2aHawaii
General Topics => Legal and Activism => Topic started by: BRU on February 11, 2024, 10:28:32 PM
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Please correct me if I’m wrong but it sounds like SB2845 would prohibit people under 21 from rifle and shotgun hunting if they are not allowed to posses or control any ammunition for any firearm.
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Please correct me if I’m wrong but it sounds like SB2845 would prohibit people under 21 from rifle and shotgun hunting if they are not allowed to posses or control any ammunition for any firearm.
Basically yes
g) No person who is less than twenty-one years of age
shall own, possess, or control any ammunition for any firearm;
provided that this subsection shall not apply to;
Exempts cops, military while serving, and prison guards.
https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/sessions/session2024/bills/SB2845_.pdf
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It’s a bit ridiculous that a child can obtain their hunter’s ed card at 10 yrs old but wouldn’t be able to do anything with it until 11 years later. Can’t even shoot at a range.
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This is another bad one.
Needs another fire mission.
Funny how the pdf of the proposed bill has somebody's signature on it but I can't tell what it is.
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Please correct me if I’m wrong but it sounds like SB2845 would prohibit people under 21 from rifle and shotgun hunting if they are not allowed to posses or control any ammunition for any firearm.
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thanks for bringing this up :shaka:
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How SB2845 integrates with other laws.
Currently HRS 134-4 "Transfer, possession of firearms" allows the loan of long guns to adults for up to 15 days.
Currently HRS 134-5 "possession by licensed hunters and minors" allows minors of 16 years and up, to possess and transport firearms and ammunition for hunting and target practice on their own.
With SB2845, doesn't address 134-5, so technically still would allow for hunting and target shooting with a loaned long gun and their current stockpile of ammo. However they would not be able to acquire more ammunition, even from their parents. It's in a grey area.
Nevermind, the law bans possession under 21 so that person wouldn't be able to keep it at home, and must discard or have his ammunition confiscated.
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Please correct me if I’m wrong but it sounds like SB2845 would prohibit people under 21 from rifle and shotgun hunting if they are not allowed to posses or control any ammunition for any firearm.
People under 21 cannot buy these items. Now they wouldn't be able to buy ammo for the items as well. Or posses the ammo, even if not bought.
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Please correct me if I’m wrong but it sounds like SB2845 would prohibit people under 21 from rifle and shotgun hunting if they are not allowed to posses or control any ammunition for any firearm.
The way I see it yes, you cannot take anyone under 21 hunting, target shooting, trap shooting, or skeet shooting. You can loan them a firearm for those activities, but you cannot give them ammo(transfer of ammunition) and they cannot possess or control any ammunition to use in the gun.
you also cannot sell ammunition to anyone under 21.
violation of those sections results in a misdemeanor. normally you could say fuck it and risk it during a hunting trip, however since sb1230, if you were caught by dlnr and charged, you and the people under 21 would loose your rights to possess and own firearms and ammunition for 20 years. so the stakes are high enough I think every hunter should be testifying. too bad there isnt enough time to get the word out. hopefully HPD and DLNR point out these facts and oppose.
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The way I see it yes, you cannot take anyone under 21 hunting, target shooting, trap shooting, or skeet shooting. You can loan them a firearm for those activities, but you cannot give them ammo(transfer of ammunition) and they cannot possess or control any ammunition to use in the gun.
you also cannot sell ammunition to anyone under 21.
violation of those sections results in a misdemeanor. normally you could say fuck it and risk it during a hunting trip, however since sb1230, if you were caught by dlnr and charged, you and the people under 21 would loose your rights to possess and own firearms and ammunition for 20 years. so the stakes are high enough I think every hunter should be testifying. too bad there isnt enough time to get the word out. hopefully HPD and DLNR point out these facts and oppose.
Correct. But add in that SB3196 prohibits anyone from "loaning" a semi auto rifle/semi shotgun. Which means no person can hold/use the rifle at the range either.
There is lots of time to get the word out as most hearings are 2 days notice (48hrs), but this one was posted on Friday, so it gave us 5 days. People need to spread the word coconut wireless style.
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Correct. But add in that SB3196 prohibits anyone from "loaning" a semi auto rifle/semi shotgun. Which means no person can hold/use the rifle at the range either.
It conflicts with 134-4 and -5 which says ANY legally acquired firearm which would override SB3196 unless changed.
Don't testify on that tho.
