On sunday while zeroing my aimpoint t1 at the range, i thought of this concept similar to tracking point scope works, but not for long range precision shooting, where the optic is a auto zero/ballistic drop (without the bc reticle) and a intergral range finder in one. basically to explain, when you zero your optics at certain distances, some require a holdover or is couple inches off from your point of aim vs your point of impact, to keep it simple, since theres alot of science and variables other factors that play into it,i havent put more thought into this yet but what if there was a red dot that was auto programmed with a range finder in it, where your red dot is auto adjusted right after you put it on a target so it hits dead center at that distance so you dont have to remember any holdovers or constantly adjusting, not at the level of tracking point but somewhat inspired by it, the optic would constantly adjust its reticle, a simple red dot, and it shows the distance of the target on the side of the screen so you dont have to like compensate for the distance by holding high or low, although other variables like the bullet weight, ammunition, velocity, wind speed direction, etc could play a small role but at the distance you will be shooting at its at most 25-500yrds in for an AR, but not 1000+ yards so wind won't affect your ballistic coefficient in the distance you'll be shooting with a red dot. basically just a auto pilot zero when you aim at a target at a distance, like a very simplified tracking red dot that predicts where the bullet impact will be so it adjusts. the bullet will always hit dead center of the dot even out to 500 so you dont have to hold high well as long as the round is capable of the distance though and as far as your eyes can see or with some help of magnification. just an idea i wanted to share. hope its a good idea

That's a fantastic idea!  Of course, complexity is the enemy of reliability, so I can see resistance to the idea, but... wow! 

hehe thanks was hesitant what people would think of it, though but since i wonder what i would eventually go to college for i was kinda interested in technology & engineering, idk lots of things, anyways just gonna brainstorm in the meantime, also was thinking for all you reloaders, that you could include adding in your own load datas into the program and it calculates the dot automatically for you, but this leads to more of precision long range. in the meantime if i ever have the means to make this ever happen, i would have to think of all the short coming, more with our current technology, was also thinking of any possible replacement of gunpowder that had more energy efficiency, but we still use gun powder because its one of the most efficient and simple thing we had for a long time, was looking into new ideas for progress, maybe not shoot lasers yet but something to progress, may we be a step ahead of our enemies XD

Check out this for some ideas somewhat in line with what you're thinking. http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2014/08/19/custom-eotech-reticle-arduino-inside/

Funny... I was thinking that an LCD display would be the way to approach Veurs' idea.  Validation!

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Were you watching either RoboCop or Ironman recently?   

I keed, I keed. 

On a more serious note, I would have some reservations on the ranging element.  When I use a laser rangefinder for golf, I often have to double check to make sure I am ranging the correct object, or at least the object that I'm intending to range.  It is really easy to get the range for objects around the object I'm intending to get the range for.  It's really easy to laze a "wrong" target even at say 100 yards and it gets a lot worse at 200 yards let alone 500 yards.  I've learned the hard way to double check or to even "shoot" a larger object near the intended object as a check.  That process doesn't take but a few seconds, but it still isn't like a "snap" thing.  My point is that I think you could get the technology to do what you envision, but not sure how to go about being sure that you are ranging the intended target and not something beyond or just infront. 

Still, interesting thought though.   

So you mean an integrated rangefinder + scope that tells you BDC?

Already exist...

http://www.burrisoptics.com/eliminatorIII.html
http://www.zeiss.com/sports-optics/en_us/hunting/riflescopes/victory-riflescopes/victory-diarange-riflescopes.html

Here's one that does windage also
http://www.accurateshooter.com/optics/new-wind-reading-lidar-laserscope/

If you want the capability to do so without the complexity of a rangefinder, check out the Primary Arms ACSS reticles

So you mean an integrated rangefinder + scope that tells you BDC?

