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GO SHERIFF JOE!! (Read 36732 times)

Kingkeoni

Re: GO SHERIFF JOE!!
« Reply #80 on: September 02, 2012, 08:43:40 AM »
Quote from: armsinc on September 02, 2012, 02:27:43 AM
In college And high school I did many jobs where I worked outdoors such as construction, Rock Wall (lava rock) and picking fruit.
EXACTLY... Everyone did a work program in high school and college. It's like a scared straight program. You realize what you don't want to do for the rest of your life.


 I have friends that currently hold these kinds of jobs. However they do make more minimum-wage (not much).
I'm calling bullshit

And I have friends that are looking for jobs, who would even take these kinds of jobs.
They're always hiring, if they would actually take the jobs, they would already work there. Typical Americans are too lazy or proud to work
12 hour work days in 110 degree temperature.

There are also lots of felons who cant find work and this kind of work is a chance for them to change there lives around... it hard to change from a life of crime especially when there are no jobs.....
Yeah, let's all just go out and hire meth addicts, sex offenders, and murderers.
90% of felons, are back in jail within 5 years of their release, most commit the exact same crimes that put them in there.
It's not lack of jobs that is the reason that they won't "change their lives around" it's the fact that they're social deviants that have something seriously wrong with them.
If you feel so bad for the unemployed felons, you hire them as baby sitters for your children.
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armsinc

Re: GO SHERIFF JOE!!
« Reply #81 on: September 02, 2012, 09:47:50 AM »
Quote from: Kingkeoni on September 02, 2012, 08:43:40 AM
In college And high school I did many jobs where I worked outdoors such as construction, Rock Wall (lava rock) and picking fruit.
EXACTLY... Everyone did a work program in high school and college. It's like a scared straight program. You realize what you don't want to do for the rest of your life.


 I have friends that currently hold these kinds of jobs. However they do make more minimum-wage (not much).
I'm calling bullshit

And I have friends that are looking for jobs, who would even take these kinds of jobs.
They're always hiring, if they would actually take the jobs, they would already work there. Typical Americans are too lazy or proud to work
12 hour work days in 110 degree temperature.

There are also lots of felons who cant find work and this kind of work is a chance for them to change there lives around... it hard to change from a life of crime especially when there are no jobs.....
Yeah, let's all just go out and hire meth addicts, sex offenders, and murderers.
90% of felons, are back in jail within 5 years of their release, most commit the exact same crimes that put them in there.
It's not lack of jobs that is the reason that they won't "change their lives around" it's the fact that they're social deviants that have something seriously wrong with them.
If you feel so bad for the unemployed felons, you hire them as baby sitters for your children.

No... it starting at the bottom  and putting in your time to move up

call it all you want i am from the big island i graduated from kealakehe high school and It is not like Honolulu they are not high-paying jobs all over the place you take what you can get and try to move up. my graduating class there were only 189 people that walk the freshman class was 700-ish people

And what is a typical American?

And who cares if sex offenders and meth heads are picking fruit Or cleaning brush off the side of the road or doing jobs far away from the average person
and no you dont have to have them watching your Children...
And one of the reasons this sociologist think that the recidivism rate is so high is because of lack of stable employment for these people...

« Last Edit: September 02, 2012, 10:07:10 AM by armsinc »
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ArmsInc Hawaii

230RN

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Re: GO SHERIFF JOE!!
« Reply #82 on: September 03, 2012, 07:48:26 AM »
armsinc said (welcome aboard, by the way):

Quote
And one of the reasons this sociologist think(s) that the recidivism rate is so high is because of lack of stable employment for these people...

I believe that's true.  I've often thought of requiring them to join the military for non-combat (i.e., non- shooting) positions.  There are an awful lot of "rear echelon" support positions that can be filled by folks like that which involve training transferable to the civilian side --Signal Corps, cooks, maintenance personnel, clerking, etc. 