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KITV covered this and interviewed some hunters and also talked to wakai. wakai says he will amend the bill to only ban sales of ammunition. he mentioned removing possesion and control, but not ownership or transfer. theres also a house version of this bill so we still have to keep an eye on this one even if its amended?
https://www.kitv.com/news/local/state-senate-to-consider-bill-on-firearms-ammunition-regulation-changes-on-wednesday/article_6a1b8c1e-caf1-11ee-8ba7-a3bf52fba01b.html
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KITV covered this and interviewed some hunters and also talked to wakai. wakai says he will amend the bill to only ban sales of ammunition. he mentioned removing possesion and control, but not ownership or transfer. theres also a house version of this bill so we still have to keep an eye on this one even if its amended?
https://www.kitv.com/news/local/state-senate-to-consider-bill-on-firearms-ammunition-regulation-changes-on-wednesday/article_6a1b8c1e-caf1-11ee-8ba7-a3bf52fba01b.html
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Bureaucratic doubletalk.
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Waikai seems very nervous in that video. Can tell he has no clue what hes talking about. And then he gets cut off lol
I don't think he talks to anyone about their views on guns nor knows anything about guns. I've tried talking to him every year and invite him to the range but nothing.
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Waikai seems very nervous in that video. Can tell he has no clue what hes talking about. And then he gets cut off lol
I don't think he talks to anyone about their views on guns nor knows anything about guns. I've tried talking to him every year and invite him to the range but nothing.
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Yeah, I saw that. I thought these politicians are supposed to be smart, upstanding community leaders. But in that interview he sounds like a boy that got caught peeking in the girls shower.
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Yeah, I saw that. I thought these politicians are supposed to be smart, upstanding community leaders. But in that interview he sounds like a boy that got caught peeking in the girls shower.
Wakai is a career journalist. https://justfacts.votesmart.org/candidate/biography/32272/glenn-wakai
local civil servant positions don't attract the best and brightest
but the insanity in our society is to always look to government for an answer.
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I try not to criticize any portion of interviews in edited clips. Which is pretty much ALL "news". They always edit out the reporters side of the interview and so you never know what was asked or how the conversation got to where it is. I am just grateful that this one is starting off in the right direction. And I hope you guys are too. I am thankful for the guys who stepped up and took interviews on this, even wakai.
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local civil servant positions don't attract the best and brightest
but the insanity in our society is to always look to government for an answer.
Guys like Wakai take superpac money in exchange for introducing legislation. They have no idea what the legislation actually means, so if they get a policy question that's not on their cheat sheet it makes them all itchy and nervous.
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It's good he reduced the severity of the ammo bill. But it was due to being pressured with the bad media. I don't think he would've changed it if not for that.
Last year he just steamrolled sb1230 through without any thought for our side. In fact he asked the gun control side for more places to ban guns from.
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side note, we should spread this kitv article far and wide. the more clicks it gets the more chance they will continue with coverage of these issues.
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as if criminal yutes will respect this law. yeah, right.
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Wakai is a career journalist. https://justfacts.votesmart.org/candidate/biography/32272/glenn-wakai
local civil servant positions don't attract the best and brightest
but the insanity in our society is to always look to government for an answer.
ain't that the truth!
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Guys like Wakai take superpac money in exchange for introducing legislation.
It's good he reduced the severity of the ammo bill. But it was due to being pressured with the bad media. I don't think he would've changed it if not for that.
Last year he just steamrolled sb1230 through without any thought for our side. In fact he asked the gun control side for more places to ban guns from.
Then in my opinion Wakai is nothing but ku-kai.
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Then in my opinion Wakai is nothing but ku-kai.
Tojo Wakai
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It's good he reduced the severity of the ammo bill. But it was due to being pressured with the bad media. I don't think he would've changed it if not for that.
Last year he just steamrolled sb1230 through without any thought for our side. In fact he asked the gun control side for more places to ban guns from.
The station manager at KITV organized the planned "spontaneous" mandatory "volunteer" protest against the 2a a few years ago where public school kids were threatened with suspension by public school staff if they didn't assemble outside as "protest".
The "feminist rights" Marxist "grassroots group leader" who coordinated it on behalf of her funders was also the KITV station manager, she even used a KITV email/social media link for her contact.
