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Messages - Motorman

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1
General Discussion / Re: CCW Wait Times???
« on: November 19, 2024, 08:23:18 PM »
Mines came in the mail today, approx 115 days.

I submitted a passport photo during application. Does that mean I need to provide another upon pickup?

No.
2
General Discussion / Re: Renewing CCW
« on: October 11, 2024, 12:07:21 PM »

I thought the new 2024 firearm laws were statewide. I guess the different counties still have the power to make their own rules.  Oh well.

Hawaii County is supposed to be charging $150 as of this year as all applications this year are considered new applications.

But if no one says anything, then it’ll remain $50 or whatever. 👀
3
General Discussion / Re: Renewing CCW
« on: October 11, 2024, 08:40:04 AM »

Correct. Maybe I should have made that clear
In the beginning.  It is on Big Island.  I don’t see why that would Matter tho because the new law is a statewide law isn’t it?  Their website even states the LTC is valid statewide

Honolulu is recognizing the new 2024 laws and treats the application as a new application, not a renewal.
4
General Discussion / Re: Renewing CCW
« on: October 11, 2024, 12:00:55 AM »

I agree they should already know, then again HPD doesn’t want the public to carry so they will probably say its our responsibility to tell them we are renewing.  When I dropped off my application the girl was very friendly. She accepted my app as if I was applying for the first time.  I wouldn't expect her to know whether I was renewing or applying for the first time. She didn’t ask me a single question. Just made sure all my paperwork was filled out. It wasn’t until after I told her i was renewing my existing LTC that she told me it would only cost $50     i didn’t catch her name but she was really nice and would like to give her a shoutout.  She noticed one discrepancy on my application that she didn’t have to tell me about, but she did and I was able to make the correction. Both of my pistols are 9mm. The glock registration says the caliber is 9x19, the sig registration says the caliber is 9mm.  When I filled out my application I wrote down 9mm for the glock pistol caliber.  She said the new chief is so strict if the application doesn’t match the registration exactly, the person in charge will deny my application and make me reapply all over again. Luckily I printed out 2 copies and was able to re-fill out that one page for the glock and listed the caliber as 9x19 to match my registration. Crazy how 9x19 and 9mm is the same thing but the chief will deny the app for something that minor. Really appreciate this woman for taking the time to read through my entire application to make sure it shouldn’t get pushed back.  Its a good thing I didn’t catch her name because I wouldn’t be surprised if she got in trouble for helping me out.

At this point, I’m almost certain you’re talking about Hawaii Police Department and not Honolulu Police Department. Honolulu charges $150; there are no renewals this year as the law has changed. Hawai’i should also be charging $150, but I’m not about to say anything. 
5
General Discussion / Re: New 2024 Hawaii gun law and CCW questions
« on: September 18, 2024, 09:51:27 AM »
Yes. Paid $150 for 4 years CCW. I was told that I can add as much handgun I want within the 4 years period but all will expire at the same date. HPD said LTC overlapping is not possible with new 2024 law.

If you paid $150, you should have gotten a new card with the full 4 years.
6
General Discussion / Re: New 2024 Hawaii gun law and CCW questions
« on: September 17, 2024, 10:17:37 AM »
Renewed my 2023 approved handgun this June and got approved after 69 days but not as renewal but as new application. I am not sure if we have a renewal process in place. I was surprised that HPD just added the newly approved CCW to my current CCW card issued this January 2024, so both handgun has the same expiration date now. Sad because I thought I could overlap each handgun expiration.

Did you pay $150 when you applied in June?
7
General Discussion / Re: Link to the new PTA process for handguns
« on: September 15, 2024, 11:58:03 PM »
Does anyone have a link to the new PTA process for handguns that isn’t 32 pages long?

When I try to google, I get the old PTA process where you need the handgun info when applying for a handgun PTA.  Also found a 32 page document on the 30 day permit but my eyes glaze over just looking at it

I also tried to search thru this forum but my search fu must be weak or I’m blind.   Probably both….