Already exist...

http://www.burrisoptics.com/eliminatorIII.html
http://www.zeiss.com/sports-optics/en_us/hunting/riflescopes/victory-riflescopes/victory-diarange-riflescopes.html

Here's one that does windage also
http://www.accurateshooter.com/optics/new-wind-reading-lidar-laserscope/

If you want the capability to do so without the complexity of a rangefinder, check out the Primary Arms ACSS reticles

I think he's taking it a step beyond that.  He's talking (I think) about a sight that would not only range your target and calculate holdover, but automatically adjust itself accordingly.  In other words, a sight that you never have to adjust, never have to use holdover, never have to think.  If the red dot is on the target, the target will be hit.

At least, that's the product I would want!

On a more serious note, I would have some reservations on the ranging element.  When I use a laser rangefinder for golf, I often have to double check to make sure I am ranging the correct object, or at least the object that I'm intending to range.  It is really easy to get the range for objects around the object I'm intending to get the range for.  It's really easy to laze a "wrong" target even at say 100 yards and it gets a lot worse at 200 yards let alone 500 yards.  I've learned the hard way to double check or to even "shoot" a larger object near the intended object as a check.  That process doesn't take but a few seconds, but it still isn't like a "snap" thing. 

This is why I prefer optical rangefinders to laser rangefinders.  But I stray from the topic...

The fact that ranging today isn't a 100% foolproof snap process doesn't mean it won't be so tomorrow.  Let's see what Brownells has for sale in 2 years!

I think he's taking it a step beyond that.  He's talking (I think) about a sight that would not only range your target and calculate holdover, but automatically adjust itself accordingly.  In other words, a sight that you never have to adjust, never have to use holdover, never have to think.  If the red dot is on the target, the target will be hit.

At least, that's the product I would want!

Yeah I understood what he meant.

That's what the Burris Eliminator does - it moves the red dot around the scope to compensate for the BDC. When all is functioning correctly, you just make the red dot appear on the target and bob's your uncle - no holdover for BDC. Actually looks like the newer version (3) does some sort of windage compensation though I doubt it works very well and I believe you still have to holdover for windage.

If you want the reticle always centered in the screen, I suppose you could move the entire sight with some sort of actuator (piston or wormdrive maybe?). Calibration would be likely a nightmare and it would be heavy and.. ultimately work the same way (line up red dot with target).

Hmm, I was thinking more of just an Eotech looking style, cqb type optic, that doesn't have any cross hairs, just simple clean and easy to pick up. Problem I find with the scopes for cqb use is that some of them are really busy to the eye, of course there's all kinds of different reticles but i would like those ballistic drops eliminated, yet our current range finding capabilities aren't as fast as a skilled shooter but one day the technology will get there, snap shooting will be of ease, especially with something like counter terrorism when the guys holding the hostage you definitely want that bullet to impact where your aiming in those precious seconds. The intended use I was thinking of is more like close quarters like swat, delta, seal team style raids, not literally but you kinda get the picture i hope, basically never need to zero, maybe download/pre program in your reloads or type of ammo data and then can always have a setting button to choose which type of ammo and voala its set for you, just a plain screen with a dot, maybe it'll read the distance on the side of the screen but it wont be a busy screen, no ballistic drop grid, reticle to calculate distance of your target like trijicon acog, though those are great optics of course, that burris eliminators pretty cool though  but my intended concept is not meant for precision long range as mentioned.

of course these things are always hard when the human element is part of it as well, any human error would still affect the trajectory such as if you yank the trigger or anticipate recoil, so I was thinking at certain distances incase the human error plays there should be a program in it to make sure it lands within the combat effective zone with in x amount from y meters, since human error is something hard to remove from the equation hehe. Well, we mustn't rely fully on technology to shoot for us. always do our part and consistently practice  but technology has made shooting even easier whether its a red dot for speed, a scope for precision, reloading, how the barrels made either for longer lasting cold hammer forged, chrome moly vanadium, or a stainless steel barrel that has a shorter life span, there will certainly be some trade offs. I'm always constantly evaluating and thinking of how it can be achieved, lots of trial and error, and different ways to approach it. parallax is another known problem, more prevalent with scopes, but even some parallax free optics at certain distances will have some. hmm i should invent an eyeball that aims perfectly for you! lol jk

Great idea, but technology isn't there yet.  A laser range finding scope with a computer to do it and LCD or motorized LED and larger battery would be pretty huge right now.  It would no doubt come along eventually when technology catches up and makes everything smaller.

