Power of Attorney and buying guns (Read 6874 times)

Aegis808

Power of Attorney and buying guns
« on: October 05, 2011, 10:38:41 AM »
If i gave someone a general power of attorney can they buy guns as a representative of me with it?

Growler67

Re: Power of Attorney and buying guns
« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2011, 10:45:37 AM »
I'm not a lawyer but I'm going to say no.  That may fall under "straw purchase" classification.  They can purchase a firearm if they meet the requirements of Federal, State, County and Municipal laws, i.e no felony convictions, of legal age to do so and so on.  If the State/County/Municipality requires registration, they can register it as well.  Once you have returned to the same location (presuming you are geographically displaced), that individual can sell/transfer the firearm to you, but I don't think someone can purchase on your behalf.....even with a PoA.
Practice does NOT make perfect. Perfection is an Ideal and thus cannot exist in the real world. To seek perfection is to set yourself up for failure. Instead, strive for Excellence. Excellence is an attainable goal - Coach George Yamamoto, Mililani High School, RIP

Tom_G

Re: Power of Attorney and buying guns
« Reply #2 on: October 05, 2011, 12:46:00 PM »
I agree.  PoA does  not give you, or your representative, the ability to break the law.  IANAL, but it sure seems to fit the definition of a straw man purchase to me.
The difference between theory and reality is that, in theory, there is no difference between theory and reality.

Aegis808

Re: Power of Attorney and buying guns
« Reply #3 on: October 05, 2011, 01:39:36 PM »
it's weird in my opinion seeing as that person can do damn near everything as you with a POA

Growler67

Re: Power of Attorney and buying guns
« Reply #4 on: October 05, 2011, 01:45:06 PM »
A PoA allows for another to represent another in their absence, but the the BATFE is pretty clear on "Straw Purchases".

I'm not suggesting anything, but for the sake of arguement:

Person A with a PoA buys a gun as a representative of Person B.  That gun, whether by Person A or another party through theft or other means of custodial care uses said gun in the commision of a crime.  Does Person B go to jail because the gun is "theirs"?

Just trying to illustrate in lay terms the definitions of a "Straw Purchase"/  I still say "no".
Practice does NOT make perfect. Perfection is an Ideal and thus cannot exist in the real world. To seek perfection is to set yourself up for failure. Instead, strive for Excellence. Excellence is an attainable goal - Coach George Yamamoto, Mililani High School, RIP

Growler67

Re: Power of Attorney and buying guns
« Reply #5 on: October 05, 2011, 02:10:22 PM »
Another example:

Person A gives a PoA to Person B.  Person B is 17 years old and Person A wants a particular handgun.  Person B cannot make the purchase even if Person A is over 30 years old with a clean record and never adjudicated as mentally distressed or disqualified.  The PoA doesn NOT allow for the holder to bypass any laws because they are acting on behalf of another.  The 4473 asks directly if the transferee is the owner of the firearm.  If that question is answered "No", the application is rejected and the transfer does not take place because it violates the "straw purchase" provisions.
Practice does NOT make perfect. Perfection is an Ideal and thus cannot exist in the real world. To seek perfection is to set yourself up for failure. Instead, strive for Excellence. Excellence is an attainable goal - Coach George Yamamoto, Mililani High School, RIP

Cougar8045

Re: Power of Attorney and buying guns
« Reply #6 on: October 05, 2011, 03:31:08 PM »
If I were king, you wouldn't even be asking, because you wouldn't need a POA or anything else to buy a gun.  No background check, no waiting period, no registration, no infringement on the right of the people to keep and bear arms.
I'm just a fluffy white bunny rabbit who lost his way. 

"If a thief be found breaking in, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him. ..."  -Exodus 22:2

Kingkeoni

Re: Power of Attorney and buying guns
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2011, 03:49:19 PM »
If I were king, you wouldn't even be asking, because you wouldn't need a POA or anything else to buy a gun.  No background check, no waiting period, no registration, no infringement on the right of the people to keep and bear arms.

Too bad, I'm the king.
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Someday someone may kill you with your own gun, but they should have to beat you to death with it because it is empty.

2aHawaii

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Re: Power of Attorney and buying guns
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2011, 04:04:21 PM »
Not that it matters, but I've heard it argued that a "straw man purchase" is only when a purchase is made for someone that is ineligible to own firearms.

I'm not saying that power of attorney would give the legal ability for a second party to purchase firearms for the first party, but if you follow the previous line of thinking, it may be possible.

If you are seriously thinking of going through with this, consult an attorney.
I am not a lawyer.

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Heavies

Re: Power of Attorney and buying guns
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2011, 07:59:46 PM »
If you are eligible to buy a firearm and your friend  is also eligible, then why doesn't your friend buy the firearm while you are unavailable, register in his/her name, thus 'owning' the firearm.

Upon your return, your friend sells said firearm to you; provided you meet all the legal requirements to own, you register under your name, problem solved. 

That is if your friend doesnt decide that they like the gun and tells you to go get your own.  ;D

You would not provide any cash to the friend in this transaction, therefore, no straw purchase, or whatever you would call it.

My $.02.

Why not just wait? IMHO it is better to see what you want in person anyway.

Cougar8045

Re: Power of Attorney and buying guns
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2011, 09:15:17 PM »
If I were king, you wouldn't even be asking, because you wouldn't need a POA or anything else to buy a gun.  No background check, no waiting period, no registration, no infringement on the right of the people to keep and bear arms.

Too bad, I'm the king.
Well, fix it then, sire! ;D
I'm just a fluffy white bunny rabbit who lost his way. 

"If a thief be found breaking in, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him. ..."  -Exodus 22:2

vooduchikn

Re: Power of Attorney and buying guns
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2011, 10:38:11 PM »
A PoA allows for another to represent another in their absence, but the the BATFE is pretty clear on "Straw Purchases".

I'm not suggesting anything, but for the sake of arguement:

Person A with a PoA buys a gun as a representative of Person B.  That gun, whether by Person A or another party through theft or other means of custodial care uses said gun in the commision of a crime.  Does Person B go to jail because the gun is "theirs"?

Just trying to illustrate in lay terms the definitions of a "Straw Purchase"/  I still say "no".

And the BATFE suddenly has ANY credibility when it comes to legality?

Actually, you are correct. One cannot purchase firearms on a POA.
Relax, I've banned myself..

Aegis808

Re: Power of Attorney and buying guns
« Reply #12 on: October 06, 2011, 06:07:01 AM »
i'm not gonna try and do this and im sure i'm not the first to think about it. however it just seems weird that people can do so much in your name with a POA but then much like everything else in the world a gun is proven the exception to the rule and just wondering on how the legal craziness works around this.