Maybe we could "sort of" expunge their records after satisfactory completion of their military hitch, like witness protection programs do, but with required reporting to some kind of probation official just to make sure that they aren't opening child care centers or going to work for a bank and the like. That business of having their records follow them forever is what armsinc refers to, I think.

But what do I know?  I've never been in the military and I sure ain't a corrections expert.

Just throwing that out there.

Terry, 230RN
« Last Edit: September 03, 2012, 07:59:01 AM by 230RN »
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I do believe that the radical and crazy notion that the Founders meant what they said, is gradually soaking through the judicial system.

armsinc

Re: GO SHERIFF JOE!!
« Reply #83 on: September 03, 2012, 09:33:11 PM »
Quote from: 230RN on September 03, 2012, 07:48:26 AM
armsinc said (welcome aboard, by the way):

I believe that's true.  I've often thought of requiring them to join the military for non-combat (i.e., non- shooting) positions.  There are an awful lot of "rear echelon" support positions that can be filled by folks like that which involve training transferable to the civilian side --Signal Corps, cooks, maintenance personnel, clerking, etc. 

Maybe we could "sort of" expunge their records after satisfactory completion of their military hitch, like witness protection programs do, but with required reporting to some kind of probation official just to make sure that they aren't opening child care centers or going to work for a bank and the like. That business of having their records follow them forever is what armsinc refers to, I think.

But what do I know?  I've never been in the military and I sure ain't a corrections expert.

Just throwing that out there.

Terry, 230RN

I agree 230rn

and yes it is true there are just bad people that wont change....
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ArmsInc Hawaii

Funtimes

Re: GO SHERIFF JOE!!
« Reply #84 on: September 04, 2012, 12:41:45 AM »
I went to job corps, where numerous people who were questionable also attended.  People screwed around, worried about how to get cigarettes, and screwed themselves up.    I personally think it is an attitude problem.  I think most of them have an attitude problem.  I firmly believe if you want work, you can find it, and when you can't find it - create it.
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Heavies

Re: GO SHERIFF JOE!!
« Reply #85 on: September 04, 2012, 02:24:44 AM »
Quote from: Funtimes on September 04, 2012, 12:41:45 AM
I went to job corps, where numerous people who were questionable also attended.  People screwed around, worried about how to get cigarettes, and screwed themselves up.    I personally think it is an attitude problem.  I think most of them have an attitude problem.  I firmly believe if you want work, you can find it, and when you can't find it - create it.

+1 :thumbsup:
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230RN

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Re: GO SHERIFF JOE!!
« Reply #86 on: September 04, 2012, 05:55:38 AM »
A lot of it is an attitude problem, partially because of upbringing --or more correctly, lack of it --and there are undoubtedly inherently "bad" people with no conscience or "superego" who ought to be kept out of society. 

But for those who've served their time, paid their debt, have "reformed," and want to continue with their lives as productive members of society, it's very difficult to get over that hump toward legal self-sufficiency when their records follow them forever, and every Tom, Dick, and Terry (and Human Resources Depatment) has access to correctional records on their computer.

Amusingly, the ad that appeared over Heavies' post was this one:



The "real" problem with all this is the simple fact that legal "punishments" have expanded "extra-legally," if you will, into a lifelong punishment sequence. 

Every sentence has become a life sentence.

This is not the way to restore a criminal as a useful member of society. As noted several times herein, this results in a high percentage of recidivism for the obvious reasons noted above.

The only solution as I see it is as I previously mentioned (see REF): a retraining stint, perhaps in the military, but wherever, expungement of records available to the public, a legal device to allow former inmates to "lie" about their records on things like employment applications, and a monitored --not "probation" per se, but "mentored," if you will --period after release and re-training.

Wild idea?  Crazy?

But repeatedly doing what doesn't work, as with our present correctional system, is a popular definition of "crazy."

Terry, 230RN

REF:
http://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=2646.msg40967#msg40967


« Last Edit: September 04, 2012, 06:28:45 AM by 230RN »
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I do believe that the radical and crazy notion that the Founders meant what they said, is gradually soaking through the judicial system.
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