...
Ladies and Gents,

I would like to make a point about this situation that perhaps no one has brought up yet.
Basically we are in a lose-lose situation.
If you go ahead and make your purchase today then you just bent over and took one in the butt...they win.
If you stopped or delayed a purchase because of this law, then the antigun libs have won a huge victory by stopping a legitimate transaction.
They win again.

CHECKMATE! WE LOST!

Well look what I got this morning from the NRA. How come this canned response doesn't surprise me? Getting ready to tell them to F off, put my patron membership card in the mail and send it to Wayne and tell them to kiss my ass. We are on our own...

Thank you for contacting the NRA-ILA regarding the current state of gun control in Hawaii. The NRA-ILA is aware of the current state of affairs in Hawaii and by no means have given up in your state. The NRA fights day in and day out in order to protect your 2nd Amendment rights, but there are steps you can take to help as well. It is important to contact your state representatives and senators and voice your opinion to them. The change in Hawaii may come, but it will likely be a long and hard fight with many small legislative, political and legal victories.

BULLSHIT!

...
What stupid shortsighted response.
Hawaii is the hole in the dike. Don't they get it?

It's might be a short term loss for us,  IF we give up without a fight and let them implement without active and full resistance.   I am well sure many active members in this community already have 'enough' and are planned enough to get through this dry spell.  Might I suggest using funds to FIGHT instead of buying 'wants' for the time being.  That would be a more worthy investment in the long run anyway.  I certainly feel this is the right thing to do and have made my initial investment and plan on contributing more as funds become available.

I can see why you feel this way, However, looking at the big picture, the NRA is a organization that works on a national level.  At the moment this is a state problem.  When and if this gets to a federal level, they may give us help.  The NRA has done this job very well for many years, and with our support and help many many antigun federal laws have been fought, progun elected officials won, and progun legislation pushed, at the federal level.

For now this is a state issue, and we need to attempt to fix it at this level.


I myself am very happy with the job the NRA is doing, and will continue to support them.


Local level is were we need to come together, and fast, fast , fast.

regarding lose-lose situation.
what is the goal of the anti-gun lib-tards?  easy answer: stop gun sales in Hawaii.

if gun sales continue, business as usual, then they've lost.  i haven't seen a post about how long the lines are at HPD the last couple of days.  what, nobody in line at all?  it can't be that all Hawaii gun owners are that well informed.  we are ignorant people, how else did this pass with only a handful of people showing up to testify against?

if we make a stand on principle, and say, i'm not going to buy any more guns until this goes away (i.e. until hell freezes over?), then they've won.

the fact that Hawaii idiot legistors display blatant disregard of FOPA (now THAT's banana-republic ignorance), maybe that's a separate issue, maybe not.  I think NRA missed the issue, this isn't about gun registration, it's about disregard of FOPA.

personally, i think California, Massachussetts, New York, are in much worse shape than us.  yep, this sure ain't Texas.

regarding lose-lose situation.
what is the goal of the anti-gun lib-tards?  easy answer: stop gun sales in Hawaii.

if gun sales continue, business as usual, then they've lost.  i haven't seen a post about how long the lines are at HPD the last couple of days.  what, nobody in line at all?  it can't be that all Hawaii gun owners are that well informed.  we are ignorant people, how else did this pass with only a handful of people showing up to testify against?

if we make a stand on principle, and say, i'm not going to buy any more guns until this goes away (i.e. until hell freezes over?), then they've won.

the fact that Hawaii idiot legistors display blatant disregard of FOPA (now THAT's banana-republic ignorance), maybe that's a separate issue, maybe not.  I think NRA missed the issue, this isn't about gun registration, it's about disregard of FOPA.

personally, i think California, Massachussetts, New York, are in much worse shape than us.  yep, this sure ain't Texas.

We have not lost by far, I have $3002 in the war chest that says otherwise, We have collected 20% of what we need to get this started in the first 24 hours.

Question:  When is the Rap Back $42 fee charged?  is it charged when someone (1) applies for a handgun permit to acquire, (2) picks up the handgun permit to acquire, or (3) at the time of registration?

1 and 3

1 and 3

Where in the law does it say you have to pay for registration?

Every person registering a firearm under this subsection shall be fingerprinted and photographed by the police department of the county of registration; provided that this requirement shall be waived where fingerprints and photographs are already on file with the police department.  The police department shall perform an inquiry on the [person by using the National Instant Criminal Background Check System] applicant using the Criminal Justice Information System and the National Law Enforcement Telecommunications System, including the Immigration and Naturalization Service query therein, National Crime Information Center, National Instant Criminal Background Check System, and pursuant to section 846-2.7 before any determination to register a firearm is made.

Where in the law does it say you have to pay for registration?

Every person registering a firearm under this subsection shall be fingerprinted and photographed by the police department of the county of registration; provided that this requirement shall be waived where fingerprints and photographs are already on file with the police department.  The police department shall perform an inquiry on the [person by using the National Instant Criminal Background Check System] applicant using the Criminal Justice Information System and the National Law Enforcement Telecommunications System, including the Immigration and Naturalization Service query therein, National Crime Information Center, National Instant Criminal Background Check System, and pursuant to section 846-2.7 before any determination to register a firearm is made.

Every person registering a firearm under this subsection shall be fingerprinted and photographed by the police department of the county of registration; provided that this requirement shall be waived where fingerprints and photographs are already on file with the police department.  The police department shall perform an inquiry on the [person by using the National Instant Criminal Background Check System] applicant using the Criminal Justice Information System and the National Law Enforcement Telecommunications System, including the Immigration and Naturalization Service query therein, National Crime Information Center, National Instant Criminal Background Check System, and pursuant to section 846-2.7 before any determination to register a firearm is made.

"(i)  No fee shall be charged for permits, or applications for permits, under this section, except for a single fee chargeable by and payable to the issuing county, for individuals applying for their first permit, in an amount equal to the fee [actually] charged by the [Federal Bureau of Investigation to the issuing police department for a fingerprint check in connection with that application or permit.] Hawaii criminal justice data center pursuant to section 846-2.7."

IF you already have a permit, why do you have to pay?

Perhaps  they are interpreting the language "for individuals applying for their first permit" to mean "for individuals applying for their first permit after the instigation of the RapBack enrollment requirement"?

"(i)  No fee shall be charged for permits, or applications for permits, under this section, except for a single fee chargeable by and payable to the issuing county, for individuals applying for their first permit, in an amount equal to the fee [actually] charged by the [Federal Bureau of Investigation to the issuing police department for a fingerprint check in connection with that application or permit.] Hawaii criminal justice data center pursuant to section 846-2.7."

IF you already have a permit, why do you have to pay?

if you're wondering why you have to pay, it is because of the "under this section" clause.  the "reasonable fee" language is located in HRS §846-2.7

"(i)  No fee shall be charged for permits, or applications for permits, under this section, except for a single fee chargeable by and payable to the issuing county, for individuals applying for their first permit, in an amount equal to the fee [actually] charged by the [Federal Bureau of Investigation to the issuing police department for a fingerprint check in connection with that application or permit.] Hawaii criminal justice data center pursuant to section 846-2.7."

IF you already have a permit, why do you have to pay?