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  • HDF Suit: State Response Due: September 21, 2011
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HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS (Read 376114 times)

2aHawaii

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Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #220 on: March 22, 2012, 03:00:10 AM »
Thank you for the timely write-ups Chris and PeaShooter.

Chris, it's hard to believe your some normal guy that has to work instead of some rich superhero </sarcasm> :P
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I am not a lawyer.

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." - United States Constitution Amendment 2 & Hawaii State Constitution Article 1 Section 17

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drck1000

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #221 on: March 22, 2012, 06:58:03 AM »
Sorry to hear about this, but it does sound like there were some positives that came out of the process.

Thank you very much for the efforts on this guys! Will be keeping an eye out for sure on how this progresses. 
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kong

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #222 on: March 22, 2012, 08:09:22 AM »
I think this is not a roadblock but a bump in the road.  Sounds like the judge is keeping the state, since it is the state that makes the HRS and the state that has to abide by the Constitution via the 14th Amendment.  BUt then again I'm no lawyer but KK maybe.
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HiCarry

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #223 on: March 22, 2012, 12:43:20 PM »
Quote from: rswarrior1700 on March 21, 2012, 04:53:31 PM
Sound like a good idea for Shooting Sports Fair, so HRA and Life help with the funding what about the NRA?
LIFE and HRA have already contributed funds for the effort, and will likely contribute more. Anything else we can do to support this, like using the SSF, we'd be happy to do. The NRA has been hesitant to contribute but maybe if enough NRA members were to call and "suggest" they help support, maybe they'd change their minds.....
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HiCarry

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #224 on: March 22, 2012, 12:53:52 PM »
The outcome of the case is a bit of a disappointment. But, that being said, it's not over. It looks like we'll have to wait until Nordyke's decision is out before moving forward with anything. So, that gives us a little bit of time. As you may have noticed in the writeup by David Sgan, there are areas we may be able to bolster our position (and this is not to infer that any of the attorneys working on the case didn't do their best or did something "wrong," that is not the case). The biggest factor, if we want to present the best case, is to raise more money. Chris (and his lawyers) have been working on a shoe-string budget and could use a little financial "breathing room" as well as the resources to make the best possible case. So, put on your thinking caps and figure out ow to raise money....volunteer some time to help Chris with mailings, document prep, or whatever else he needs. Donate a little more to the cause....instead of that grande double latte, send the cash to Chris.

A good out come, even if we have to wait a while, will benefit us all.

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rswarrior1700

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #225 on: March 22, 2012, 04:01:55 PM »
Question how long did other trials for other states lasted before the final decision was made?

Well I said this because I was speaking to a process server that I know and he told me a story of the Ward family dispute lawsuit back in the day(think Ward warehouse,etc). The story was that the when Ward past away had split his inheritance amongst his children, however those children thought they deserve more than the other so they sue each other to the last penny. End result they end up with nothing due to the money used for legal fees and whatnot,  the firms representing from what I heard went bankrupt due to how long the trial was.

"Longer you stay in the firefight the less chance of survival."

I for one support you fully in getting this done and will donate when I can. Got a brick chucked to the head by a drunk Micronesian a few years back so yeah Hawaii is not safe place at all.
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Cougar8045

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #226 on: March 22, 2012, 04:40:00 PM »
Yeah, I agree with HiCarry.  Let's not all get down, I'd compare this to the first half of the game.  Now it's halftime, and we need to look at what adjustments we can make for the second half.  Doesn't mean our game plan sucked to start with, or that we didn't try hard enough, or that we're going to lose.  Everyone makes adjustments at the half!   :thumbsup: 

Besides, it sounds to me like we did pretty well so far, I half-expected the judge to simply declare that there is no constitutional basis for the suit and toss it out.  Great job to all involved; hopefully I'll be able to make it to the next hearing when they go over the actual merits of the case.  I don't know much about the law, but apparently this wasn't really the arguing portion of the case; just the procedural stuff. 

Also, I think this might make it easier to raise funds and support from other organizations.  Up until now, the case was sort of an abstraction that was "in the works".  Now, it's more like, "This is happening, right now!", and I think that will help open some pocketbooks and hopefully garner some support from the big dogs.  Keep the faith, all!
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rswarrior1700

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #227 on: March 22, 2012, 05:24:10 PM »
Quote from: Cougar8045 on March 22, 2012, 04:40:00 PM
Yeah, I agree with HiCarry.  Let's not all get down, I'd compare this to the first half of the game.  Now it's halftime, and we need to look at what adjustments we can make for the second half.  Doesn't mean our game plan sucked to start with, or that we didn't try hard enough, or that we're going to lose.  Everyone makes adjustments at the half!   :thumbsup: 

Besides, it sounds to me like we did pretty well so far, I half-expected the judge to simply declare that there is no constitutional basis for the suit and toss it out.  Great job to all involved; hopefully I'll be able to make it to the next hearing when they go over the actual merits of the case.  I don't know much about the law, but apparently this wasn't really the arguing portion of the case; just the procedural stuff. 

