2aHawaii
General Topics => Political Discussion => Topic started by: macsak on December 12, 2019, 02:28:33 PM
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sCMTggzkKk
USMCA passed
phase I china deal seems to be going through
boris Johnson leading exit polling
winning!
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sCMTggzkKk
USMCA passed
phase I china deal seems to be going through
boris Johnson leading exit polling
winning!
The world gets tossed a few scraps and your video guy thinks we are free?
I'm old, somewhat of a Libertarian, I hate Democrats, and I don't talk to any
government agents if I can help it. I'm free because I ignore our "stupid" laws.
Not because some Democrat/socialist/monarch tosses me some scraps.
We are all free, until we submit to that which we know is wrong.
Having said that, don't do stupid, and select your battles carefully.
I'm going to twist a famous quote,
"Your job is not to die for your ideology, your job is to make the other Bastard
die for his".
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sCMTggzkKk
USMCA passed
phase I china deal seems to be going through
boris Johnson leading exit polling
winning!
No.
Actually loosing BADLY.
Impeachment proceeding still going through.
More gun control laws.
More illegal immigration.
Higher national deficit and debt.
No border wall.
No halt of America's illegal wars of aggression.
Pissing off Russia, China, Iran, and DPRK even more...
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No.
Actually loosing BADLY.
Impeachment proceeding still going through.
More gun control laws.
More illegal immigration.
Higher national deficit and debt.
No border wall.
No halt of America's illegal wars of aggression.
Pissing off Russia, China, Iran, and DPRK even more...
some people will be mad for their whole lives and just sit there in a pool of tantrums... :(
but
Jesus still loves you :shaka:
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No.
Actually loosing BADLY.
Impeachment proceeding still going through.
More gun control laws.
More illegal immigration.
Higher national deficit and debt.
No border wall.
No halt of America's illegal wars of aggression.
Pissing off Russia, China, Iran, and DPRK even more...
you forgot:
Fascist goons
Distressed people
ICBM silos
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you forgot:
Fascist goons
Distressed people
ICBM silos
you forgot:
heads
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How bout commie, pinko bastards! O0
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you forgot:
Fascist goons
Distressed people
ICBM silos
There's more:
More states becoming democrat strongholds.
Gun confiscation beginning in Virginia.
More tax dollars being sent to the military instead of domestic spending.
More desperate acts of violence in Hawaii.
More "shoot first and claim self-defense later" law enforcement officers.
Property taxes will increase soon locally.
We are definitely loosing.
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How bout commie, pinko bastards! O0
you WAYCIST!
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No.
Actually loosing BADLY.
Impeachment proceeding still going through.
More gun control laws.
More illegal immigration.
Higher national deficit and debt.
No border wall.
No halt of America's illegal wars of aggression.
Pissing off Russia, China, Iran, and DPRK even more...
Since you apparently know how to get America from “loosing” to winning, let’s hear it.
You think we need to subjugate America to making “nice nice” with Russia, China, Iran, DPRK, and others? Are you serious? You think Hawaii would’ve been better off if the Axis had prevailed? Really?!?!
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"Since you apparently know how to get America from “loosing” to winning, let’s hear it."
Depending how you define winning, I do not think there is anything one can do to get America winning again.
As with all empires in history, the US empire is a now in its decline phase and there is nothing anyone can do now to reverse the unenviable outcome. Charismatic and cult personality leaders like Trump, who at least purports conservative values and takes those action that he thinks will help, are only stop-gap measures at best as well as outliers. Once he is out of office, mainstream politics will resume and continue those neoconservative and neoliberal foreign and domestic policies that has brought about and will further America's decline.
Hence, Americans are loosing with their nation state eventually changing into something liberally different or Balkanizing like the former Soviet Union.
"You think we need to subjugate America to making “nice nice” with Russia, China, Iran, DPRK, and others? Are you serious?"
Yes, I am serious.
America has historically been an isolationist country and never wanted to bother or be bothered by any other nation. Particularly after the illegal annexation of Hawaii in 1898, America has been highjacked by imperial globalists who believe every nation has to be a vassal state and pay tribute to the US in the form of cheap labor, oil, or some other type of commodity. Failure to comply results in tariffs, covert color revolutions, illegal overthrows, proxy wars, or false pretext led aggressive invasions. Those nations you listed REFUSE to be vassals of the declining US EMPIRE.
"You think Hawaii would’ve been better off if the Axis had prevailed? Really?!?!"
Can't answer that one, but as Hawaii was illegally annexed by then till the present, Hawaii has and continues to be in harms way in those nations who wish freedom from the ever declining shadow of the American empire.
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"Since you apparently know how to get America from “loosing” to winning, let’s hear it."
Depending how you define winning, I do not think there is anything one can do to get America winning again.
As with all empires in history, the US empire is a now in its decline phase and there is nothing anyone can do now to reverse the unenviable outcome. Charismatic and cult personality leaders like Trump, who at least purports conservative values and takes those action that he thinks will help, are only stop-gap measures at best as well as outliers. Once he is out of office, mainstream politics will resume and continue those neoconservative and neoliberal foreign and domestic policies that has brought about and will further America's decline.
