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General Topics => General Discussion => Topic started by: macsak on August 14, 2025, 10:47:13 AM

Title: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: macsak on August 14, 2025, 10:47:13 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2QvO_1hnDo
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: Xavierbaker on August 14, 2025, 10:51:47 AM
Can we make 2011’s standard duty pistol instead?
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: Flapp_Jackson on August 14, 2025, 11:08:23 AM
Can we make 2011’s standard duty pistol instead?
It has only been 10 years since HPD switched to Glock 17's.  Maybe they can switch back?

The gun's age doesn't even matter as much as how much use they have seen.  Even if wear and tear becomes an issue, replacement parts like barrels and slides are cheaper than a new gun.  Plus, they always have NIB spares they can use to replace well-worn pistols.

I'm starting to wonder about the justification for a replacement program and going to a different brand.  It seems like accessories, holsters, etc., would be less expensive if we just replaced the current G17's with new g17's.

The prior service weapon, a S&W 9mm, was procured and issued in 1990.  They remained the issue sidearm until 2015.  25 years of service seems like a better return on investment than 10 years.
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: hvybarrels on August 14, 2025, 11:54:04 AM
That’s a lot of used p320s about to flood the market.

Might be worth looking for deals and getting the voluntary upgrade

Gunsmiths say the issue still happens after the upgrade. Still might be worth the gamble if someone figures out a solution or sig eventually offers an enticing trade in program.
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: zippz on August 14, 2025, 12:21:51 PM

I'm starting to wonder about the justification for a replacement program and going to a different brand.  It seems like accessories, holsters, etc., would be less expensive if we just replaced the current G17's with new g17's.


The pistol and replacement gear are small costs.  The pistol has to be tested and evaluated, gunsmiths and instructors trained, and officers have a week of transition training on the firearm.  That equals to about $3k to $4k per officer.  It also means less officer coverage and other tasks not done during that time
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: Flapp_Jackson on August 14, 2025, 12:27:50 PM
The pistol and replacement gear are small costs.  The pistol has to be tested and evaluated, gunsmiths and instructors trained, and officers have a week of transition training on the firearm.  That equals to about $3k to $4k per officer.  It also means less officer coverage and other tasks not done during that time

Thanks for elaborating on my 'etc.'.    :geekdanc: :shaka:
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: QUIETShooter on August 14, 2025, 12:47:05 PM
Solution for the P320:

Israeli carry.

Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: changemyoil66 on August 14, 2025, 12:47:40 PM
It has only been 10 years since HPD switched to Glock 17's.  Maybe they can switch back?

The gun's age doesn't even matter as much as how much use they have seen.  Even if wear and tear becomes an issue, replacement parts like barrels and slides are cheaper than a new gun.  Plus, they always have NIB spares they can use to replace well-worn pistols.

I'm starting to wonder about the justification for a replacement program and going to a different brand.  It seems like accessories, holsters, etc., would be less expensive if we just replaced the current G17's with new g17's.

The prior service weapon, a S&W 9mm, was procured and issued in 1990.  They remained the issue sidearm until 2015.  25 years of service seems like a better return on investment than 10 years.

I remember HPD"s statement on the 5906 is that spare parts are no longer made. 
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: Flapp_Jackson on August 14, 2025, 12:54:33 PM
I remember HPD"s statement on the 5906 is that spare parts are no longer made.

Maybe the Glock doesn't shoot as well as the SIG (my opinion as well), so they wanted to jump on the P320 bandwagon along with the military and other LE agencies?

When they switched to Glock, the news stated the city "replaced them [S&W] with lighter and easier-to-use Glock 17s that cost about half as much as the Smith & Wessons."

Apparently they were looking at ease of use when they chose the Glock, but that's subjective.
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: hvybarrels on August 14, 2025, 01:21:33 PM
Solution for the P320:

Israeli carry.

If you can pick up brand new or gently used one in the hundred dollar range that would be worth the extra bit of training
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: eyeeatingfish on August 14, 2025, 01:42:39 PM
Can we make 2011’s standard duty pistol instead?

That would double or triple the cost based on most 2011's I saw
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: ren on August 14, 2025, 02:36:14 PM
That would double or triple the cost based on most 2011's I saw

Which 2011s? How much did SIG charge the govt. on that contract?
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: eyeeatingfish on August 14, 2025, 02:52:06 PM
Which 2011s? How much did SIG charge the govt. on that contract?

Saw a number of brands near $1000 and up from there. Are there any good 2011s available for $500-600 of a glock?
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: ren on August 14, 2025, 04:30:02 PM
Saw a number of brands near $1000 and up from there. Are there any good 2011s available for $500-600 of a glock?

Which brands? and how do you know it would up the cost 2x or 3x without knowing what the govt. paid?
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: hvybarrels on August 14, 2025, 04:37:33 PM
Apparently the govt paid $178 each for the p320s.