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The station manager at KITV organized the planned "spontaneous" mandatory "volunteer" protest against the 2a a few years ago where public school kids were threatened with suspension by public school staff if they didn't assemble outside as "protest".
The "feminist rights" Marxist "grassroots group leader" who coordinated it on behalf of her funders was also the KITV station manager, she even used a KITV email/social media link for her contact.
I didn't know the behind the scenes stuff. Got a name?
I just watched the "march for our lives" parade through back then.
(https://i.imgur.com/LDFbPMk.jpg)
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I didn't know the behind the scenes stuff. Got a name?
I just watched the "march for our lives" parade through back then.
(https://i.imgur.com/LDFbPMk.jpg)
I don't have it on this device, try looking at the KITV coverage where they tell you how to join the protest.
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I didn't know the behind the scenes stuff. Got a name?
I just watched the "march for our lives" parade through back then.
(https://i.imgur.com/LDFbPMk.jpg)
funny, somebody rained on their parade. LGBT-theme umbrella leading the way. of course.
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we are being disarmed and the youth are being indoctrinated.
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It conflicts with 134-4 and -5 which says ANY legally acquired firearm which would override SB3196 unless changed.
Don't testify on that tho.
Just shows you how much these politicians have their heads up each other’s ass.
They really don’t know what laws have passed and how their latest “good idea” conflicts with current law.
What a bunch of stupid madafakas.
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Looked at the amendments again removing the ban on possession and control and still banning sales and transfer.
HRS 134-5 states under 21 can "may carry and use ... suitable ammunition while actually engaged in hunting or target shooting..."
So they can use ammunition they already have. However no one can sell, distribute, or transfer ammunition to them. So they can use what they got now, but can't get anymore once the law goes into effect. Still messed up.
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Looked at the amendments again removing the ban on possession and control and still banning sales and transfer.
HRS 134-5 states under 21 can "may carry and use ... suitable ammunition while actually engaged in hunting or target shooting..."
So they can use ammunition they already have. However no one can sell, distribute, or transfer ammunition to them. So they can use what they got now, but can't get anymore once the law goes into effect. Still messed up.
What’s meant by “distribute, or otherwise transfer”? If I’m at the range or hunting with a minor, am I prohibited from handing a box of ammo to the minor because it’s a transfer? Seems like these scenarios in combination with HB2342 would make the person a class C felon.
SB2845
"§134- Sale of ammunition to a person under the age of twenty-one; prohibition; penalty. (a) No person shall knowingly sell, offer to sell, distribute, or otherwise transfer ammunition for any firearm to any person who is under the age of twenty-one.
(b) It is a defense to a prosecution for the sale of ammunition to a person under the age of twenty-one that the defendant sold the ammunition to the person under the age of twenty-one with the belief, which was reasonable under the circumstances, that the person under the age of twenty-one had attained the age of twenty-one.
(c) Any person violating subsection (a) shall be guilty of a misdemeanor."
HB2342
“~134- Carrying or use of a firearm in the commission of a separate misdemeanor; penalty. (a) It shall be unlawful for a person to knowingly carry on the person or have within the person’s immediate control or intentionally use or threaten to use a firearm while engaged in the commission of a separate misdemeanor offense, whether the firearm was loaded or not, and whether operable or not; provided that a person shall not be prosecuted under this section when the separate offense is an offense otherwise defined by this chapter or is the offense of criminally negligent storage of a firearm under section 707- 714.5.
(b) A conviction and sentence under this section shall be in addition to and not in lieu of any conviction and sentence for the separate misdemeanor; provided that the sentence imposed under this section may run concurrently or consecutively with the sentence for the separate misdemeanor.
(c) Any person violating this section shall be guilty of a class C felony.”
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I find it plausible that a person hunting in the woods could accidentally drop some ammo and unfortunately lose it. And a youth walking the same trail could find it later.
Or a person on a boating trip accidentally loses a case of ammo overboard. Then a bunch of youths on a snorkeling trip find it.
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I find it plausible that a person hunting in the woods could accidentally drop some ammo and unfortunately lose it. And a youth walking the same trail could find it later.
Or a person on a boating trip accidentally loses a case of ammo overboard. Then a bunch of youths on a snorkeling trip find it.
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We're only human. Accidents happen.
I lose stuff all the time. Nobody's perfect.
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This isnt' on Dr. Greens veto list.
FYI before you let anyone shoot your gun, you must check their government issued ID. Even if they're a grandpa.