one single individuals application (100 separate requests) for CCW ?
Who is the "Master of Info" on that subject ?
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Good news though we may have a allie with the mayor. I spoke with him at young guns this morning. He was there shopping with his famipy. I spoke with him about preservation of the sport, range acess, and a few other things. He seemed very comfortable in the store. martha and don were talking to hI'm about the 100 yard restrictions
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Sent to all Council members and Mayor
Dear Council Persons.
I have recently become aware of councilman Chang’s introduction of Resolution 13-280 and wish to state this households ( 4 votes) disapproval of the resolution as well as inform you of the inaccuracies of the information he has provided as a basis for this resolution.
Though I do not have time to correct nor argue each of his fabrications, I will do so upon what I feel are the most pertinent and blatant of what I can only assume are his assumptions as I can find no evidence to support them.
violence involving firearms in the United States presents a persistent societal ill that results in approximately 100,000 victims annually, including over 30,000 deaths
The US Department of Justice reports that approximately 60% (6 out of 10 or) of all adult firearm deaths are by suicide, 61% more than deaths by homicide nationally.
In 2010, 358 murders were reported (NATIONALLY) involving a rifle
The United States Supreme Court has affirmed once and for all that Americans have a right to keep and bear arms.
Yet the this very right “to keep and bear arms” (CCW) is denied in Hawaii
However, as conservative justice Antonin Scalia outlined, the District of Columbia v. Heller decision does not prohibit laws forbidding firearms in places such as schools or regulation of unusually dangerous weapons, nor does it restrict laws prohibiting felons and the mentally ill from carrying guns
The statement is relative to reasonable existing law and has no bearing on his resolution.
unlike most states, Hawaii requires every firearm to be registered, requires every purchaser of a firearm to obtain a license after a background check, and bans assault pistols and large capacity ammunition magazines that can be used with assault pistols;
Again, this is something that already exists and has no relevance to the resolution.
Hawaii has the lowest rate of gun deaths among the states, but 485 people died in Hawaii between 1999 and 2010 from gun violence
Data from the FBI Uniform Crime Reports (1995 -2012) for the State of Hawaii states a t total of firearm murders from 1999 through 2010 is 98.
Total firearm murders in Hawaii from 1995 to 2012 (18 years) is 164.
So according to his total of 485, the remaining 387 (485-98=387) deaths he mentions must be attributed to suicides (60% or 232 based upon DOJ Statistics) leaving the remaining 154 as justifiable homicides, LEO activities?
Changs choice of start and stop dates (1995 -2012), is also convenient to his cry.
“Hawaii firearms registrations shot up more than 70 percent in 2012, while gun violence continued a four-year decline, according to a new state Department of the Attorney General report.
"Firearm-related homicides dropped from 18,253 homicides in 1993 to 11,101 in 2011," according to a report by the Federal Bureau of Justice Statistics,
In Hawaii 2011 and 2012 there were a total of 20 murders, 4 of which involved fire arms.
stronger laws would lead to a lower number of deaths resulting from gun violence
The above reports by US DOJ and FBI prove this to be wrong
reasonable restrictions on possession and use of firearms are continually stymied by the gun lobby despite recurring mass shootings across the country and a national consensus to reign in the rampant proliferation of guns
Not all of these restrictions are “reasonable” and it is not just the Gun Lobby, it is “WE THE PEOPLE“.
the United States Congress appears to be unable to agree on any legislation that would address gun violence issues
Congress is agreeing with “WE THE PEOPLE“.
BE IT RESOLVED by the Council of the City and County of Honolulu that it urges the United States Congress to enact legislation necessary to implement President Barack Obama’s “Now is the Time” plan to reduce gun violence
There are almost as many gun permits/registrations in Hawaii as there are residents and our political representatives who vote to approve this resolution will surely be aware of that fact come election time.
To vote yes on this resolution may put you in the “60%” mentioned above politically .
Regards,
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Thoughts on this? I'm thinking of sending it to Councilman Chang:
Aloha Councilman Chang
I have read a draft of the resolution in the subject and hereby lodge my disagreement with it. I strongly urge you to avoid proceeding with it.