That might be the problem right there.
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: Flapp_Jackson on August 14, 2025, 05:37:28 PM
Apparently the govt paid $178 each for the p320s.

That might be the problem right there.
Yep. 
Too late to start selling P320 holsters made of Kevlar?

 :geekdanc:

Why the Army LOVES Sig Sauer and DENIED Glock

Quote
The defining feature of the competition was modularity. The Army wanted a
handgun system that could adapt to various roles, transitioning seamlessly
between full-size, compact, and subcompact configurations. This wasn’t just
a bonus – it was a fundamental requirement. Sig Sauer’s P320 excelled here,
offering a removable trigger package that could be swapped between different
frames and slides. In contrast, Glock’s 19X struggled to meet this standard.
https://www.survivalworld.com/military/why-the-army-loves-sig-sauer-and-denied-glock/

Starting to look more like a case of Procurement Requirements drafted to favor a particular vendor's submission.
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: eyeeatingfish on August 14, 2025, 09:15:50 PM
Which brands? and how do you know it would up the cost 2x or 3x without knowing what the govt. paid?

I am comparing MSRPs. Of course the government would get a bulk discount but that would hold true for a glock as well.

Are you aware of any 2011 brands cheap enough that they could bulk price anywhere near the bulk price of a glock?
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: ren on August 14, 2025, 09:20:21 PM
I am comparing MSRPs. Of course the government would get a bulk discount but that would hold true for a glock as well.

Are you aware of any 2011 brands cheap enough that they could bulk price anywhere near the bulk price of a glock?

You said you saw "brands" which ones?
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: eyeeatingfish on August 14, 2025, 09:26:38 PM
You said you saw "brands" which ones?

Stocatto, Taryn Tactical, Wilson Combat, Springfield.
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: ren on August 14, 2025, 09:30:04 PM
Stocatto, Taryn Tactical, Wilson Combat, Springfield.

Taryn Tactical, Wilson Combat, Springfield don't make "2011s"
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: eyeeatingfish on August 14, 2025, 11:12:43 PM
Taryn Tactical, Wilson Combat, Springfield don't make "2011s"

Springfield and Wilson Combat don't call it a 2011 you are correct but they make double stack 1911 and people refer to double stack 1911s as 2011s.

Taryn Tactical has a 2011 on their website.
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: ren on August 15, 2025, 07:15:26 AM
Springfield and Wilson Combat don't call it a 2011 you are correct but they make double stack 1911 and people refer to double stack 1911s as 2011s.

Taryn Tactical has a 2011 on their website.

2011s are made by former STI which is now StAccato. I figured you knew this being a 1911 gunsmith.
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: changemyoil66 on August 15, 2025, 10:08:30 AM
Springfield and Wilson Combat don't call it a 2011 you are correct but they make double stack 1911 and people refer to double stack 1911s as 2011s.

Taryn Tactical has a 2011 on their website.

Does it say "2011" on their website? When I was looking at a the Combat Master OG John Wick gun, it never stated 2011 at all. Then again when I looked at the Sand Viper, no mention of it being a 2011 or 2011 like.
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: Flapp_Jackson on August 15, 2025, 11:57:22 AM
Does it say "2011" on their website? When I was looking at a the Combat Master OG John Wick gun, it never stated 2011 at all. Then again when I looked at the Sand Viper, no mention of it being a 2011 or 2011 like.
https://tarantacticalinnovations.com/tti-2011-punisher-box-set/

the $20,000 price tag for the pair doesn't exactly squeeze into the "it would up the cost 2x or 3x" of MSRP price range.  A $500 Glock MSRP x 2 guns = $1000.  $20,000 / $1000 = 20 .  So, those 2011's are 20 times the MSRP of an average Glock.

The figure i found was a dollar more than posted earlier: $180 per P320 for the government.  MSRP is about $700 on average depending on the model.  That's still more than 14 times the P320 MSRP.

It's fun when people pull numbers out of rheir butt without thinking about what they are saying.
Title: Re: BREAKING: I.C.E. Drops SIG P320 & Immediately Awards Glock New Duty Pistol
Post by: changemyoil66 on August 15, 2025, 01:18:13 PM
https://tarantacticalinnovations.com/tti-2011-punisher-box-set/

the $20,000 price tag for the pair doesn't exactly squeeze into the "it would up the cost 2x or 3x" of MSRP price range.  A $500 Glock MSRP x 2 guns = $1000.  $20,000 / $1000 = 20 .  So, those 2011's are 20 times the MSRP of an average Glock.

The figure i found was a dollar more than posted earlier: $180 per P320 for the government.  MSRP is about $700 on average depending on the model.  That's still more than 14 times the P320 MSRP.

It's fun when people pull numbers out of rheir butt without thinking about what they are saying.

Thanks.  Since I had no intention of buying 2 of them, I never saw this one.