2aHawaii
General Topics => General Discussion => Topic started by: Mynah on May 19, 2015, 02:21:01 PM
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As the subject states, your at KKH rifle range and someone on your left is shooting some sort of semi-auto rifle and shells are flying everywhere.
I'm trying to be open about this and I can't be the only one this has happened to, but I'm having a hard time and don't want to offend anybody.
Simply put, is it feasible to make it mandatory to require a shooting net or barrier of some sort -at least when shooting semi's where the shells come out with force and are hot.
Your thoughts?
Aloha
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I don't think it's possible to force anybody to put up a barrier.
It's like trying to force every driver to obey the speed limit. Ain't gonna happen.
Should be pretty simple to build a net to clamp to the bench to block the brass.
You could probably build a few and sell them.
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I've been hit by spent cases as well.
I wish people were more considerate to others, but its not required.
last time i went, an ejected brass opened a small cut on my forehead
but it was from my own 1911. the brass hit the wood roof support and came back and hit me in the forehead.
but i didn't even flinch. kept on shooting. LOL. :thumbsup:
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As the subject states, your at KKH rifle range and someone on your left is shooting some sort of semi-auto rifle and shells are flying everywhere.
I'm trying to be open about this and I can't be the only one this has happened to, but I'm having a hard time and don't want to offend anybody.
Simply put, is it feasible to make it mandatory to require a shooting net or barrier of some sort -at least when shooting semi's where the shells come out with force and are hot.
Your thoughts?
Aloha
Its completely normal. Just like being concerned about the loud noises they are making... its a shooting range...
That being said, I would find it rare that if its bothering you simply ask and they would be more than happy to switch benches at the next break. As in almost all cases the brass only goes on direction, problem solved!
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If I bring three rifles they all will eject and throw brass a different direction, AK sideways and 4 benches down, PTR-91 out to 1:30 and 3/4 of the way down the hill, SKS straight up into the roof. I'd say it would be a courtesy to catch or deflect your brass to avoid it raining on fellow shooters. When I first shot my AK I had no idea the brass was going where it was going I was having too much fun, one of the RO's took the little wood thing and flipped it up and put it in the ejection path to deflect the casings. If I get hit I don't mind unless it goes down my shirt, I will wear shoes and a had to mitigate the damage.
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Doesn't bother me at all, in fact when I take friends to the range I'll often stand between my shooter and the shooter on the left to block spent casings from hitting the newbie. I kind of see it like going to a water park and not expecting to get wet. If you have a problem with getting hit then you can move or suck it up.
To answer your specific question I don't think it should be made mandatory. You could also bring an extra net to lend to the guy on your left but I personally wouldn't use it, obstructs my shooting comfort ;-)
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I always go up to the person and ask nicely to do something about it. And I have had some mokes tell me to F@ck off. I then talk to the range officer and they make them contain their brass. Also, they will announce it when the range first opens that you are required to contain your brass. So if they don't the range officers will make them. BTW that applies to the pistol side as well.
I want to add that if it is an occasional piece of brass flying over I don't bother. But if it is constant then see above.
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But even if the shooter turns out to be an asshole, at least you went out of your way to try to be an Ambassador to the Shooting Sports!
You're always going to run into someone who doesn't give a sh*t about others. Not much you can do so don't let it bother you. If the problem continues get the attention of the RO. That usually clears up any problems.
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I always go up to the person and ask nicely to do something about it. And I have had some mokes tell me to F@ck off. I then talk to the range officer and they make them contain their brass. Also, they will announce it when the range first opens that you are required to contain your brass. So if they don't the range officers will make them. BTW that applies to the pistol side as well.
I want to add that if it is an occasional piece of brass flying over I don't bother. But if it is constant then see above.
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Required To contain brass?
Is that a published notice?
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Never heard anyone say to contain brass. Most people are asking me if I want mine (I don't reload, so I usually give to whomever wants).
Some people are inconsiderate, OTOH even if you have a catcher occasionally one gets flung randomly. I had one get embed itself in a wooden post once.
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No matter how "seriously" I take my shooting practice (working on aim, firearm operation/muscle memory, trigger and breath control, etc.), I also go there for fun. It's work to make and haul target frames, clear, clean and lug the guns to the truck, grab the correct ammo cans for the day, sort through the gear, drive across the island and back, carry everything to the pistol or rifle area, and maybe have to sign the wait list on a busy day. But once you're on the firing line and start squeezing off rounds, the thrill is there every single time!