The primary reason why I disagree with the resolution is the fact that the steps it suggests will not address the issues identified.
We have seen what happens in cities with strict gun laws. Chicago has some of the strictest gun laws in the United States, yet there were 514 murders there in 2012, 441 of which involved guns. Of those 441 that involved guns, ALL of them were perpetrated with handguns. None involved rifles or "other firearms."
Note that these numbers are AFTER the laws preventing private ownership of handguns were lifted and marked a DECREASE in overall crime rates - nearly 20,000 fewer violent crimes than 10 years prior and 6,000 fewer than the last year the handgun ban was still in effect (2009.)
The point to make here is that the vast majority of gun crimes across the US (not just Chicago) involve guns that aren't the scary, 'evil black rifle' type on which your resolution would place such stringent restrictions.
The second reason I object to this resolution is that, historically, imposing strident gun control measures usually results in an INCREASE in crime and does very little to reduce crime involving firearms. By definition, criminals just don't care about gun laws, so the only people affected are the normal, well-adjusted average citizens who are subsequently bereft of their most immediate defense against someone that wishes to do them or their families harm in their own homes.
I want to bring up a third point. I think this is a good thing, but you may disagree: By attempting to push this resolution through you serve to unite people in opposition to it, thereby undermining your position as a gun control advocate. I am one of them and I don't even own a firearm; I just believe that Hawaii's gun laws are ALREADY too burdensome and our 2nd amendment rights are restricted tightly enough - more so, even, than they should be.
In closing, I think you could take a lesson from my oldest son. When he turned 13, he and I attended a L.I.F.E handgun training course and obtained our affidavits, allowing us to purchase a gun if I so wished. I've also taken my youngest son (9) to the Shooting Sports Fair at the Koko Head Shooting Complex on Father's Day, after our (I'm a member of the Hawaii Kai Lions Club) annual pancake breakfast at Kaiser High School. Both of my children have learned that guns are just tools - they hold no magic for good or evil. Restricting them as if they did is, in my opinion, myopic and ineffectual as anything but theater.
Sincerely,
Crass!
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Thoughts on this? I'm thinking of sending it to Councilman Chang:
Aloha Councilman Chang
I have read a draft of the resolution in the subject and hereby lodge my disagreement with it. I strongly urge you to avoid proceeding with it.
The primary reason why I disagree with the resolution is the fact that the steps it suggests will not address the issues identified.
We have seen what happens in cities with strict gun laws. Chicago has some of the strictest gun laws in the United States, yet there were 514 murders there in 2012, 441 of which involved guns. Of those 441 that involved guns, ALL of them were perpetrated with handguns. None involved rifles or "other firearms."
Note that these numbers are AFTER the laws preventing private ownership of handguns were lifted and marked a DECREASE in overall crime rates - nearly 20,000 fewer violent crimes than 10 years prior and 6,000 fewer than the last year the handgun ban was still in effect (2009.)
The point to make here is that the vast majority of gun crimes across the US (not just Chicago) involve guns that aren't the scary, 'evil black rifle' type on which your resolution would place such stringent restrictions.
The second reason I object to this resolution is that, historically, imposing strident gun control measures usually results in an INCREASE in crime and does very little to reduce crime involving firearms. By definition, criminals just don't care about gun laws, so the only people affected are the normal, well-adjusted average citizens who are subsequently bereft of their most immediate defense against someone that wishes to do them or their families harm in their own homes.
I want to bring up a third point. I think this is a good thing, but you may disagree: By attempting to push this resolution through you serve to unite people in opposition to it, thereby undermining your position as a gun control advocate. I am one of them and I don't even own a firearm; I just believe that Hawaii's gun laws are ALREADY too burdensome and our 2nd amendment rights are restricted tightly enough - more so, even, than they should be.