Hence, Americans are loosing with their nation state eventually changing into something liberally different or Balkanizing like the former Soviet Union.
"You think we need to subjugate America to making “nice nice” with Russia, China, Iran, DPRK, and others? Are you serious?"
Yes, I am serious.
America has historically been an isolationist country and never wanted to bother or be bothered by any other nation. Particularly after the illegal annexation of Hawaii in 1898, America has been highjacked by imperial globalists who believe every nation has to be a vassal state and pay tribute to the US in the form of cheap labor, oil, or some other type of commodity. Failure to comply results in tariffs, covert color revolutions, illegal overthrows, proxy wars, or false pretext led aggressive invasions. Those nations you listed REFUSE to be vassals of the declining US EMPIRE.
"You think Hawaii would’ve been better off if the Axis had prevailed? Really?!?!"
Can't answer that one, but as Hawaii was illegally annexed by then till the present, Hawaii has and continues to be in harms way in those nations who wish freedom from the ever declining shadow of the American empire.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: you must be wearing some serious industrial grade tinfoil
Do you vote?
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:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: you must be wearing some serious industrial grade tinfoil
Do you vote?
Is that the best you can offer? Do you vote? :rofl:
Getting old Ren. :sleeping:
As always, you resort to personal attacks and try to reframe the argument, since you can not refute the points I raise.
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Is that the best you can offer? Do you vote? :rofl:
Getting old Ren. :sleeping:
As always, you resort to personal attacks and try to reframe the argument, since you can not refute the points I raise.
What's getting old is your Anti-American, kick-everyone-out-who-is-not-native rhetoric.
Nothing to contribute as a gun owner. Equipment reviews? Reloading tips? Shooting tips?
The OP's title was "Why its good to be free" and I think it was appropriate given the season of thankfulness. It's like watching a beautiful, postcard-worthy sunset then someone comes by and says "Well that's another day gone in our lives...one day closer to death" :'(
then you did a Greta Thunberg with some emo music playing in that background....perhaps Depeche Mode and the Cure or how about Linkin Park?
white noise....
Merry Christmas! :shaka:
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"What's getting old is your Anti-American, kick-everyone-out-who-is-not-native rhetoric."
In all the exchanges you and I ever had, you still have not heard carefully of the things I ever clarified with respect to illegal occupation of Hawaii by the US, especially the ridiculous notion of kicking non-US government employed people out.
"Nothing to contribute as a gun owner. Equipment reviews? Reloading tips? Shooting tips?"
Are you drinking too much eggnog? This is the sub forum of political discussion.
"The OP's title was "Why its good to be free" and I think it was appropriate given the season of thankfulness. It's like watching a beautiful, postcard-worthy sunset then someone comes by and says "Well that's another day gone in our lives...one day closer to death" :'(
then you did a Greta Thunberg with some emo music playing in that background....perhaps Depeche Mode and the Cure or how about Linkin Park?"
If you wish to critique the tone of my response, why did you not comment on Groveler' post as well? He had some contrasting things to say to the OP.
I'll tell you why not. You just don't like anything any critical thinking Hawaiian has to say. That's why.
In fact, if it was Flapp-Jackson who made the observations I posted, you probably would have said nothing, but kowtowed to him.
Merry Christmas!
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"What's getting old is your Anti-American, kick-everyone-out-who-is-not-native rhetoric."
In all the exchanges you and I ever had, you still have not heard carefully of the things I ever clarified with respect to illegal occupation of Hawaii by the US, especially the ridiculous notion of kicking non-US government employed people out.
"Nothing to contribute as a gun owner. Equipment reviews? Reloading tips? Shooting tips?"
Are you drinking too much eggnog? This is the sub forum of political discussion.
"The OP's title was "Why its good to be free" and I think it was appropriate given the season of thankfulness. It's like watching a beautiful, postcard-worthy sunset then someone comes by and says "Well that's another day gone in our lives...one day closer to death" :'(
then you did a Greta Thunberg with some emo music playing in that background....perhaps Depeche Mode and the Cure or how about Linkin Park?"
If you wish to critique the tone of my response, why did you not comment on Groveler' post as well? He had some contrasting things to say to the OP.
I'll tell you why not. You just don't like anything any critical thinking Hawaiian has to say. That's why.
In fact, if it was Flapp-Jackson who made the observations I posted, you probably would have said nothing, but kowtowed to him.
Merry Christmas!
Unprovable and unrelated hypothetical, hyperbolic bullcrap. :wtf:
if you want to drag me into this hissy fit, use actual facts, not some Liberal-esque straw man "never happened" rhetoric. :sleeping:
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Free & Winning!