I heard that now you can apply for a permit with no pistol info and the permit is good for like 30 days…..so sort of like a rifle permit.

Can the new handgun permit be used to register multiple handguns…..similar to a rifle permit?  Or is it still 1 handgun per permit?  Ie.  4 handguns = 4 permits.

HPD website isn’t updated
https://www.honolulupd.org/police-services/firearms/

https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol03_Ch0121-0200D/HRS0134/HRS_0134-0002.htm

A 32 page document on the new 30 day permit
https://www.honolulupd.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/01/Rules-of-the-Chief-2024-final.pdf

No gun info needed for handgun permits, but the if you don’t provide info, the permit pickup and registration need to be done in-person. The permits are good for 30 days from date of issuance.

Handgun permits, serial number or blank, are one-for-one; they can only be used for one gun each. Yes; you will need 4 handgun permits for 4 different handguns.

Blank handgun permits can only be used for handguns purchased from dealers. People buying from private sellers need to provide the information for the handgun at application or permit pick-up.
8
Legal and Activism / Re: Is an arrest always mandatory?
« on: September 13, 2024, 04:17:41 PM »
But why, in this case, was he detained so long?  He wouldn't be a flight risk, would he?  He wouldn't seek retaliation, would he?  I'm sure his firearm was taken away from him.  Couldn't he be released on his own recognizance?  It's not like he's a full blown criminal with past convictions.

So I learned the cops can't hold a person more than 48 hours without charging him with something.  You also stated that the full detention must be justifiable.

What would that be?  Even an idiot like me could see he shot Silva to stop him from killing people and destroying his personal property.

You gotta be able to articulate the situation well in court.

Let’s just say, hypothetically, that Silva was walking back to his property after the shooting.

If Carnate ran after him and shot him in the back, that’s gonna be hard to articulate in court as self-defense. That’s more retribution than self-defense. If he can articulate that he still perceived a threat and he shot Silva to prevent further death and injury, then the shooting is good.
9
ROH 41-12.3 applies to the pepper balls used by the Byrna Gun and makes possession and use of the balls themselves illegal.

Pepper spray itself is exempt from ROH 41-12.3 under ROH 41-12.4.

The more ya’ know.
10
Legal and Activism / Re: Is an arrest always mandatory?
« on: September 04, 2024, 04:47:37 PM »
Also this has nothing to do with stand your ground.  The only difference is you can shoot without retreating if it can be done safely and is not at the residence.

Not only was the incident at Carnates residence, but people were getting shot at the time and not able to retreat safely.

It’s not as clean cut when it comes to Hawaii prosecutors.

If Silva was shooting, stopped, and was walking back to his residence, and then Carnates shot him, he’s gonna need to do some heavy lifting in court (probably civil; less so for criminal) to justify shooting and articulate that there was still a threat present. It’s a different story if Carnates shot Silva while he was shooting.

There’s too many variables that are unknown to determine whether or not the shooting was legal. Reasonable? Of course. Legal by Hawai’i standards? That’s another question.
11
General Discussion / Re: Ccw license
« on: August 25, 2024, 10:29:19 PM »
 :sleeping:
How far in advance before expiration can a person their ccw license?

90 days prior to expiration.
12
General Discussion / Re: CCW Wait Times???
« on: April 28, 2024, 10:02:33 PM »
How long have you folks waited to receive your CCW Permit?  When did you apply?

Could someone also fill me in on the process? I completed both the Basic Firearms class and CCW class.  Should receive affidavits soon.

I understand that I need to go in person to apply and there’s a checklist but the permits need to be picked up? Mailed?

Hopefully others can use this post to get a sense of wait times.

Thanks!

Average wait time is 2-3 months nowadays. Licenses, not permits, are not emailed. When approved (or denied), the applicant will receive a certified physical letter stating the license is ready for pick up from the registration-side of the police station (or that the license application is denied).