Also, I think this might make it easier to raise funds and support from other organizations.  Up until now, the case was sort of an abstraction that was "in the works".  Now, it's more like, "This is happening, right now!", and I think that will help open some pocketbooks and hopefully garner some support from the big dogs.  Keep the faith, all!
Halftime since so put it that way
HRA BBQ THIS SUNDAY
FEATURING LOTS AND LOTS OF FIREARMS THIS SUNDAY
GREAT FOOD THIS SUNDAY
ALL HAPPENING THIS.....
SUNDAY SUNDAY SUNDAY[/SIZE=36PT]
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rswarrior1700

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #228 on: March 22, 2012, 05:28:01 PM »
Quote from: rswarrior1700 on March 22, 2012, 05:24:10 PM
Halftime since so put it that way
HRA BBQ THIS SUNDAY
FEATURING LOTS AND LOTS OF FIREARMS THIS SUNDAY
GREAT FOOD THIS SUNDAY
ALL HAPPENING THIS.....
SUNDAY SUNDAY SUNDAY[/size=36pt]
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HiCarry

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #229 on: March 23, 2012, 09:39:32 AM »
rswarrior - The Nordyke case, which is the California case we were stayed for (waiting for their decision) has taken 12-13 years. Heller was a culmination of 6 years of effort. SO these things do take time and often get delayed. So, with that in mind, we have to keep reminding ourselves that this is a long-term effort and plan accordingly.

On another note, I just got the NRA-ILA legislative update and it reviews the current NRA supported cases. At the end, it has a section that says: "Tell us what you think." Maybe we should use that avenue to have everyone call and write the NRA-ILA and ask why they are not supporting our efforts here in Hawaii....

Quote
If you have any comments on the NRA-ILA Legal Update or suggestions for topics, please e-mail us at legalupdate@nrahq.org. Please do not send requests for legal assistance to this address. Those should be sent to the attention of NRA-ILA Legislative Counsel via phone at (703) 267-1161; fax to (703) 267-1164; or e-mail to ILALegal@nrahq.org.
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Gordyf

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #230 on: March 25, 2012, 06:00:43 PM »
I see we  got some ink in the local News Rag. B section this morning's paper.
Have to question the validity of the claim that there were only 14 folks that applied for a concealed permit last year, but maybe somebody out there can verify.
Notable that "all" were denied. Also notable  and not reported was the fact that most process servers are active or retired LEO's and are permitted to carry.
Additionally worthy of note and reported was the fact that the Brady Bunch filed an Amicus brief. I can't help but notice that there was nothing from those National organizations that
that I have sent money to on fairly regular occasions. The NRA, GOA etc...The anti's don't miss a beat. WHERE WERE OUR ADVOCATES and their legal team???
I think any future disposable donation money will be with HDF and the rest can do without until this has run it's course. Local issues
Always trump.
Aloha
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Aloha
Gordy

Funtimes

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #231 on: March 25, 2012, 08:13:33 PM »
The claim about process servers and me being the only one makes me laugh.  My boss (at the process serving company) also cited self-defense and threats while serving process.  How do I know? We helped him write his narrative report -_-  and we got our denials at the same time.
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230RN

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Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #232 on: March 26, 2012, 07:47:24 AM »
In the meantime, the Government ha$ all tho$e full-time $alaried lawyer$ working on it.

Remember that, folk$.

It'$ a crying $hame that  it co$t$ $o much to re-in$titutionalize a clearly and unequivocally $tated right in our founding document$.


 :(   :'(
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I do believe that the radical and crazy notion that the Founders meant what they said, is gradually soaking through the judicial system.

mauiblue

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #233 on: May 21, 2012, 11:59:48 AM »
If this has been covered before, my apologies. Will the National right to carry bill working its way through Congress benefit us in Hawaii?
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eyeeatingfish

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #234 on: May 21, 2012, 01:26:12 PM »
Quote from: mauiblue on May 21, 2012, 11:59:48 AM
If this has been covered before, my apologies. Will the National right to carry bill working its way through Congress benefit us in Hawaii?