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/stocks-score-another-round-of-records-after-phase-one-us-china-deal-2019-12-16?mod=mw_quote_news (https://www.marketwatch.com/story/stocks-score-another-round-of-records-after-phase-one-us-china-deal-2019-12-16?mod=mw_quote_news)
looking at a Tesla :D
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Free & Winning!
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/stocks-score-another-round-of-records-after-phase-one-us-china-deal-2019-12-16?mod=mw_quote_news (https://www.marketwatch.com/story/stocks-score-another-round-of-records-after-phase-one-us-china-deal-2019-12-16?mod=mw_quote_news)
looking at a Tesla :D
Oh no! Ren has fallen prisoner to freedom and capitalism!!! Oh no!!!! I can’t think of anything worse than to do better in your life and to buy yourself something you want. Oh no!!!
I see that Kuleana has posted that we keep heading down a certain path no matter who is in office. And to an extent, I agree with him Except that things reversed during the Reagan era, and some, not all things have reversed under Trump. We are certainly better off now than before Trump came into office. Most of the data proves that. I think removing regulations and renegotiating our trade deals are the biggest accomplishments Trump has done. The wall is being built, and immigration is under better but not good enough control. And I have seen some evidence that the wall is working where it has gone up.We need more of it, tho. Tax reductions were big but only go so far. The economy is great! We have stopped our starting of wars and have pulled back and out of most we were in. There are many more things but I think these are the biggies.
But we still continue down the path we don’t want. What path is that? Deficit spending. We need to stop and we need to do it soon. This will destroy our country in a heartbeat if not reined in in the next 40 or 50 years or so. Maybe less. Socialism is inevitable, I fear. We can stave it off for a while if we continue to vote in conservative values people. But until we get really serious about our deficit spending we are due for a huge correction. And it won’t be pretty.
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Oh no! Ren has fallen prisoner to freedom and capitalism!!! Oh no!!!! I can’t think of anything worse than to do better in your life and to buy yourself something you want. Oh no!!!
I see that Kuleana has posted that we keep heading down a certain path no matter who is in office. And to an extent, I agree with him Except that things reversed during the Reagan era, and some, not all things have reversed under Trump. We are certainly better off now than before Trump came into office. Most of the data proves that. I think removing regulations and renegotiating our trade deals are the biggest accomplishments Trump has done. The wall is being built, and immigration is under better but not good enough control. And I have seen some evidence that the wall is working where it has gone up.We need more of it, tho. Tax reductions were big but only go so far. The economy is great! We have stopped our starting of wars and have pulled back and out of most we were in. There are many more things but I think these are the biggies.
But we still continue down the path we don’t want. What path is that? Deficit spending. We need to stop and we need to do it soon. This will destroy our country in a heartbeat if not reined in in the next 40 or 50 years or so. Maybe less. Socialism is inevitable, I fear. We can stave it off for a while if we continue to vote in conservative values people. But until we get really serious about our deficit spending we are due for a huge correction. And it won’t be pretty.
Excellent explanation in regards to how nations spending beyond their means are doomed to suffer the fate of Rome.
Like I said in my earlier post. Whether one still believes the US is an empire or republic, the fact remains the US is spending way beyond its means. In particular, the US is spending way too much on the military and too little on everything else that makes up discretionary spending in the budget. It is sheer lunacy to spend that amount on the military if the goal is to defend the US, especially when you have more than enough nuclear missiles to not only deter any nation from invading its borders, but destroy all life on Earth many times over as well.
The only reason for that obscene waste of resources is to line the pockets of the military industrial complex, as President Eisenhower warned, and the to garrison the planet to maintain its global hegemony; both actions that the US can no longer afford to do. For all Trump has done to improve the domestic situation he inherited from the incompetent presidents before him, he has not balanced the US budget and only added to the US national debt. There is no reason to believe that an additional term for Trump in office would be no different.
In the end, the prognosis is still the same. Unless the US decides to give up its empire status and shut down its global military outposts, the US will continue to decline at the same pace largely due to its deficit spending and there is nothing any future US president can do to reverse that. In fact, once Trump is out of office, get ready for the US to break its own record of national debt increases. The question now is how many years does the US nation or empire has left before its final collapse. The scary thing for "Old School Americans" is that the final collapse can come much sooner than most people think.
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Way off topic, but freedom and ability to defend a nation/country is way more than having nukes...
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Way off topic, but freedom and ability to defend a nation/country is way more than having nukes...
There is no argument with that.
However, the US does not need the amount that it currently spends on the military to accomplish what you said, especially when such funds could be better spent on things like the boarder wall, better health care, domestic infrastructure repairs/improvement, water quality, cures for diseases, education, etc.
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Way off topic, but freedom and ability to defend a nation/country is way more than having nukes...
those ICBM silos are defending Hawaii extremely well, even us fascist goons...
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someone bought into that tank of black KoolAid the Dems been selling huh?
haters gonna hate while I'm eating crab and drinking Cristal every other night, loungin' in my infinity pool looking at the beautiful Hawaiian sunset. Can't wait to get my Tesla. :shaka:
#FascistGoonLife
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Way off topic, but freedom and ability to defend a nation/country is way more than having nukes...