Memorizing the ballistics table and learning to do range estimation works for now.  That's what makes it challenging and you have to learn skills.

Otherwise just get a robot to shoot for you.

agreed, just thought it was a cool concept, we have advance tools now because of progress in machining and technological advancements, of course good old fashion shooting is what makes it fun, but still never know, these types of tools put us a step above our enemies, as well as could possibly save soldiers on the field or hostages in a tight situation, not saying it will but you kinda get what im trying to come across. think of how much ammo could be conserved, lol

No harm in doing such a thing, but in a true dynamic CQB environment it is so simple for a proficient shooter to understand and apply a red dot and its hold off through a large range of distances from contact on out to longer distances.  I might think that the technology to be worth a crap would be so complex that it would probably be so cost prohibitive that I am not sure that the "juice" would be worth the "squeeze" so to speak.   The technology would need to be dead accurate, rugged, stupid simple and cost effective for the user.  If not the initial interest may not generate enough sales and user support to sustain continued research / improvements on future models. 

Not trying to be negative as ideas are what drive technology, but from my experience in this industry has shown the above to be a very valid concern for new manufacturers of any product.  As mentioned above by New Guy you need to go through and pay close attention to the SWOT matrix for any idea / product.

agreed, just thought it was a cool concept, we have advance tools now because of progress in machining and technological advancements, of course good old fashion shooting is what makes it fun, but still never know, these types of tools put us a step above our enemies, as well as could possibly save soldiers on the field or hostages in a tight situation, not saying it will but you kinda get what im trying to come across. think of how much ammo could be conserved, lol

For the military, I agree that this would be of tremendous use in long range engagements, like in afghanistan.  Most Soldiers have a hard time zeroing their sights at 25 yards. Not their fault, just the military favors overwhelming firepower over training accuracy.

well the concept for my thought was exactly that, although the technology would be quite complex over time it will become simplified, like how when lasers first started off, they were huge and clumsy, now we have micro sized lasers with IR etc.. like peq boxes, same thing with early night vision models now we moved up to pvs14s, 15s, 20etc.. gen 2, gen 3. Can't get to the final without trial and error, of course thats why there will always be multiple generations of the product, always something to improve on, and my thought on the dot was that it could make it more simple for the end user since you don't have to zero in, adjust any turrets, do any holdovers, cause under stress last thing they be thinking of is how high they should hold the dot above their enemies head. i've never experienced combat or anything so i wouldn't know what goes on but, i hope this type of technology would help one day, but like i said you still have to train to do your part, the trigger won't pull for you, recoil although minimum still plays a role. The dot will only let you know that the bullet will definitely impact there, even if this would lean more towards combat etc... i would like that citizens own whatever they like, same thing with the whole AR argument. because we can.

hey guys, its been a year since i thought of this concept, while i did more research, in the meantime, i need to figure out its feasibility and if there would be a market that it would exceed with like mil/le or 3gun, need some experienced shooters feedback, can you guys list all the drawbacks as well as practicalities of my auto zero dot concept. thanks and i need to figure out if its possible in time to fit everything as compact and eotech or elcan specter dr size housing with all i mentioned previously, it would help if someone with an engineering/coding experience can tell me if its possible in the next couple years, anyone that 3 guns could you tell me if this would work well in run&gun? or tactical applications, still on the swot analysis

Just patent the idea/concept and hopefully someone else makes it while you still have an active patent.