2aHawaii
General Topics => General Discussion => Topic started by: zippz on December 04, 2023, 09:24:10 PM
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Never been to this store. With this burglary and criminal/improper use of byrnas, expect bills in the legislature to restrict them.
Two dozen Byrna guns were stolen Sunday morning from a gun shop in the Maikiki/ McCully area.
https://www.khon2.com/top-stories/public-is-asked-to-be-on-the-lookout-for-stolen-fire-arms/
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Wrong place, mods can you put this in GD
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Report calls them firearms... ???
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Owner says "Now I can undertand what my customers go through" (with regard to being a victim). What a douche.
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Owner says "Now I can undertand what my customers go through" (with regard to being a victim). What a douche.
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Yeah, strange thing to say.
But I think I understand what he meant.
Also, when a person sticks a TV camera in your face, you don't have time to write out a thoughtful statement and deliver an eloquent speech.
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uneducated and misinformed people driving the gun-control agenda.
Either that or they do know but don't care. What is fact and truth nowadays in today's society. Driving the agenda is all that matters.
Report calls them firearms... ???
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Yeah, strange thing to say.
But I think I understand what he meant.
Also, when a person sticks a TV camera in your face, you don't have time to write out a thoughtful statement and deliver an eloquent speech.
I've had to do video interviews with the news for HIFICO over the years. It's something I'm bad at. At least in Hawaii, the media tries to edit it to make it better for the interviewee. Sometimes they get things wrong tho.
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Was this "gun shop" (according to the article) an actual gun shop selling Byrna or is it just a 100% Byrna Dealer?
If it was a gun shop, interesting that no firearms were stolen.
Also, no mention as to how the burglars broke in. Smash and grab? Pick lock? Inside job?
Interesting.
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Yeah, strange thing to say.
But I think I understand what he meant.
Also, when a person sticks a TV camera in your face, you don't have time to write out a thoughtful statement and deliver an eloquent speech.
Fair enough
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Yeah, strange thing to say.
But I think I understand what he meant.
Also, when a person sticks a TV camera in your face, you don't have time to write out a thoughtful statement and deliver an eloquent speech.
People need to realize that the people being interviewed are ansewring a question or given direction on what to say(basically the same thing). But the news does not give the question asked. I dont think they just stick the microphone in front of your face and wait for you to talk. Everyone has their own agenda and everyone puts thier own twist on things. Its interesting to see.
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It doesn't matter if the media calls a non-lethal gun a "firearm" or not.
If someone uses one of these in a crime, the CC licensee or cop standing nearby won't see anything other than a firearm when he starts shooting.
Play stupid games...
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Yeah, strange thing to say.
But I think I understand what he meant.
Also, when a person sticks a TV camera in your face, you don't have time to write out a thoughtful statement and deliver an eloquent speech.
It sounds like he was trying to empathize with them. It could also be an epiphany he had, it is one thing to understand burglary, it is another thing to experience it and the discomfort that comes with it.
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It sounds like he was trying to empathize with them. It could also be an epiphany he had, it is one thing to understand burglary, it is another thing to experience it and the discomfort that comes with it.
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agreed
That's what I think he was thinking.
But when a news reporter stands in front of you with a camera, it's not uncommon to fumble for words.
It's like stage fright.
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KHON2 this morning said "firearms were stolen from a firearms store".
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KHON2 this morning said "firearms were stolen from a firearms store".
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Really?
Was it the byrna story or something else?
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Really?
Was it the byrna story or something else?
Byrna.
I wonder if a bill will be presented about pepper ball type air guns this coming session. And a bb gun state law, since we already have a Honolulu County Ordinance about this.
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Byrna Hawaii is not a FFL
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Byrna Hawaii is not a FFL
OMG! And they are selling "firearms?" How could this be allowed??
:shake: :popcorn:
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As things currently are in Hawaii with regard to less lethal airguns, like Byrnas, are people only allowed to keep and use them inside their own homes or properties?
Can folks legally CC these in their car or on their person in public, despite how much the state government is trying to legislate firearm related CC out of existence?
I would carry one if only the airlines, let alone the government wouldn't hassle me about A.) packing one in my checked luggage or B.) Having it on my person while visiting Oahu.
You can't bar our US constitutional right to have a projectile device (firearm or not) to protect ourselves and our property while not increasing the police presence and expect crime to
magically go down.
Based on what KHON likes to report on, the crime issue isn't going away on it's own! Armed society or big police presence, you can't deny us both you jack@$$es! :grrr:
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As things currently are in Hawaii with regard to less lethal airguns, like Byrnas, are people only allowed to keep and use them inside their own homes or properties?