If you're in that frame of mind, something as small as flying brass hitting you is just a part of the day. I remember one time on the rifle side, these three yutes ( :) ) were obviously taking turns with one of the group's new rifle. They kept ejecting brass all around and onto my bench. I just picked it up where I could reach, and asked if they wanted it back. They said no, so I threw it in my brass box. It was to the point that some of their brass was landing in my catcher! I asked them to remember how they did that so all their brass would collect itself!
I just thought it was a fun day. No sense in getting mad.
Now, it might be different if the brass-slinger was also trying to collect his brass. At that point, I'd suggest he invest in a brass catcher and explain how that helps him as well as prevents him from annoying others.
People who frequent the range see others using catchers and pick up on why it's useful. Those people will buy one of their own accord. The ones who go shooting every 3-6 months or less won't care enough to spend the money.
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My "brass catcher" is one of those $5 foldable laundry hampers from Walmart. Doesn't work so well on pistol side though.
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Nope, in my opinion, shouldn't be required. It's all a part of shooting at a range as far as I'm concerned. I personally use a brass catcher as I'm way too lazy to chase down all my brass and because I don't want my brass hitting my neighbor. But to require it, definitely no. As far as ROs getting involved, they should be concentrating on keeping the line safe.
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I've never had a problem getting hit with brass.
It's par for the course when you go to a shooting range.
It always makes me laugh when people get real bent out of shape because brass hits them.
Get a new hobby if it bothers you that much.
It's like being a swimmer and not wanting to get wet.
I've seen one douchebag at Kokohead try and start a fight with some guy because his $7000 gun got paint nicked from the other guys brass.
What a dick, I actually stepped in and told him to calm down.
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For ARs you can trim the ejector or the spring to maintain your brass
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Required To contain brass?
Is that a published notice?
Sorry, I'm getting old. The words I wanted to use were eluding me at the time I wrote this. This is happening more and more to me lately.
I don't think it is published notice but the range officers do usually "remind" us at the beginning of shooting to keep ones brass from hitting your neighbor.
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Had my nice wood guns and NF scopes bombed by fellow shooters. Just informed shooters of what was happening. Most didn't know what was going on and corrected shooting position or blocked brass. Cool...
When I had my HK91 accidentally burnt a Bro's back right through his shirt 2 benches down. Those fluted chambers spit out some hot brass with authority enough to cover your right flank. Felt real bad... WTF...
Not a way to make friends either. Always best to be cortious and aware of other shooter's safety.
On a hot note a young lady wearing short shorts showing a little to much skin got a 22LR brass down her behind. It went all the way down got up and screamed. Got branded by a Super X. Lol.... :geekdanc:
Aloha
:shaka:
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Sorry, I'm getting old. The words I wanted to use were eluding me at the time I wrote this. This is happening more and more to me lately.
I don't think it is published notice but the range officers do usually "remind" us at the beginning of shooting to keep ones brass from hitting your neighbor.
They make an announcement to police your brass, I've never heard them say to protect your neighbors from your brass.
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I don't think it's possible to force anybody to put up a barrier.
It's like trying to force every driver to obey the speed limit. Ain't gonna happen.
Should be pretty simple to build a net to clamp to the bench to block the brass.
You could probably build a few and sell them.
We have laws for speed...
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We have laws for speed...
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Not from what I see out there. :rofl:
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We have laws for speed...
Don't even start with that.
Next thing you know there will be some blowhard trying to pass more laws and restrictions then there already are.
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if it bothers you ask politely to correct the issue, lets not add more rules and regulations on top of the mountain of rules and regulations currently in effect, Next itll be new rule, load one at a time to avoid raining brass upon the next bench over. Ive been rained on and not bothered, ive also asked that the brass be deflected in some way or reduced, ive rained on others and corrected it just out of awareness and courtesy to them. Its a range, brass flies, nature of the beast.
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Thank to all for your replies, I knew there would be a lot of good discussion but I'm somewhat taken back by the acceptance of injury. The stories shared leads me to believe that safety is conditional and that we need RO to monitor us because we can't safely monitor our selves without someone telling us. Why then is it mandatory to wear hearing protection and safety glasses, doesn't it make sense too? Wouldn't it suck if we were told that we could only single load? Why wait for that to happen? I'm bummed that the range shrunk to 100 yds. Cause and effect.