In closing, I think you could take a lesson from my oldest son. When he turned 13, he and I attended a L.I.F.E handgun training course and obtained our affidavits, allowing us to purchase a gun if I so wished. I've also taken my youngest son (9) to the Shooting Sports Fair at the Koko Head Shooting Complex on Father's Day, after our (I'm a member of the Hawaii Kai Lions Club) annual pancake breakfast at Kaiser High School. Both of my children have learned that guns are just tools - they hold no magic for good or evil. Restricting them as if they did is, in my opinion, myopic and ineffectual as anything but theater.
Sincerely,
Crass!
nice
send it
i got sidetracked from writing mine
i will do it soon
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Aloha Crass.
Definately send it :thumbsup:
But as I noted earlier...
" It's not really Chang that needs to hear from you as he is the one proposing the resolution and will have a deaf ear (but do include him in your notice of disapproval).
The resolution must pass vote by the remainder of the Counsil, so that is who we must let know that we oppose Changs Bill."
See page one of this postwhere I have listed the names, phone numbers and Email addresses of all Council members.
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Aloha Crass.
Definately send it :thumbsup:
But as I noted earlier...
" It's not really Chang that needs to hear from you as he is the one proposing the resolution and will have a deaf ear (but do include him in your notice of disapproval).
The resolution must pass vote by the remainder of the Counsil, so that is who we must let know that we oppose Changs Bill."
See page one of this postwhere I have listed the names, phone numbers and Email addresses of all Council members.
yup
it's political grandstanding, plain and simple
it means nothing for the council to pass this, nor does it mean anything to defeat it
but it's a waste of their time and our tax dollars to even consider such a ludicrous proposal
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If anything, it gives us a firearms advocates a doorway to voice our opinion in NUMBERS.
Let all the politicos know that many of us are VOTERS !
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I'm in Chang's district, so it has to go to him. Perhaps I should cc the others? How has that worked out for you guys previously?
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I'm in Chang's district, so it has to go to him. Perhaps I should cc the others? How has that worked out for you guys previously?
yup send to him
and cc: the others
i am going to write 2 different ones-
one to him going point by point
and a second one to all saying it's a waste of time and resources
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Done. Made a few corrections to the wording here and there, but the overall message is the same :grrr:
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Life does this if I'm not mistaken and have an open door/offer. No one has taken them up on it.
LIFE provides our class to both politicians and the press for free. To date we have had several politicians and members of the press attend, including two from the press that took the class last Sunday. That being said, we would be happy to have more attend, so please consider this an open invitation to any one you might talk to. If you have questions, or the potential students have questions, feel free to refer them to me.
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Good news though we may have a allie with the mayor. I spoke with him at young guns this morning. He was there shopping with his famipy. I spoke with him about preservation of the sport, range acess, and a few other things. He seemed very comfortable in the store. martha and don were talking to hI'm about the 100 yard restrictions
The Mayor has always been supportive of shooting and shooters. He was responsible for the "extending" the range hours to the original times after they were shortened due to budget issues.
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LIFE provides our class to both politicians and the press for free. To date we have had several politicians and members of the press attend, including two from the press that took the class last Sunday. That being said, we would be happy to have more attend, so please consider this an open invitation to any one you might talk to. If you have questions, or the potential students have questions, feel free to refer them to me.
does "politicians" include neighborhood board members?
how's about somebody invite all the members tonight to take a handgun safety course?
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I think that is a good idea!
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does "politicians" include neighborhood board members?
how's about somebody invite all the members tonight to take a handgun safety course?
Yep, includes NB members. I cannot make the meeting tonight, but one of my instructors is supposed to be there. Feel free to extend the offer on my behalf and if my instructors has any questions just let him know I said it was OK.
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Yep, includes NB members. I cannot make the meeting tonight, but one of my instructors is supposed to be there. Feel free to extend the offer on my behalf and if my instructors has any questions just let him know I said it was OK.
got it, thanks
i can't wait to see the look on knudsen's face
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got it, thanks
i can't wait to see the look on knudsen's face
I don't have any classes scheduled until January, but if we get enough of them that want to take it I'd be willing to try and schedule a "special" class just for them....