Can folks legally CC these in their car or on their person in public, despite how much the state government is trying to legislate firearm related CC out of existence?
I would carry one if only the airlines, let alone the government wouldn't hassle me about A.) packing one in my checked luggage or B.) Having it on my person while visiting Oahu.
You can't bar our US constitutional right to have a projectile device (firearm or not) to protect ourselves and our property while not increasing the police presence and expect crime to
magically go down.
Based on what KHON likes to report on, the crime issue isn't going away on it's own! Armed society or big police presence, you can't deny us both you jack@$$es! :grrr:
You can carry stun guns and tasers, and you can carry pepper spray.
These should be no different.
https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/sessions/session2021/bills/GM1311_.pdf
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I gave little pepper sprayers to all the gals (and some guys) I know.
They are more convenient to carry.
Comfort and convenience is a big factor for most people.
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I gave little pepper sprayers to all the gals (and some guys) I know.
They are more convenient to carry.
Comfort and convenience is a big factor for most people.
That's cool. I know a few other people who do the same. "Here have mine" is common when they talk to random people and the convo of self defense comes up.
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You can carry stun guns and tasers, and you can carry pepper spray.
These should be no different.
https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/sessions/session2021/bills/GM1311_.pdf
The only thing to watch out for is that Byrna also can fire non pepperball projectiles. Which then makes it fall under the ROH of bb/air guns. So if any of these projectiles are used, then you cannot carry it.
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hw are the non-pepperball projectiles classified any differently than pepperball projectiles?
The only thing to watch out for is that Byrna also can fire non pepperball projectiles. Which then makes it fall under the ROH of bb/air guns. So if any of these projectiles are used, then you cannot carry it.
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https://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/2022/10/22/rise-street-crime-stokes-popularity-non-lethal-pellet-guns-hawaii/
People here have this bass-ackwards view that there has to be a law making certain things legal in order for those things to not be illegal.
Former Honolulu Police Department Deputy Police Chief John McCarthy
said that while it’s legal to own pepper spray for self-defense in Hawaii,
he thinks these weapons may not be legal.
Another example of the mindset of our police -- can't cite a law, but "thinks" something is illegal because it's NOT something that's specified in the law as legal.
The default in our system of justice is simple: if the law doesn't say it's illegal, then it is legal -- no matter what anyone "thinks."
So messed up!
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hw are the non-pepperball projectiles classified any differently than pepperball projectiles?
Honolulu ordinance has a thing about bb's. And a solid rubber ball/metal or like is a bb. compared to a pepper ball.
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Honolulu ordinance has a thing about bb's. And a solid rubber ball/metal or like is a bb. compared to a pepper ball.
Under city ordinance, an air gun is defined as "any gun, rifle or pistol … designed to expel a pellet or BB shot."
It's against the law to:
Carry an air gun on any street or public parcel, unless it’s in a carrying case;
Discharge an air gun from any street or public parcel;
Discharge an air gun in a way that endangers people or property;
https://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/story/30264770/whats-the-law-say-about-bb-and-pellet-guns/
ROH
§ 41-10.1 Definitions.
For the purposes of this article, the following definitions apply unless the context clearly indicates or requires a different meaning.
Air Gun. Any gun, rifle, or pistol, by whatever name known, that is designed to expel a pellet or BB shot by the action of compressed air or gas, or by the action of a spring or elastic, but does not include any firearm.
In CA, it's legal to carry the kinetic projectiles (polymer pellets), but NOT the pepper balls. :crazy:
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isn't the pepper ball just pepper powder on top of a projectile?
Honolulu ordinance has a thing about bb's. And a solid rubber ball/metal or like is a bb. compared to a pepper ball.
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isn't the pepper ball just pepper powder on top of a projectile?
This is the million $ question. Is it considered a bb? As the outside is hard, but the inside is filled with pepper powder. Compared to a solid plastic bb or soilid metal bb.
#notalawyer, but I think that the pepper projectile doesn't count as a bb.
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Check time mark 8:17 for the pepper ball test.
The first part is interesting, too, with the regular SD balls.
Hint: the pepper balls explode with the proper amount of force upon impact. I imagine they had to do that so the pepper balls don't explode upon firing.
https://youtu.be/HetsFTBhj44
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Check time mark 8:17 for the pepper ball test.
The first part is interesting, too, with the regular SD balls.
Hint: the pepper balls explode with the proper amount of force upon impact. I imagine they had to do that so the pepper balls don't explode upon firing.
https://youtu.be/HetsFTBhj44
This is my issue with the pepper balls, many promo vids, they're shooting steel or a hard surface. So a moving target, I'm not sure how effective the pepper balls will break. Plus imagine if you don't get chest and above hits on a moving target, but instead stomach impacts.