Call me a blowhard, maybe in my initial post, I should have used a softer word then mandatory, but the bottom line that I'm suggesting is to practice better safety before we loose our privilege to shoot. Remember there are a lot of groups tying to keep us from bearing arms, I don't want to give them more reasons to stop us.
All it takes is one incident, as we saw happen.
Aloha
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Thank to all for your replies, I knew there would be a lot of good discussion but I'm somewhat taken back by the acceptance of injury. The stories shared leads me to believe that safety is conditional and that we need RO to monitor us because we can't safely monitor our selves without someone telling us. Why then is it mandatory to wear hearing protection and safety glasses, doesn't it make sense too? Wouldn't it suck if we were told that we could only single load? Why wait for that to happen? I'm bummed that the range shrunk to 100 yds. Cause and effect.
Call me a blowhard, maybe in my initial post, I should have used a softer word then mandatory, but the bottom line that I'm suggesting is to practice better safety before we loose our privilege to shoot. Remember there are a lot of groups tying to keep us from bearing arms, I don't want to give them more reasons to stop us.
All it takes is one incident, as we saw happen.
Aloha
The range has all the mandatory safety features they are required to have. They require individuals bring mandatory ear and eye protection which they do not furnish.
Do you think, if flying brass was such a safety issue, they would hesitate to install position dividers or make brass catchers mandatory?
People get all kinds of injuries at the range, but they are very minor. Slide bite, hot brass burns, and falling while walking to set up and retrieve targets are just a few.
If this issue was serious, I'm sure the RSO would make nets mandatory, or the C&C would fund to install dividers to keep the brass in your own area.
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Thank to all for your replies, I knew there would be a lot of good discussion but I'm somewhat taken back by the acceptance of injury.
All it takes is one incident, as we saw happen.
Aloha
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Somebody got injured by brass?
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if it bothers you ask politely to correct the issue, lets not add more rules and regulations on top of the mountain of rules and regulations currently in effect, Next itll be new rule, load one at a time to avoid raining brass upon the next bench over. Ive been rained on and not bothered, ive also asked that the brass be deflected in some way or reduced, ive rained on others and corrected it just out of awareness and courtesy to them. Its a range, brass flies, nature of the beast.
:thumbsup:
yes brother, no more new rules, "Its a range, brass flies, nature of the beast."
Hot brass flying at me reminds me that I'm in Amerrrrrica, the greatest country in the world.
however I have occasionally apologized in advance to neighbors, they always take it well
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Muzzle breaks are more annoying to me than flying brass.
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I don't think it should be mandatory but at the same time people should show consideration for others. You don't need to spend a lot of money to contain your brass. Heck even using the wooden rest they provide is a pretty decent barrier when positioned right. I've seen Slick use this for several shooters who didn't have a catcher.
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its like a fence around your house
not required, but fences make good neighbors
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:thumbsup:
yes brother, no more new rules, "Its a range, brass flies, nature of the beast."
Hot brass flying at me reminds me that I'm in Amerrrrrica, the greatest country in the world.
however I have occasionally apologized in advance to neighbors, they always take it well
I bring a pistol brass catcher to collect my brass. Sometimes, the brass catcher misses the brass, oh well.
I don't mind the flying brass at all. It's part of my enjoyment of being in the range. Brings a smile to my face every time. Loud gunfire, flying hot brass, the satisfying dinging of metal targets, they all remind me of the little freedom we enjoy here on our commie run island.
Murica!
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I bring a pistol brass catcher to collect my brass. Sometimes, the brass catcher misses the brass, oh well.
I don't mind the flying brass at all. It's part of my enjoyment of being in the range. Brings a smile to my face every time. Loud gunfire, flying hot brass, the satisfying dinging of metal targets, they all remind me of the little freedom we enjoy here on our commie run island.
Murica!
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Amen brother.
I would like to add something here. Take a look at these pictures attached.
One pic is some random rifle match on the mainland.
The other is a fun pistol match with my friends.
You will notice no brass catchers, no nets, no barriers of any sort.
If you happen to be in a war zone, you won't see brass barriers either.
You must dress appropriately, adapt, and focus on the task at hand
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I've been hit by spent cases as well.
I wish people were more considerate to others, but its not required.
last time i went, an ejected brass opened a small cut on my forehead
but it was from my own 1911. the brass hit the wood roof support and came back and hit me in the forehead.
but i didn't even flinch. kept on shooting. LOL. :thumbsup:
How many stitches were needed?