All current forms can be found at HonoluluPD.org. The officers who work the CCW part of the firearms unit help the person fill out the form, so fill out the forms best you can at home and the rest will be fixed when you apply.
13
You're wrong.

" If the chief of police does not grant or deny a submitted application for a concealed carry license within one hundred twenty days following the date of the application, the application shall be deemed denied as of that date for purposes of subsection (k)."

My bad. I’ll let them know.
14
I just read the law.  It states if its an incomplete application after 120 days its dead.  Could find anything else besides that.  Am I missing something? 🤙

Correct. If the application is incomplete, i.e. multiple attempts have been made to contact the applicant to provide missing documentation/information with no result.

The 120 days does not apply if your application is complete and not missing anything.
15
General Discussion / Re: FFL transfer question
« on: March 21, 2024, 01:19:35 PM »
If I find a rifle on another island from a private seller and use an ffl there to ship it to an ffl on Oahu can I register the firearm online or will they see it as a private sale and have to register in person?

If your FFL is doing it the right way, they’ll register the firearm to themselves first to do the transfer, at which point you getting the firearm from your dealer is considered a dealer transaction which can be registered online.
16
General Discussion / Re: HPD REGISTRATION E-MAILS
« on: February 09, 2024, 11:58:11 AM »
So, you're telling me HPD doesn't know how to pick up the phone and immediately contact the registering party so they can process the submission?

I guess that's not surprising, since they can't properly communicate with healthcare providers in order to receive the critical mental health evaluations they need -- without the provider asking the patient to had deliver it to the station.   :wacko:

It's not that I give HPD more or less credit than the seller.  It's that almost all private sales are already registered with them -- they had all that info on the weapon and who owns it in their files.  Handguns required permits -- which includes all the same info whether it's a private sale or FFL transfer.  The FFL is directed by statute to keep and maintain proper records.  If they are sending erroneous info to the police station when they make a sale, that's easy enough to fix.  People straighten up when their license to operate a business is on the line -- something the FFL seems to be using now to shut down FFLs all over.

Again, I don't think those posting here made mistakes.  If they did, they probably would have included the rejection/correction aspect in their comments.  They aren't bringing in out-of-state firearms they already own, because those require in-person inspections.  If everyone here is seeing a 2-4 month delay in getting their registration, there's only one answer: it's intentional. 

HPD is telling people they can't USE their firearms until they get the registration in hand.  I've registered dozens of times, and I've never been told that at the window.  This is obviously being done because they know the registrations are taking too long.  It's deductive reasoning, of course.  No actual evidence or whistleblowers to prove it.

i think if it's not intentional, then they are just incompetent.  I can get a driver's license mailed to me in 2 weeks or less.  I can renew my vehicle registration online and receive it in the mail in a week or so.  Every company and government agency that deals with money has procedures in place to expedite these kinds of transactions.  The only reason it;s so complicated and error-prone is HPD doesn't care to make it better.  The solutions exist.  All they have to do is work smarter. 

But, these are the same folks who waited until months passed to try and create new procedures schedule to take effect Jan 1.  i refuse to accept the status quo as an excuse for denying a right.

You’re right; the solutions exist.

There aren’t enough people to work the solutions at the firearms section though. HPD is too busy with the backlog from online registrations and CCW to study and implement the solutions. Its a shame the level of funding and staffing the firearms section is working with; it’s the same guys working the window and I hardly see any new faces over the last few years.
17
General Discussion / Re: HPD REGISTRATION E-MAILS
« on: February 09, 2024, 08:34:14 AM »
I don't see how an online registration needs to be "sent back."  If whoever is doing the manual entry at HPD has the correct information -- else why would they even know there's an error -- there's no reason they can't make the correction themselves and send the owner a corrected copy. 

Rejecting the application and requiring corrections they already know of is just an unnecessary delay. 