I agree and this is where Kuleana and I part ways. I believe in military spending. Lot’s of it. I would rather have too much and not have to use it than not have enough when needed. I also feel we are way behind in hypersonic technology. Where I am sure we also part ways is in social programs. They obviously don’t work for the majority of those who need them. And one should only need them for a limited amount of time to give you time to get back on your feet. The real drag on our economy are social programs and wasted education funding. We are not getting results from education spending that we need. Mostly this is due to bloated government run education districts that just suck up money and produce children that do not produce and add to the economy enough.
Right now things are good and some freedom has been gained back since Trump came into office. But we need to get our spending under control. JMHO
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I agree and this is where Kuleana and I part ways. I believe in military spending. Lot’s of it. I would rather have too much and not have to use it than not have enough when needed. I also feel we are way behind in hypersonic technology. Where I am sure we also part ways is in social programs. They obviously don’t work for the majority of those who need them. And one should only need them for a limited amount of time to give you time to get back on your feet. The real drag on our economy are social programs and wasted education funding. We are not getting results from education spending that we need. Mostly this is due to bloated government run education districts that just suck up money and produce children that do not produce and add to the economy enough.
Right now things are good and some freedom has been gained back since Trump came into office. But we need to get our spending under control. JMHO
A lot of the opinions of military spending truly isn’t fully informed about what we’re protecting against or deterring.
Don’t get me started on social programs. Maybe after my coffee... :rofl:
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Don’t get me started on social programs. Maybe after my coffee... :rofl:
On my third cup!!! :o :o :o :o
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On my third cup!!! :o :o :o :o
And opinions AREN’T...
Grammah Natzees 🤪😝
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And opinions AREN’T...
Grammah Natzees 🤪😝
CHEE HUUUUUUU!!!!!
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I agree and this is where Kuleana and I part ways. I believe in military spending. Lot’s of it. I would rather have too much and not have to use it than not have enough when needed. I also feel we are way behind in hypersonic technology. Where I am sure we also part ways is in social programs. They obviously don’t work for the majority of those who need them. And one should only need them for a limited amount of time to give you time to get back on your feet. The real drag on our economy are social programs and wasted education funding. We are not getting results from education spending that we need. Mostly this is due to bloated government run education districts that just suck up money and produce children that do not produce and add to the economy enough.
Right now things are good and some freedom has been gained back since Trump came into office. But we need to get our spending under control. JMHO
I agree 100%!
I will only add this. I've been in the military, worked in Aerospace, and Academic/science industries.
My observations over a life of work, any time you get the government involved, it becomes
politicized, and waste follows, because of politics.
Merry Christmas.
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I'd like to add that most people don't understand the research, development and procurement process, nor how long that can take for major weapons systems.
Most focus on bullets, rifles, and tanks.
They don't think about a high tech fighter plane or drone that cost MILLIONS PER COPY.
They don't know that the military AND PRIVATE COMPANIES spend years and BILLIONS on research and development, most of which never makes it into production. A better widget beats it to market, a better countermeasure is developed making the thing obsolete before it's deployed (think anti-tank missiles that make a new tank vulnerable), or military contracts and support spending is used as political footballs to keep jobs in one district versus others.
I worked on the E-3 AWACS program for over 5 years. Just that one platform included radar, communications, mission computers, and other systems separate and apart from the actual airframe -- a modified Boeing 707. The technology was being upgraded constantly, and the systems had to function within the confines of the resources on the aircraft including power, cooling and space.
When a system is funded, it takes years to develop, test, modify and certify them before they can be deployed for real world operations. That's not cheap, especially when you can't run out to Walmart and pick up the parts you need when something breaks. Ongoing maintenance and parts procurement must be in place to ensure the warfighters aren't on the sidelines while their equipment awaits repairs.
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I agree 100%!
I will only add this. I've been in the military, worked in Aerospace, and Academic/science industries.
My observations over a life of work, any time you get the government involved, it becomes
politicized, and waste follows, because of politics.
Merry Christmas.
I couldn’t agree more. We need government for some things. We just need them for a few things. I am sure there is plenty of waste in our military. However, I think they are doing a good job with what they have to work with. And with Trump directing I am sure they will get more of what they need. Even with the waste.
Merry Christmas to you and yours.
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I agree and this is where Kuleana and I part ways. I believe in military spending. Lot’s of it. I would rather have too much and not have to use it than not have enough when needed. I also feel we are way behind in hypersonic technology. Where I am sure we also part ways is in social programs. They obviously don’t work for the majority of those who need them. And one should only need them for a limited amount of time to give you time to get back on your feet. The real drag on our economy are social programs and wasted education funding. We are not getting results from education spending that we need. Mostly this is due to bloated government run education districts that just suck up money and produce children that do not produce and add to the economy enough.
Right now things are good and some freedom has been gained back since Trump came into office. But we need to get our spending under control. JMHO
I am surprised you made the above comment as you did.
