Virginia Revokes Reciprocity Based On Faulty Premise (Read 5872 times)

mauidog

Virginia Revokes Reciprocity Based On Faulty Premise
« on: December 22, 2015, 08:33:04 PM »
If you ever researched or obtained a non-resident CCW permit, you've heard the advise it's best to get multiple permits with overlapping reciprocity. 
The reason for this is states can, and do, change their reciprocity agreements to no longer honor specific states' permits.  It's good to have two permits
accepted in a state, preventing you from getting jammed up if "caught" carrying a concealed firearm with a permit that's no longer valid there.

Virginia is the latest example of this.  They just withdrew their reciprocity agreement with 25 of the 30 states they have honored for a very long time.

It's the reason they did this which is crazy.  According to the Virginia Attorney General:

Quote
The audit, conducted jointly by the attorney general’s office and the Virginia State Police, found that the requirements to acquire a concealed carry permit in 25 of the 30
states currently recognized by Virginia weren’t strong enough to keep a person from obtaining a permit who would be disqualified under Virginia law.

Those who would be disqualified in Virginia include

people convicted of a felony,
domestic abuse,
or drunk driving.
Mentally ill people and
those dishonorably discharged from the military

are also barred from carrying handguns in Virginia.

The obvious problem is, those specific classes of bared individuals are not legally able to own a gun based on federal laws!

Quote
The Gun Control Act (GCA) makes it unlawful for certain categories of persons to ship, transport, receive, or possess firearms.
18 USC 922(g). Transfers of firearms to any such prohibited persons are also unlawful. 18 USC 922(d).

These categories include any person:

Under indictment or information in any court for a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year;

convicted of a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year;


who is a fugitive from justice;

who is an unlawful user of or addicted to any controlled substance;

who has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution;

who is an illegal alien;

who has been discharged from the military under dishonorable conditions;

who has renounced his or her United States citizenship;

who is subject to a court order restraining the person from harassing, stalking, or threatening an intimate partner or child of the intimate partner; or

who has been convicted of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence
(enacted by the Omnibus Consolidated Appropriations Act of 1997, Pub. L. No. 104-208, effective September 30, 1996). 18 USC 922(g) and (n).

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/identify-prohibited-persons

http://danaloeschradio.com/virginia-revokes-reciprocity-based-on-faulty-premise

https://www.nraila.org/articles/20151222/nra-condemns-virginia-attorney-general-s-decision-to-play-politics-with-self-defense-rights


The obvious question is, in all their "auditing" of state's CCW rules, did they ever once bother to check the ATF rules above??

If not, they are incompetent. 

If they did, they are willfully lying about their reasons.

 :wtf:
An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it.   -- Jeff Cooper

Wake27

Re: Virginia Revokes Reciprocity Based On Faulty Premise
« Reply #1 on: December 22, 2015, 09:16:03 PM »
The governor is a known 2A hater. VA used to be one of the greatest states. DC's filth is steadily trickling South.

eyeeatingfish

Re: Virginia Revokes Reciprocity Based On Faulty Premise
« Reply #2 on: December 22, 2015, 09:37:05 PM »
Maybe it is the drunk driving charge?

I didn't know that renouncing your citizenship meant you can't own guns. That one is interesting.

mauidog

Re: Virginia Revokes Reciprocity Based On Faulty Premise
« Reply #3 on: December 22, 2015, 10:12:04 PM »
Maybe it is the drunk driving charge?

I didn't know that renouncing your citizenship meant you can't own guns. That one is interesting.

There's a 3-year expiration for the DUI restriction.  Not exactly the most serious restriction when they let you apply after NOT GETTING CAUGHT DRIVING DRUNK for three years prior.  Doesn't mean you didn't do it the day before applying!   :wacko:

Quote
An individual who has been convicted of a violation of Section 18.2-266 or a substantially similar local ordinance, or of
public drunkenness, or of a substantially similar offense under the laws of any other state, the District of Columbia, the United
States, or its territories within the three-year period immediately preceding the application, or who is a habitual
drunkard as determined pursuant to Section 4.1-33.
An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it.   -- Jeff Cooper

mauidog

Re: Virginia Revokes Reciprocity Based On Faulty Premise
« Reply #4 on: December 22, 2015, 10:25:13 PM »
Link to the actual reciprocity for Virginia CCW:

http://www.vsp.state.va.us/Firearms_Reciprocity.shtm

Once Virginia revokes reciprocity on Feb 1, some states will reciprocate :)  by no longer honoring Virginia permit holder's right to carry in these states:

According to the legal review conducted by the Attorney General’s Office, certain states will no longer recognize Virginia concealed handgun permits
because Virginia no longer recognizes that jurisdiction’s concealed handgun permit. 
These states are:

Florida
Louisiana
North Dakota
Pennsylvania
South Carolina
Wyoming 

So, if you have VA CCW, these states will not honor that permit.  Virginia's decision not only hurts out of state visitors, but also screws Virginia residents who travel out of state.
An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it.   -- Jeff Cooper

Heavies

Re: Virginia Revokes Reciprocity Based On Faulty Premise
« Reply #5 on: December 22, 2015, 11:41:53 PM »
Imagine if driver's licensing was so stringent. ...

mauidog

Re: Virginia Revokes Reciprocity Based On Faulty Premise
« Reply #6 on: December 23, 2015, 12:14:45 AM »
Imagine if driver's licensing was so stringent. ...

Imagine if you had to meet similar restrictions before making a baby!

Lots of guys would never even make babies if they hadn't broken a few of these rules!   :rofl:
An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it.   -- Jeff Cooper

RSN172

Re: Virginia Revokes Reciprocity Based On Faulty Premise
« Reply #7 on: December 23, 2015, 08:01:55 PM »
If you ever researched or obtained a non-resident CCW permit, you've heard the advise it's best to get multiple permits with overlapping reciprocity. 
The reason for this is states can, and do, change their reciprocity agreements to no longer honor specific states' permits.  It's good to have two permits
accepted in a state, preventing you from getting jammed up if "caught" carrying a concealed firearm with a permit that's no longer valid there.

Virginia is the latest example of this.  They just withdrew their reciprocity agreement with 25 of the 30 states they have honored for a very long time.


Very true.  I have UT, NV and AZ permits.  NV did not have reciprocity with VA, AZ will lose theirs, but the UT permit is still good in VA.
Happily living in Puna

suka

Re: Virginia Revokes Reciprocity Based On Faulty Premise
« Reply #8 on: December 23, 2015, 08:14:47 PM »
I carried just last month in VA visiting DC, looks like it will drop PA from the reap list.

mauidog

Re: Virginia Revokes Reciprocity Based On Faulty Premise
« Reply #9 on: December 28, 2015, 05:27:16 PM »
Maybe it is the drunk driving charge?

I didn't know that renouncing your citizenship meant you can't own guns. That one is interesting.

Really?  It's item j. on the ATF form 4473 you have to answer when purchasing a firearm. 

Did you read the questions, or did you just pencil whip them with "No" so you wouldn't be denied??


An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it.   -- Jeff Cooper