Terrifying story!! :shake: :shake:
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Amen brother.
I would like to add something here. Take a look at these pictures attached.
One pic is some random rifle match on the mainland.
The other is a fun pistol match with my friends.
You will notice no brass catchers, no nets, no barriers of any sort.
If you happen to be in a war zone, you won't see brass barriers either.
You must dress appropriately, adapt, and focus on the task at hand
X2
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I think liberals have infiltrated our ranks
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Amen brother.
I would like to add something here. Take a look at these pictures attached.
One pic is some random rifle match on the mainland.
The other is a fun pistol match with my friends.
You will notice no brass catchers, no nets, no barriers of any sort.
If you happen to be in a war zone, you won't see brass barriers either.
You must dress appropriately, adapt, and focus on the task at hand
Haha is that Ed M acting RSO?
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Amen brother.
One pic is some random rifle match on the mainland.
Looks like the All Guard team.
I got burned by brass from someone else, bubbled and turned into a scab. I accept it as part of the sport like getting bit by mosquitoes while camping. On the other hand, there are complete arses out there. I shoot on the prone side often and there was a casual shooter who dumped a full 30 round mag on me until the RO told him he only could load 5 at a time. No apologies and he did know he was dumping his brass on me.
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Haha is that Ed M acting RSO?
Actually I think the reason they don't need barriers for spent casings is because Ed can catch all of them before they hit others or hit the ground. Ninja status.
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Comon people its just brass. So what if it hits your nightforce or fancy rifle....you spent that much money for a durable product right? Than don't cry when a piece of stray brass hits it. If a nightforce can stop a bullet (which they have) than it can handle a casing.
And about brass hitting people. If it bugs you that much just ask the person to block the brass. I have personally had plenty of brass rain down on me and get stuck on my neck as we were firing on line moving up to the target and that HURTS. So having a stray casing bounce off of you every once in a while is seriously NOT a big deal, especially since you can just flick it off and don't have to suffer through it fusing to your neck lol.
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Thank to all for your replies, I knew there would be a lot of good discussion but I'm somewhat taken back by the acceptance of injury. The stories shared leads me to believe that safety is conditional and that we need RO to monitor us because we can't safely monitor our selves without someone telling us. Why then is it mandatory to wear hearing protection and safety glasses, doesn't it make sense too? Wouldn't it suck if we were told that we could only single load? Why wait for that to happen? I'm bummed that the range shrunk to 100 yds. Cause and effect.
Call me a blowhard, maybe in my initial post, I should have used a softer word then mandatory, but the bottom line that I'm suggesting is to practice better safety before we loose our privilege to shoot. Remember there are a lot of groups tying to keep us from bearing arms, I don't want to give them more reasons to stop us.
All it takes is one incident, as we saw happen.
Aloha
That fact that you say privilege to shoot just drives me up the wall.
Its a damn shame that in the state of Hawaii it is a fucking PRIVILEGE to shoot.
And what's with the whole only 5 rounds at a time and no human silhouettes rule? What did someone get scared about that?
Is this state so back asswards that it forbades its own people from training to defend themselves?!
When the state forbades the people from being able to adequately arm and train themselves there is a MAJOR problem. They give you just enough so the NRA doesn't get involved and whoop their asses, but they take just enough to the point where we are all under armed and trained.
Its fucking bullshit.
End rant
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Haha is that Ed M acting RSO?
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Yep
We call it the e.m. memorial match.
Just some old boys having fun.
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Looks like the All Guard team.
I got burned by brass from someone else, bubbled and turned into a scab. I accept it as part of the sport like getting bit by mosquitoes while camping. On the other hand, there are complete arses out there. I shoot on the prone side often and there was a casual shooter who dumped a full 30 round mag on me until the RO told him he only could load 5 at a time. No apologies and he did know he was dumping his brass on me.
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Yeah it was a nat. Guard pic off the web.
The worst brass burn I had was a piece that fell inside my glasses so it kept pressing against my face.
Hurt like a sob! Had a burn mark for a long time but no scar.
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That fact that you say privilege to shoot just drives me up the wall.
Its a damn shame that in the state of Hawaii it is a fucking PRIVILEGE to shoot.
And what's with the whole only 5 rounds at a time and no human silhouettes rule? What did someone get scared about that?