You said countries who do not control their deficit spending are doomed in the long-run. However, your comments above suggest you don't mind if the US overspends beyond its means if it is to the military. Don't you see that it is this overspending you said you were against, but hypocritically support for the military that will doom the US in the long-run, as did the Rome and the Soviet Union?
Every nation needs to maintain a military that can protect its interests, but the US has a military that definitely not only goes beyond defending its borders, but geared for global domination that it no longer can afford. Seeing how the US military budget is far greater than Russia, China, Iran, and the DPRK's respective budgets combined, this is clear evidence that it is a gross misallocation of funds. I would be willing to wager if the US diverted just 25% of its annual military budget to cure cancer for the next deccade, the US can be forever remembered and loved as the conqueror of that disease, instead of the global hegemon, as it is regarded today.
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I am surprised you made the above comment as you did.
You said countries who do not control their deficit spending are doomed in the long-run. However, your comments above suggest you don't mind if the US overspends beyond its means if it is to the military. Don't you see that it is this overspending you said you were against, but hypocritically support for the military that will doom the US in the long-run, as did the Rome and the Soviet Union?
Every nation needs to maintain a military that can protect its interests, but the US has a military that definitely not only goes beyond defending its borders, but geared for global domination that it no longer can afford. Seeing how the US military budget is far greater than Russia, China, Iran, and the DPRK's respective budgets combined, this is clear evidence that it is a gross misallocation of funds. I would be willing to wager if the US diverted just 25% of its annual military budget to cure cancer for the next deccade, the US can be forever remembered and loved as the conqueror of that disease, instead of the global hegemon, as it is regarded today.
there are millions of people illegally in this country, and thousands more trying to get in each day, curious as to why they would want to come to a country that is regarded as a global hegemon?
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there are millions of people illegally in this country, and thousands more trying to get in each day, curious as to why they would want to come to a country that is regarded as a global hegemon?
(http://markwatches.net/reviews/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/oh_snap.gif)
because:
Free medical!
Free education!
Free food!
Free dental!...well maybe...
#heads
#distressed
#IllegalOccupation
#FascistGoons
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there are millions of people illegally in this country, and thousands more trying to get in each day, curious as to why they would want to come to a country that is regarded as a global hegemon?
How about the Democrats and liberals promising free everything to these people in exchange for votes in political elections at the expense of US taxpayers and citizenry?
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How about the Democrats and liberals promising free everything to these people in exchange for votes in political elections at the expense of US taxpayers and citizenry?
hence, the title of this thread :rofl:
USA!
not only free stuff but most people are fleeing their distressed, occupied failed states
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I am surprised you made the above comment as you did.
You said countries who do not control their deficit spending are doomed in the long-run. However, your comments above suggest you don't mind if the US overspends beyond its means if it is to the military. Don't you see that it is this overspending you said you were against, but hypocritically support for the military that will doom the US in the long-run, as did the Rome and the Soviet Union?
Every nation needs to maintain a military that can protect its interests, but the US has a military that definitely not only goes beyond defending its borders, but geared for global domination that it no longer can afford. Seeing how the US military budget is far greater than Russia, China, Iran, and the DPRK's respective budgets combined, this is clear evidence that it is a gross misallocation of funds. I would be willing to wager if the US diverted just 25% of its annual military budget to cure cancer for the next deccade, the US can be forever remembered and loved as the conqueror of that disease, instead of the global hegemon, as it is regarded today.
Not to answer FOR Inspector, the answer is simple.
The Constitution gives the federal government a short list of duties. One primary duty is to "provide for the common defense."
Article I, Section 8 of the Constitution says:
11: To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;
12: To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;
13: To provide and maintain a Navy;
14: To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval Forces;
15: To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;
16: To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;
The social welfare programs designed to buy votes and keep people voting "Democrat" are not a responsibility of the US Gov't. Before the welfare state began, families, churches, charities and philanthropic organizations provided those services.
We had ONE homeless person in the city I grew up in, and he was an alcoholic with no family and refused help. However, we never saw him outside when it was cold out. He could always count on a place to stay and food to eat without any gov't handouts.
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I am surprised you made the above comment as you did.
You said countries who do not control their deficit spending are doomed in the long-run. However, your comments above suggest you don't mind if the US overspends beyond its means if it is to the military. Don't you see that it is this overspending you said you were against, but hypocritically support for the military that will doom the US in the long-run, as did the Rome and the Soviet Union?
Every nation needs to maintain a military that can protect its interests, but the US has a military that definitely not only goes beyond defending its borders, but geared for global domination that it no longer can afford. Seeing how the US military budget is far greater than Russia, China, Iran, and the DPRK's respective budgets combined, this is clear evidence that it is a gross misallocation of funds. I would be willing to wager if the US diverted just 25% of its annual military budget to cure cancer for the next deccade, the US can be forever remembered and loved as the conqueror of that disease, instead of the global hegemon, as it is regarded today.