Theoretically it should. If the national law were passed and I cam across someone armed with a permit I would certainly not arrest, though I might document so I do not get yelled at at work. (I work law enforcement)

However one of two things could happen.  A test case could go through and a judge could somehow decide that we don't have concealed carry since permits are almost never issued or the legislature could rewrite the law so there is no concealed carry whatsoever.
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mauiblue

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #235 on: May 29, 2012, 09:25:14 PM »
I've been watching the news and CBS News reports that many states have shown an increase in the issuance of CCW permits. I know of two retired MPD officers that actually jumped through all the hoops and got Hawaii issued CCW permits. Of course there is a national law that allows retired LE to acquire permits. I wish law abiding Hawaii citizens would be allowed to carry legally too:o
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Funtimes

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #236 on: June 01, 2012, 05:35:37 AM »
NOTICE OF APPEAL : PRELIMINARY INJUNCTION APPEAL as to 51 by Christopher Baker. Refer to entry 53 and 54 ; entered by counsel (eps)CERTIFICATE OF SERVICEParticipants registered to receive electronic notifications received this document electronically at the e-mail address listed on the Notice of Electronic Filing (NEF). Participants not registered to receive electronic notifications were served by first class mail on the date of this docket entry (Entered: 05/29/2012)

USCA Appeal Fees received $ 455 receipt number HI003934 re 55 , 54 , 53 Notice of Interlocutory Appeal, filed by Christopher Baker (eps)No COS issued for this docket entry (Entered: 05/29/2012)       

2012-05-30    57    0       USCA Case Number CA 12-16258 for 55 Preliminary Injunction Appeal, filed by Christopher Baker. (eps )No COS issued for this docket entry (Entered: 05/30/2012)    

2012-05-30    58    0       USCA Time Schedule Order as to 55 Preliminary Injunction Appeal, filed by Christopher Baker. (eps)No COS issued for this docket entry (Entered: 05/30/2012)       

2012-05-31    59    0       Attorney Appeal Packet re 55 Preliminary Injunction Appeal, 53 ; 54 (Attachments: # 1 Instructions For Civil Appeals, # 2 Letter re Court Reporters, # 3 Instructions Transcript Designation & Ordering Form, # 4 Transcript Designation & Ordering Form, # 5 Notice of Appeal, # 6 Docket Sheet)(eps )CERTIFICATE OF SERVICEParticipants registered to receive electronic notifications received this document electronically at the e-mail address listed on the Notice of Electronic Filing (NEF). Participants not registered to receive electronic notifications were served by first class mail on the date of this docket entry (Entered: 05/31/2012)


---- This is our latest. We are going to the next court, this is a very expensive battle coming so please send donations (Just paperwork is going to be probably around 1k-2k) ; freedom is not free.
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Check out the Hawaii Defense Foundation.
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Posts are not legal advice & are my own, unless said so.

Bacon

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #237 on: June 10, 2012, 04:47:08 PM »
Is there anything else we can do besides donate? Any non-lawyer work that we could help with?
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Funtimes

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #238 on: June 10, 2012, 05:01:16 PM »
Quote from: Bacon on June 10, 2012, 04:47:08 PM
Is there anything else we can do besides donate? Any non-lawyer work that we could help with?

Writing articles, reviews of firearms, equipment, etc. can help.   Taking photographs of a HDF gun safety class for us, videoing portion of a gun safety class for us.  Linking articles relevant to firearms on the HDF facebook page, tweets about very relevant current events.  Marketing (flyers posting), talking to people at the gun shops, gun stores, your friends etc. about the case.   Graphics work, web site work, content, publishing type stuff.  Letter writing (big companies) groups that are gun friendly etc.  Finding an American Samoan that want's a firearm; finding a legal alien (someone with a green card) that wants a firearm.  Finding someone age 18 who wants to own a long gun in their home.  Volunteering to teach with the foundation regularly.  Coming to help shoot with the students, helping clean guns etc.  There are so many things that I spend lots and lots of time doing to prepare and do classes, promote and market HDF, and the like that it is really endless.

The first thing I always ask is what do you like to do?  What are your skills?
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Check out the Hawaii Defense Foundation.
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Defender of the Accused in Arkansas Courts
Posts are not legal advice & are my own, unless said so.

Kingkeoni

Re: HONOLULU POLICE CHIEF AND STATE OF HAWAII SUED FOR SECOND AMENDMENT VIOLATIONS
« Reply #239 on: June 10, 2012, 05:04:35 PM »
I'm willing to volunteer to help pistol instruction whenever you need.
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