Denied today at HPD.

I Last bought both a rifle and pistol in August of last year no problem.They had the kaiser authorization slip there at window then.

So I went to Waipio Kaiser to get clearancae from my DR. Told by, receptionist, Kaiser won't do it and haven't done it in ten years. Emailed Dr.  and received this email from him. 




To:
XXXXXXXX
From:
JONATHAN H SHUN MD, MD
Received:
11/24/2015  7:02 PM HST
Hello Mr. xxxxx,

Sorry about the inconvenience. I just printed out Kaiser's policy on 'Requests for Medical Clearance for Firearms Permits'. This form states Kaiser physicians 'are unable to provide this type of evaluation'. Therefore, as an employee of Kaiser, neither I, nor any other Kaiser physician, is allowed to provide any form of medical clearance related to firearms permits.
Kaiser does state (in the letter) that 'you may choose to see an independent practitioner in the community, at your own expense, to provide an assessment regarding your capacity to obtain or operate a firearm'. If necessary, you can sign out your medical records to assist the outside practitioner in providing you the medical clearance. I hope this information is helpful.


Sincerely,

Jonathan Shun MD


Message cut and copied from Kaiser message center. Only my name has been exed out. F*** kaiser and F*** my DR.  thats my policy

C.Y.A. , P.C., B.S.,  via POS, D.R.

For the record I have no arrests nor disqualifying mental history, ever. If a class action is filed feel free to contact me. If I haven't fled this worse then california F****** state

Attention all you Kaiser members who have had some problems with HPD in
obtaining firearms permits.

The same attorney that took on HDF's Chris
Baker's case and the resident alien (Fotoudis) case, is looking for Kaiser
members for a possible legal action. If you are a Kaiser member and have had any
problems relating to obtaining a firearm permit, please given him a call to
discuss your circumstances. He is particularly interested in the gentleman who
was denied based on some diabetic counseling he received.

Here's the
contact info:

Richard Holcomb
(808) 545-4040

Here is the info again, so no one has to go through all of the tread.  I will also sticky the other topic to the top of legal and activism.

Here is the info again, so no one has to go through all of the tread.  I will also sticky the other topic to the top of legal and activism.

oh, man, guys
it's on
EVERYONE with kaiser and straub call wolfwood ASAP

oh, man, guys
it's on
EVERYONE with kaiser and straub call wolfwood ASAP

I think this is starting to progress beyond Kaiser and Straub, and starting to involve everyone.

This is just ridiculous.  Your PCP decides to not play the HPD games, so you have to waste time and money for A COMPLETE STRANGER to evaluate you -- someone who may not even ask to see your HMO records.  My guess is they ask you to fill out the standard new patient questionnaire.

How, exactly, does a doctor who never met or treated you before writing you a clearance letter make the public safer?

Yes, that's a rhetorical question...

I think this is starting to progress beyond Kaiser and Straub, and starting to involve everyone.

possible, but we have to start somewhere, and obviously straub and kaiser have drawn the line in the sand, and they have to be stopped
stop them, and no one else should try and do it
we need to make as big a case as soon as possible against these two if we have any chance of keeping it from spreading

Yes I can personally confirm that I am getting forced to do the letter.  I have 0 family, past, or current mental issues.  My primary care physician (PCP) is affiliated with a Straub clinic and my insurance is through HMSA.  I will have to contact my PCP and see if he will provide a letter.  Been so busy I haven't been able to get to it.

I wonder if I will be in the same boat? I have HMSA and my GP is not a Straub doctor per se but his office is a also a Straub location and he is listed as a Hawaii Health Partner physician, https://www.hawaiihealthpartners.org/about-hhp/overview/ HHP is somehow tied in to Hawaii Pacific Health Straub's over all organization. Next time I go I will have to ask him if he even see's whatever it is that HPD sends when I apply for a permit and if so what he does with it.

I don't see why people are so negative and reading into it as a new oppressive HPD policy. HRS 134-2 & 134-7 are clear and so was the OP.

I know this isn't the section for this stuff, but more people will see it.  Starting today at HPD if you are going to do the paper work to get a permit to aquire (Rifle or Handgun), Kaiser and Straub Hospital changed their procedure. You now have to go and see your personal Doctor have them submit a letter with the Hospital letterhead, saying your not nuts on drugs etc... They then can fax a copy, but still have to mail in the original or if your Doctor will let you, you can take it in when you go to pick up your permit. If the don't let you take the original or a copy in, and they don't fax or mail it in by the last pickup date for your permit, you will have to do the whole 2 week back ground check again.   
Have fun !!

The problem with Kaiser and Straub has been known for a long time. Anyone denied should request a copy of what was provided that disqualified you. It is likely that they (the providers) are interpreting the waiver as their qualifying your medical/mental ability to possess/own and as a result send a letter stating they can not do that. That "form" provided by HPD (posted on page 1) is an outline for what is required because of how the provider(s) are wording "clearance letters". From that point of view it would seem that that outline is provided to help those who are having issues.