Why are you so fixated on military spending? You really think spending for medical and other more noble endeavors aren’t wasteful?
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Not to answer FOR Inspector, the answer is simple.
The Constitution gives the federal government a short list of duties. One primary duty is to "provide for the common defense."
As a strict fan of the US Constitution, I really appreciate your latest post.
According to your quote, appropriation for money for the raising and supporting armies can only go on for two years, maximum. Hence, it is clear that the garrisoning of the planet with US bases today is definitely in violation of the US Constitution.
Furthermore, although the founding fathers could not have envisioned all of the modern aspects of today's military, the Constitution does not give a green light or blank check to military spending that has currently gone beyond the financial means of the nation.
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Why are you so fixated on military spending? You really think spending for medical and other more noble endeavors aren’t wasteful?
Yes; there is mass corruption in all areas in the discretionary side of the US budget.
It is just military spending accounts for at least half, if not more than half of that budget. Hence, the corruption and waste in military spending relatively dwarfs the corruption of the other areas.
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hence, the title of this thread :rofl:
USA!
not only free stuff but most people are fleeing their distressed, occupied failed states
Wow, I did not know that you are a liberal now who supports illegal immigration. :wtf:
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Wow, I did not know that you are a liberal now who supports illegal immigration. :wtf:
you must have missed the part in school where they explained sarcasm...
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As a strict fan of the US Constitution, I really appreciate your latest post.
According to your quote, appropriation for money for the raising and supporting armies can only go on for two years, maximum. Hence, it is clear that the garrisoning of the planet with US bases today is definitely in violation of the US Constitution.
Furthermore, although the founding fathers could not have envisioned all of the modern aspects of today's military, the Constitution does not give a green light or blank check to military spending that has currently gone beyond the financial means of the nation.
For a "strict fan of the Constitution," you sure don't seem to understand it. :wacko:
The 2 year limit is NOT related to the raising and supporting of armies, but to the appropriation process. in easy-to-understand words, it means the Congress can't pass a spending bill for the army that provides funding for more than 2 years at a time. They must appropriate funds for 1-2 year periods at a time. That provision gives the Congress the power to limit or expand the size of the military by putting them, as it stands, on an annual budget renewal schedule. It's why the annual fiscal year budget process is so important, yet the Congress can't seem to pass a budget on time to save their lives.
Also, you stopped reading too soon.
The gov't has a duty to train and equip ("organizing, arming, and disciplining") the military for use in times of conflict. Do you believe we can simply call up volunteers on a moment's notice to fight multiple, simultaneous conflicts in different theaters without having an ongoing peacetime mission to prepare?
If you look at the organization of the US military, the vast majority of commands exist to train -- schools, OJT, exercises, etc. When units are deployed, the entire command structure involved changes. Unified commanders, theater commanders and component commanders direct all services' assets to accomplish whatever mission they've been tasked to do.
So, there's really no disconnect with the standing army clause when you consider , by definition, reserves are not part of the standing army, and they make up the great majority of our armed forces. Plus, the Navy has no such 2 year appropriation limits.
Here's the history of it, in case you want to do something about your knowledge gaps: :geekdanc:
https://www.heritage.org/constitution/#!/articles/1/essays/52/army-clause
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I am surprised you made the above comment as you did.
You said countries who do not control their deficit spending are doomed in the long-run. However, your comments above suggest you don't mind if the US overspends beyond its means if it is to the military. Don't you see that it is this overspending you said you were against, but hypocritically support for the military that will doom the US in the long-run, as did the Rome and the Soviet Union?
Every nation needs to maintain a military that can protect its interests, but the US has a military that definitely not only goes beyond defending its borders, but geared for global domination that it no longer can afford. Seeing how the US military budget is far greater than Russia, China, Iran, and the DPRK's respective budgets combined, this is clear evidence that it is a gross misallocation of funds. I would be willing to wager if the US diverted just 25% of its annual military budget to cure cancer for the next deccade, the US can be forever remembered and loved as the conqueror of that disease, instead of the global hegemon, as it is regarded today.
I’m going to assume that you misunderstood what I said here rather than purposely attacking what I said. You are wrong about my intentions. Here is what I said in a nutshell. I support strong military spending, even more military spending. And I support cutting back in other areas (I specified education and social programs but there are plenty more) in order to bring us back to parity. I was VERY clear I do not support deficit spending. Period. But spending a billion more on military doesn’t mean I don’t support cutting back a trillion dollars somewhere else to get us away from deficit spending. For you to interpret my words any other way would be incorrect. I hope this clears up what I said.
Now as far as my supporting some of your wild claims about spending more on military will somehow take us into the same realm as the SU and Rome. I do not see any correlation between military spending and world domination within the US. As a matter if fact I currently see just the opposite. We have not started any new wars since Trump. I also see us pulling our troops out of wars where we should not be in. All the while we are spending more money than ever before. You cannot dispute these facts. We can spend a quadrillion dollars on military and if it not used to start wars then it is obvious to me your premise is wrong. Without intent and action by Socialist/Communist leaning people it is just spending money on military that has no correlation whatsoever to Rome and the SU. Countries who do not control their deficit spending are doomed to failure because of social/economic reasons. And I believe this is where we are headed. War is a step that is not always inevitable so I do not agree with your premise.