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Byrnas are an alternative.to CCW for those not into guns, but I don't recommend them as their effectiveness is questionable and cost is high. Pepper spray and Taser is better.
In the videos above, the people say it hurts and powder burns, but they don't look incapacitated. Looks like they could still easily attack. Unless you unload an entire mag into their eyes and mouth. A low level criminal may be discouraged enough to find easier prey.
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This is my issue with the pepper balls, many promo vids, they're shooting steel or a hard surface. So a moving target, I'm not sure how effective the pepper balls will break. Plus imagine if you don't get chest and above hits on a moving target, but instead stomach impacts.
Alternatively, if you don't hit center mass -- either intentionally or just poor aiming during stress -- and happen to hit a wall, table or other hard surface, you might be more likely to get the pepper ball to explode near their face.
Also, if you do miss, you're less likely to have to worry about who is beyond your target compared to a bullet.
Then there's the rare but potential active shooter scenario, where a bullet won't have any effect on hard armor, but a pepper round hitting steel would be more likely to slow them down.
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Also, the Byrna is pretty big. I can imagine a woman carry it in their purse for a few weeks and then stop. Same with IWB.
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Also, the Byrna is pretty big. I can imagine a woman carry it in their purse for a few weeks and then stop. Same with IWB.
too buku! too buku!
O0 :geekdanc:
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Check time mark 8:17 for the pepper ball test.
The first part is interesting, too, with the regular SD balls.
Hint: the pepper balls explode with the proper amount of force upon impact. I imagine they had to do that so the pepper balls don't explode upon firing.
That is the issue with paintballs, don't want them breaking in the gun but don't want them bouncing off a person either.
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Honolulu ordinance has a thing about bb's. And a solid rubber ball/metal or like is a bb. compared to a pepper ball.
BB chart (click to enlarge). In my opinion, in no way is a .68 dia. projectile considered a BB
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Case could be made that BB stands for ball bearing which is metal and not rubber.
Pellet is a more general term tho.
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Besides the obvious laws, regulations, and overall attitude against 2a rights, what irks me to no end is how these laws and restrictions can potentially turn a law abiding citizen into a criminal.
And to further the insult, Hawaii's kumbaya attitude to criminals in general where many times they literally get a slap on the wrist then released back out on the streets.
Hawaii's criminals are stupid but they've figured out who has the upper hand here.
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BB chart (click to enlarge). In my opinion, in no way is a .68 dia. projectile considered a BB
Its a combo of what it's made from and how it's propelled.
Made from:
Paintball isn't considered a BB,but has it's own classification due to being filled with paint. Compared to a solid metal or plastic type.
Propelled:
If it's propelled by a release of gas that has to be ignited first in order to initiate the process (gun powder) vs. compressed air or spring (bb gun/airsoft).
ROH for pepper spray says "noxious" gas. No mention of compressed powder. Which is why IMO, pepperballs are unknown, but I'm leaning more toward legal since if there's no law to ban it, then it's legal.
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Case could be made that BB stands for ball bearing which is metal and not rubber.
Pellet is a more general term tho.
The term BB originated from the nomenclature of the size of lead shots used in a
smoothbore shotgun. Size "BB" shots were nominally 0.180 in (4.6 mm), but tended
to vary considerably in size because of the loose tolerances in shotshells. The largest
shotgun pellet commonly used was named 00 or double ought and was used for
hunting deer and thus called buckshot, while the smaller BB-sized shot was typically
used to shoot small/medium-sized game birds and called birdshot.
A BB gun is a type of air gun designed to shoot metallic spherical projectiles called
BBs (not to be confused with similar-looking bearing balls), which are approximately
the same size as BB-size lead birdshot used in shotguns
The term "BB gun" is frequently used incorrectly to describe airsoft guns, which shoot
plastic pellets (also often referred to as "BBs") that are larger (usually 6 mm or 0.24 in
in diameter) but much less dense than metal BBs,[1] and have significantly lower ballistic
performance. The term is also sometimes used to describe a pellet gun, which shoots
diabolo-shaped (not spherical) lead projectiles at higher power and velocity. Although
some BB guns can also shoot pellets, the reverse situation is not true: steel BB balls
have greater stiffness and are not meant to be shot from pellet guns, whose barrels are
typically rifled and thus can get stuck (similar to a squib load in firearms) and lead to a
damage or mechanical failure within the pellet gun.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BB_gun