Is this state so back asswards that it forbades its own people from training to defend themselves?!
When the state forbades the people from being able to adequately arm and train themselves there is a MAJOR problem. They give you just enough so the NRA doesn't get involved and whoop their asses, but they take just enough to the point where we are all under armed and trained.
Its fucking bullshit.
End rant
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Great rant but you preaching to the choir
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I bring a pistol brass catcher to collect my brass. Sometimes, the brass catcher misses the brass, oh well.
I don't mind the flying brass at all. It's part of my enjoyment of being in the range. Brings a smile to my face every time. Loud gunfire, flying hot brass, the satisfying dinging of metal targets, they all remind me of the little freedom we enjoy here on our commie run island.
Murica!
i hear you, and the sweet smell of gunsmoke, it's all part of the enjoymentr :thumbsup: :shaka:
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'Murica!
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however, i'm open to brass catcher ideas, is there a brass catcher design topic? could someone post a link to it?
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however, i'm open to brass catcher ideas, is there a brass catcher design topic? could someone post a link to it?
https://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=4786.0
I use a fishing net on a jack stand.
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https://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=4786.0
I use a fishing net on a jack stand.
it says photo no longer available(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/05/22/0cf4c1fce85502d551df61c0da7c0536.jpg)
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it says photo no longer available(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/05/22/0cf4c1fce85502d551df61c0da7c0536.jpg)
sorry, I deleted that pic from flickr.
but its pretty much just a jack stand for a car, with a fishing net shoved in the top. LOL.
$5 for the net, and I already had the jack stand.
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I use a nice net screen my friend made out of a laundry bag, ping pong net table clamps and aluminum tent poles. Sometime when we have tables side by side and no brass catcher we put the semi-autos on the left table and bolts on the right. That way we are generally only raining down hot brass from hell on each other!
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Maybe I'll take my left ejecting Tavor and a right ejecting AK so I can be an equal opportunity "make it rain" shooter.
:rofl:
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I understand from a courtesy aspect but isn't this thread making a mountain out of a molehill?
Just take up knitting or play cards for crying out loud.
I've been hit by brass and steel cased ammo, and I do use a catcher for the record.
Seems like both sides of the coin making trouble.
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If it's that big of a deal for an individual, said individual should take off one of his screen windows from his home and clamp it to his bench but on his left side...This way stray brass will bounce off the screen and not hit him.......
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If it's that big of a deal for an individual, said individual should take off one of his screen windows from his home and clamp it to his bench but on his left side...This way stray brass will bounce off the screen and not hit him.......
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I use a window screen attached to my shooting gear bag.
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If you really want to be a nice guy, bring an extra brass catcher and if needed lend it to the bench where the brass is coming from.
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I use a nice net screen my friend made out of a laundry bag, ping pong net table clamps and aluminum tent poles. Sometime when we have tables side by side and no brass catcher we put the semi-autos on the left table and bolts on the right. That way we are generally only raining down hot brass from hell on each other!
There may be just one thing more 'Murican than raining brass on thine neighbor, raining brass on thine self! ARRRRRRRRGH!
(http://d1h1icg9nkzvny.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/nuAi0osfKF4Kzi8Ugm45DOaPCHw-e1353483148974.jpg)
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https://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=4786.0
I use a fishing net on a jack stand.
ty stang :shaka:
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If it's that big of a deal for an individual, said individual should take off one of his screen windows from his home and clamp it to his bench but on his left side...This way stray brass will bounce off the screen and not hit him.......
I've always wondered about that but never seen it.
If you are worried about being hit by brass, bring a brass deflector of some sort and set it up on the left side.
Smart.
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My SCAR 17 drops brass over my right shoulder about 1 foot away. Perfect gun.
My VEPR shoots brass forward at about a 45 degree angle.
Both perfect Kokohead guns.
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My SCAR 17 drops brass over my right shoulder about 1 foot away. Perfect gun.
My VEPR shoots brass forward at about a 45 degree angle.
Both perfect Kokohead guns.
So if my arsenal punts casings at my 3 o'clock 6 yards away..... :rofl:
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So if my arsenal punts casings at my 3 o'clock 6 yards away..... :rofl:
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Sometimes I do shooting matches where competitors are on a firing line.
I am happy to eject brass on my neighbor as it is a subtle way to gain a little edge.
Dirty pool? Maybe. But all's fair .....