Also, I do not believe in Socialism/Communism. For the government to spend tax payer dollars to try and find a cure for cancer is part of the problem of deficit spending. You spend someone else’s money and get little to nothing in return. We have been throwing untold billions of dollars at the private sector to try and find a cure for over 50 years and have seen little to show for. Yes, we can stop it and remove it but we still can’t cure it.
The last thing you said is that every country needs a military to defend its interests. I only partially agree with this premise. Because every time we were attacked we needed to go on offense to stop the aggression. So just having defensive capabilities when the aggressors have offensive weapons is not very smart IMHO. If we spend so much that no one attacks us because of our lead in technology, no matter the amount we spend, it is worth every penny. JMHO
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Yes; there is mass corruption in all areas in the discretionary side of the US budget.
It is just military spending accounts for at least half, if not more than half of that budget. Hence, the corruption and waste in military spending relatively dwarfs the corruption of the other areas.
And you know this for a fact, how?
But I would agree that there's corruption and waste all over. Frankly, and sadly, much that the public doesn't see. Just wondering why you keep harping on military. . .
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you must have missed the part in school where they explained sarcasm...
Noooo wayyyyy. . . .
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#distressedForevah
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SNIP
The last thing you said is that every country needs a military to defend its interests. I only partially agree with this premise. Because every time we were attacked we needed to go on offense to stop the aggression. So just having defensive capabilities when the aggressors have offensive weapons is not very smart IMHO. If we spend so much that no one attacks us because of our lead in technology, no matter the amount we spend, it is worth every penny. JMHO
Going off topic, but the scene from Karate Kid when Mr. Miyagi asked Daniel-san "then why train?". . .
Back on topic, look back at history about what happened to countries that took a purely defensive stance on military. Particularly WWII.
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They don't know that the military AND PRIVATE COMPANIES spend years and BILLIONS on research and development
Mention the insane cost of preparing proposals that adhere to the insane mandatrory government bullsuiite. The PC boilerplate that has to be in every response to a RFP is out of control. Every step of a project is clogged up by oversight.
We would have lost WWII if the defense acquisition process was like it is now. Could not afford it, nothing would be ready in time.
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"The gov't has a duty to train and equip ("organizing, arming, and disciplining") the military for use in times of conflict. Do you believe we can simply call up volunteers on a moment's notice to fight multiple, simultaneous conflicts in different theaters without having an ongoing peacetime mission to prepare?"
That's the point I am trying to make; where in the US Constitution does it specifically state that the US needs to prepare to fight an all-out global or perpetual war? That's right, the US Constitution does not make any such provision.
The founding fathers KNEW the pitfalls and costs of maintaining a standing army; that was why they were against it. Moreover, according to Professor Gregory Foster, a West Point graduate and Vietnam veteran teaching at the National Defense University, says the founding fathers, if they were alive today, would definitely OBJECT to how today's military establishment has grown beyond to what they had originally envisioned them to be, where it is the nation's citizens determining the security and foreign policy of the country and NOT the other way around.
Please see https://www.defenseone.com/ideas/2013/07/why-founding-fathers-would-object-todays-military/66668/ for details.
That is why I and as many others, who believe in fiscal responsibility, take the position that the US budget reallocate to the military only those funds that ensure the nation's border integrity (not to fight global or perpetual wars) and is proportionally appropriate with respect to the spending of its military peers.
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"The gov't has a duty to train and equip ("organizing, arming, and disciplining") the military for use in times of conflict. Do you believe we can simply call up volunteers on a moment's notice to fight multiple, simultaneous conflicts in different theaters without having an ongoing peacetime mission to prepare?"
That's the point I am trying to make; where in the US Constitution does it specifically state that the US needs to prepare to fight an all-out global or perpetual war? That's right, the US Constitution does not make any such provision.
The Constitution is a rule book, not a complete guide to every decision in government. The Congress and President have roles in developing and executing our national security strategy. Why can't you accept that? The Constitution doesn't say the House can impeach on flimsy hearsay evidence that doesn't rise to the level of criminal conduct, either. Yet, here we are.
The founding fathers KNEW the pitfalls and costs of maintaining a standing army; that was why they were against it. Moreover, according to Professor Gregory Foster, a West Point graduate and Vietnam veteran teaching at the National Defense University, says the founding fathers, if they were alive today, would definitely OBJECT to how today's military establishment has grown beyond to what they had originally envisioned them to be, where it is the nation's citizens determining the security and foreign policy of the country and NOT the other way around.
Please see https://www.defenseone.com/ideas/2013/07/why-founding-fathers-would-object-todays-military/66668/ for details.