Instead of getting mad at the officers at the desk or thinking conspiracy, I feel time would be better spent directing your efforts and outrage at the source of the problem...https://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=20866.0

If anyone needs a doctor to write a note, pm me.

Dumb question:

Why does anyone here still have Kaiser?

Maybe we just need to find a doctor who is friendly to gun rights and we can just see him/her?

Dumb question:

Why does anyone here still have Kaiser?

Maybe we just need to find a doctor who is friendly to gun rights and we can just see him/her?

Some of us don't have a choice since it is employer provided and we can't afford to pay cash for our healthcare.

"The problem with Kaiser and Straub has been known for a long time. Anyone denied should request a copy of what was provided that disqualified you. It is likely that they (the providers) are interpreting the waiver as their qualifying your medical/mental ability to possess/own and as a result send a letter stating they can not do that. That "form" provided by HPD (posted on page 1) is an outline for what is required because of how the provider(s) are wording "clearance letters". From that point of view it would seem that that outline is provided to help those who are having issues.

Instead of getting mad at the officers at the desk or thinking conspiracy, I feel time would be better spent directing your efforts and outrage at the source of the problem...https://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=20866.0

The police are trying to do their job. But don't think for one moment that they want nothing better than to be the only ones with the gun. They were very irritated when I started to respectfully question the implication of the letter and who was the author. Six officers came to the window. I turned on the recorder and at first they resisted talking to me. I spoke with the Sgt, who was very nice and just truing to do his job.  Not sure what you mean by the "source of the problem". The letter from your doctor has to use the  statement at the top.of the page. It is not a template or outline. That statement implies that you've had mental and drug dependency issues in the past. That statement doesn't apply to me. So far I have sent emails to the mayor, chief of police and my representatives.

 From 134-2  "The permit application form and the waiver form shall be prescribed by the attorney general and shall be uniform throughout the State". That form you received was not prescribed by the AG and is not uniform throughout the state.

No doubt this process will have a huge impact on gun sales. If we have to go to court for this, we will need all the gun shops to open their pockets. They are in on this also.   

I haven't had a primary care physician for a few years. I've always put "N/A" for my Doctor and never had a problem obtaining pistol or renewing long gun permits. Has this changed as well?

So glad I read this before buying a handgun on Friday....  So basically all my boss (a doctor) needs to do is copy paste the statement that GZire has on the first page right?  He's not a fan of doing any more work than he already has to lol.

Changed the wording a little cuz I ain't never been no addict or crazy person......

"To whom it may concern,
   “Insert name here” shall own, possess or control any firearm or ammunition and has never been medically documented to be adversely affected by the addiction, abuse, dependence, mental disease, disorder, or defect.

Sincerely,
The Fucking Doctor"

Just want to be sure that this is all the letter has to say......

There is a clearly defined policy from Kaiser does anyone have any written policy from Straub. Does anyone know why they only ask for Straub when Straub is part of the larger Hawaii Pacific Health Organization?

Is anyone here a patient of Dr. Charles Arakaki? Maybe he'd write clearance letters after all what's more manly than a firearm.

So glad I read this before buying a handgun on Friday....  So basically all my boss (a doctor) needs to do is copy paste the statement that GZire has on the first page right?  He's not a fan of doing any more work than he already has to lol.

Changed the wording a little cuz I ain't never been no addict or crazy person......

"To whom it may concern,
   “Insert name here” shall own, possess or control any firearm or ammunition and has never been medically documented to be adversely affected by the addiction, abuse, dependence, mental disease, disorder, or defect.

Sincerely,
The Fucking Doctor"

Just want to be sure that this is all the letter has to say......

Smartest thing I've I have heard so far. Remember ladies and gentlemen. If you use their format verbitom, it implies that you've had these issues in the past. That could come back and bite you in the ass. One day out of no where they will come up with a new rule. Like "give your guns, past mental and drug addiction no longer allows for you to have guns. Change the wording slightly by adding "to my knowledge" in between " been and medically ". "to my knowledge has never been documented"

Yep the terms "no longer adversely affected....." sounds like a trap to me.  No way I would submit that.  There IS an implication that you were at one time affected, even if you where not.  I am not a lawyer, but I do know when people lawyer, one needs to look at every minute detail of the language.  It is there for a reason.

I would slow down and look at everything VERY CAREFULLY before turning anything in..  JMHO

Yep the terms "no longer adversely affected....." sounds like a trap to me.  No way I would submit that.  There IS an implication that you were at one time affected, even if you where not.  I am not a lawyer, but I do know when people lawyer, one needs to look at every minute detail of the language.  It is there for a reason.

I would slow down and look at everything VERY CAREFULLY before turning anything in..  JMHO

Agreed, that's why I changed the wording.  Just want to be clear that the above statement is all that needs to be addressed.  My boss already agreed to sign it.