2aHawaii
General Topics => General Discussion => Topic started by: Thisismyusername on July 09, 2022, 05:50:09 PM
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I tried using the search function but the only thread specifically on the matter that was easily found was from 2012.
Im looking at the part of the law that says no go on ammo that's meant to "fragment".
Arguably FMJ hollow point isn't "designed to fragment" so it should be above board/legal?
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I tried using the search function but the only thread specifically on the matter that was easily found was from 2012.
Im looking at the part of the law that says no go on ammo that's meant to "fragment".
Arguably FMJ hollow point isn't "designed to fragment" so it should be above board/legal?
If JHP ammo was illegal (1) you would not be allowed to buy it, and (2) a bunch of us on this forum are in a heap o' trouble!
:geekdanc: :thumbsup:
Bullet designers actually want HP ammo to retain as much of its mass/weight as possible when it strikes the target. It's supposed to expand, not segment (the word actually used in the statute).
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Guess I got some selling to do.
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Guess I got some selling to do.
You lost me. Did you misunderstand? Jacketed Hollow Point (JHP) ammo is legal in Hawaii.
If you have something other that JHP that's part of this discussion, it's a good idea to not advertise.
Nobody on this forum does anything illegal. :shaka:
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I believe that part of the law is specifically regarding projectiles while hunting
It's actually separate from hunting.
ยง134-8 Ownership, etc., of automatic firearms, silencers, etc., prohibited; penalties.
(a) The manufacture, possession, sale, barter, trade, gift, transfer, or acquisition of any of
the following is prohibited: assault pistols, except as provided by section 134-4(e);
automatic firearms; rifles with barrel lengths less than sixteen inches; shotguns with barrel
lengths less than eighteen inches; cannons; mufflers, silencers, or devices for deadening or
muffling the sound of discharged firearms; hand grenades, dynamite, blasting caps, bombs,
or bombshells, or other explosives; or any type of ammunition or any projectile component
thereof coated with teflon or any other similar coating designed primarily to enhance its
capability to penetrate metal or pierce protective armor; and any type of ammunition or
any projectile component thereof designed or intended to explode or segment upon
impact with its target.
https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol03_Ch0121-0200D/HRS0134/HRS_0134-0008.htm
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It's actually separate from hunting.
https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol03_Ch0121-0200D/HRS0134/HRS_0134-0008.htm
So just curious.. 65g fragmenting (those plastic projectile) 9mm is illegal? I see it for sale at a LGS. Lol I never bought any tho cause I don't shoot steel plates close. Maybe 25 yards once every red moon.
I know it's meant for steel plates so you may shoot closer for practicing. I would argue that it disperse energy much better during a SD situation. I wouldnt want to overpenetrate into someone else's house. It seems like a lose lose situation actually.
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So just curious.. 65g fragmenting (those plastic projectile) 9mm is illegal? I see it for sale at a LGS. Lol I never bought any tho cause I don't shoot steel plates close. Maybe 25 yards once every red moon.
I know it's meant for steel plates so you may shoot closer for practicing. I would argue that it disperse energy much better during a SD situation. I wouldnt want to overpenetrate into someone else's house. It seems like a lose lose situation actually.
As I pointed out, the term used in the statute is "segmenting." I looked up what that ammo does, and it's much different than fragmenting or frangible ammo.
The verb "to segment" normally applies to dividing something into even portions.
This is an example of segmenting ammo:
- Segmenting hollow point - achieves devastating energy transfer by
splitting into 4-pieces upon impact, while the bullet base still achieves
deep penetration
- Optimized for short barrels - powder is tailored for common personal
defense firearms to deliver the velocity required to initiate segmentation
upon impact
https://palmettostatearmory.com/winchester-silvertip-22lr-37-gr-segmenting-hp-ammo-50-box-w22lrst.html
So, if it's fragmenting or frangible ammo, check the manufacturer's specs to see if it's actually labeled as segmented ammo. If not, I assume it's legal. If the law doesn't define what constitutes "segmenting ammo", then we're left with the manufacturer to say how they designed it and it's intended purpose.
Then again, I'm not a lawyer. Best to do research before posting pics on the Web of you shooting ammo that's "questionably legal."
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RIP ammo is a no go. Thats an example.
Frang ammo design disintigrates upon impact 1 could say. Cause if it fragmented in larger bits, it would harm the user.
Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk
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Legislators are sure dumb...teflon coated bullets :rofl: :rofl: so would it hurt more if I hit you on the head with a teflon coated fry pan versus a non coated one ??? ::)
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As I pointed out, the term used in the statute is "segmenting." I looked up what that ammo does, and it's much different than fragmenting or frangible ammo.
The verb "to segment" normally applies to dividing something into even portions.
This is an example of segmenting ammo:https://palmettostatearmory.com/winchester-silvertip-22lr-37-gr-segmenting-hp-ammo-50-box-w22lrst.html
So, if it's fragmenting or frangible ammo, check the manufacturer's specs to see if it's actually labeled as segmented ammo. If not, I assume it's legal. If the law doesn't define what constitutes "segmenting ammo", then we're left with the manufacturer to say how they designed it and it's intended purpose.
Then again, I'm not a lawyer. Best to do research before posting pics on the Web of you shooting ammo that's "questionably legal."
Lmao. I mustve read segmenting as fragmenting lol.
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RIP ammo is a no go. Thats an example.
Frang ammo design disintigrates upon impact 1 could say. Cause if it fragmented in larger bits, it would harm the user.
Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk
Oh. Underwood too then
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Lmao. I mustve read segmenting and fragmenting lol.
The terms are technical, and they sound similar in meaning. The confusion is understandable.
I'm shocked the lawmakers here actually picked the correct term for their intended ban. :crazy: :rofl: :shake:
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The terms are technical, and they sound similar in meaning. The confusion is understandable.
I'm shocked the lawmakers here actually picked the correct term for their intended ban. :crazy: :rofl: :shake:
Yup. Best I got is gdhp and some hydra shoks. I seen vids of HST being better but the gdhp was cheaper. Also following what sheriffs use so I figure, I could put up a good arguement if I were to be accused of using "dangerous" ammo if local Leo's use the same
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But what happens if your ammo identifies as another type?
I mean, this is settled science right? Any item that identifies as another item is LEGALLY that other item.
Or did I not learn the brainwashing correctly?
It's so confusing!!!
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Yeah. Wouldn't be surprised some sleazebag lawyer will play up your choice of SD ammo, painting you as a crazed killer.
Not so much if you were using the same ammo that local LE are using.
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Yeah. Wouldn't be surprised some sleazebag lawyer will play up your choice of SD ammo, painting you as a crazed killer.
Not so much if you were using the same ammo that local LE are using.
No prosecutor in his right mind would seriously try to paint hollow points as more lethal, then take the opposite position claiming FMJ ammo is more dangerous because it's more likely to exit the body and hit someone else.
That would be crazy ....
https://youtu.be/HIFrw30zjrM