If it's an FFL transfer, HPD already received the official description of the firearm from the seller.  If it's a private transfer for a handgun, they have the information from the permit they approved.  If there's a mismatch between the previous paperwork and the registration submittal, they have the means to correct it themselves.

That applies to knowing the local FFL vs. online dealer name, serial numbers, models, calibers, etc.. 

How many times does the buyer and the FFL need to tell HPD all that info? 

The only circumstances I can think fits the bill where there's no prior information submitted is for an out-of-state transfer or private long gun transfer.  All the rest should be a piece of cake.

JMHO

The real question is, did any of the members sharing their stories  and delays here experience any "returned" applications for correction?  IF not, then the delays are not all error-caused.

You're giving a lot of credit to the seller. In the same way that HPD is sometimes wrong, the seller (private or dealer) is sometimes wrong. A lot of times (and I mean a lot of times), the firearms section does not have the right information.

FFLs/Dealers, the ones who handle the import of the firearm to the state, get the information (to include the serial number) wrong on the information they provide to HPD. The only person with the correct info is the person who has physical possession of the firearm. For the registration process, HPD puts the responsibility of providing the correct information on the registrant.

The online queue is similar to a physical queue. The physical registration is one-and-done because they are easy to fix at the registration window. The online queue can’t be addressed the same because it can’t be fixed quickly. Returning the request to the registrant for corrections assures that HPD will not be held liable later for registering a firearm incorrectly.

Of course the delays are error-caused. A good majority of the registration requests are the same requests that have been sent 1, 2, 3 times before. Imagine for a second if, when registering a firearm in-person, the registrant had to leave and return later with the correct info. Instead of being at the registration window once, they’d be there multiple times, waiting in line multiple times, filling out paper multiple times, increasing the wait time for registration; it’s the same concept.
18
General Discussion / Re: HPD REGISTRATION E-MAILS
« on: February 08, 2024, 10:42:19 PM »
What's worse is, using online registration was supposed to be a time-saver.  It's crazy that the automated process takes weeks longer than the in-person, manual process.

I'm wondering if HPD is just computer illiterate?

Due to constant errors submitted by members of the public registering firearms, each request needs to be reviewed and manually input into the firearms database. There is no and has never been an automated system; for accuracy sake (with the thousands of different make, model, caliber combinations), all online registrations are reviewed and input manually.

For example, common mistakes include putting “Multi” for caliber, putting “AR15” for model (when it’s something like a S&W M&P-15), putting the online store instead of the dealer for the “acquired from” line, missing dashes or numbers in the serial number section, etc.

Whereas all these errors can be easily corrected in-person with whiteout or crossing-out information, the online registration needs to be sent back to the submitter to be corrected (sometimes multiple times).

EDIT: Corrected “had” to “has”
19
General Discussion / Re: Registering a firearm to a spouse
« on: February 07, 2024, 07:47:16 PM »
I think it could  be something like this:
- my daughter gets hunters ed certificate
- she gets the long gun permit
- she registers the ar and ar9

He doesn’t get a permit - he is not buying a firearm
- gets hunters Ed certificate
- goes to hpd with my daughter
- they bring existing registration, hunters Ed card, marriage certificate, his license
- don’t bring ar’s
- does fbi check - rap back? - fingerprint
- pays whatever fees
- get a new registration with both their names

Your SIL will need a Permit to Acquire to acquire the firearm from your daughter, even if it’s joint. Because the transfer is person-to-person, the firearms need to be brought in-person for the registration.
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General Discussion / Re: HPD REGISTRATION E-MAILS
« on: January 06, 2024, 05:45:55 PM »
What's worse is, using online registration was supposed to be a time-saver.  It's crazy that the automated process takes weeks longer than the in-person, manual process.

I'm wondering if HPD is just computer illiterate?

The in-person registration and online registrations are entered into the database by the same clerks. If the city and county doesn’t hire more people to enter the data or if no one wants to work for the city and county, then the process takes a long time.
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