That is why I and as many others, who believe in fiscal responsibility, take the position that the US budget reallocate to the military only those funds that ensure the nation's border integrity (not to fight global or perpetual wars) and is proportionally appropriate with respect to the spending of its military peers.
Do you honestly believe the founders envisioned the technology, threats and scenarios that nations today have to deal with? There are plenty of things people attribute to some fictitious hypothetical, such as what the founders would say. it's easy to make such statements, because there is no way to ever prove you wrong ..... or right for that matter.
The founders included the Navy separately, because in their time, ships on water were the only means of projecting national power beyond ones shores. Now we have satellites, drones, long range missiles, cruise missiles, bombers, etc.
The US is the #1 Super Power in the world. We are the target of all other nations who want to increase their standing.
Do you not get that, without the best military on Earth, we would be inviting armed aggression from anyone who thought they could gain from it? "Peace through Strength."
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The Constitution is a rule book, not a complete guide to every decision in government. The Congress and President have roles in developing and executing our national security strategy. Why can't you accept that? The Constitution doesn't say the House can impeach on flimsy hearsay evidence that doesn't rise to the level of criminal conduct, either. Yet, here we are.
Exactly my point.
The kangaroo court that Trump will be subjected that the founding fathers would definitely be opposed is as Ludacris as the need to spend every discretionary dollar of the US budget on the military as well.
The founders included the Navy separately, because in their time, ships on water were the only means of projecting national power beyond ones shores. Now we have satellites, drones, long range missiles, cruise missiles, bombers, etc.
Exactly my point again.
If the US has a supreme advantage in technologically advanced weapons that has drastically diminished the need for large armies, navies, and garrisons all over the Earth, why does it continue to spend so much money to maintain those relics of the 20th century?
The US is the #1 Super Power in the world. We are the target of all other nations who want to increase their standing.
There is no debate that all nations want to be the top dog, but to actively believe that all nations want to start a war with the US in the age of nuclear missiles is as preposterous and being paranoid.
Do you not get that, without the best military on Earth, we would be inviting armed aggression from anyone who thought they could gain from it? "Peace through Strength."
That's such a fascist foreign relations view of things.
However, since it has been ONLY the US that has been conducting illegal invasions on sovereign nations for at least the last 30 years, it is the other nations in the World, who should be the ones to exercise such policy in fear of the US.
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However, since it has been ONLY the US that has been conducting illegal invasions on sovereign nations for at least the last 30 years, it is the other nations in the World, who should be the ones to exercise such policy in fear of the US.
LOL! What planet do you live on? Or should I ask, what alternate reality?
These are just the conflicts between 1990-2002:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars:_1990%E2%80%932002
Here's the list between 2003-Present:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars:_2003%E2%80%93present
You really enjoy making nonsensical, false statements to make your point, huh?
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LOL! What planet do you live on? Or should I ask, what alternate reality?
These are just the conflicts between 1990-2002:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars:_1990%E2%80%932002
Here's the list between 2003-Present:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars:_2003%E2%80%93present
You really enjoy making nonsensical, false statements to make your point, huh?
Those lists are very misleading.
They definitely are a listing of armed conflicts, but it does not clearly distinguish between wars between two sovereign countries and those whose nature is that of internal civil war, wars against terrorist organizations or drug cartels, and whatever else the authors felt they wanted to throw in.
For example, the list also mentions the standoff at Waco, Texas between the ATF et al. against the Branch Davidians. I guess David Koresh would have been honored to have being so dignified as having been a major nemesis to the US that Wikipedia felt that tragedy was worthy to be honored as such. :thumbsup:
I guess American military history teachers at West Point should include the standoff at Waco along side that of WWI, WWII, the Korean War, and etc. to their reading lists. :rofl:
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Those lists are very misleading.
They definitely are a listing of armed conflicts, but it does not clearly distinguish between wars between two sovereign countries and those whose nature is that of internal civil war, wars against terrorist organizations or drug cartels, and whatever else the authors felt they wanted to throw in.
For example, the list also mentions the standoff at Waco, Texas between the ATF et al. against the Branch Davidians. I guess David Koresh would have been honored to have being so dignified as having been a major nemesis to the US that Wikipedia felt that tragedy was worthy to be honored as such. :thumbsup:
I guess American military history teachers at West Point should include the standoff at Waco along side that of WWI, WWII, the Korean War, and etc. to their reading lists. :rofl:
When someone is trying to kill you, I don't think their motivation, national origin or lack of "sovereignty" is going to be your biggest concern.
Maybe you can make YOUR OWN list, since you don't agree with/like the one on Wikipedia. Better yet, stop making stupid comments before doing a Google search to see if what you're saying is a lie.
Oh, wait. You DID make your own list, and it only included one nation: The United States of America. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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The kangaroo court that Trump will be subjected that the founding fathers would definitely be opposed is as Ludacris as the need to spend every discretionary dollar of the US budget on the military as well.
Christopher Brian Bridges?