I have two complete colt guns and a complete lower. They are good guns for sure. I got them on good deals.

Other guns that I consider excellent quality are BCM, LMT and Daniel Defense. Though I believe that DD guns are overpriced. My first AR was a DD and while it was an excellent gun, they have gotten quite pricey.

As mentioned above, it depends what you want the gun for. Defense, plinking, just because you want one. The reason I mention that is that there are so many options and if one is just starting out, they might not know what they want or need. I can say that was true for me. There was a laundry list of things that I wanted to add or change. After shooting for a while, some of those things changed. That said, I am the type that wants to try for myself. Light weight be normal weight barrels, Aimpoint vs EoTech, FSP vs flip up sights, etc. I ended up buying multiple guns in different configurations to try. While fun and I learned a lot, it was expensive. I have a box of stuff that went on the gun and eventually came off. Some were even bought that never ended up on the gun.

Anyways, since it seems like you budget conscious, I could recommend buying something basic and shooting it lots. If you have buddies with ARs, even better and you can try theirs.

Build vs complete. My personal preference is to buy complete if defensive use will be primary and you aren't experienced in building ARs.  I've built guns and while they have done fine, at least so far. I've seen to many user "custom" builds shit the bed. That and in my experience, you build to get exactly what you want and aren't generally going to save money, or at least not a significant amount.

Good luck and enjoy the world of ARs. You're lucky that you're getting into it while the market is quite good for ARs.

Finish? That's one aspect that isn't very important to me. Yeah, I don't want a new guns to have a beat to shit look before I shoot them. That said, all my guns are shooters, whether at the range, competition, training, etc. They each develop their own personality. If you're worried about finish, guns like Noveske tend to have really high quality finish, but you're definitely going to pay a premium.


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My first AR is a Colt 6940 with monolithic upper.  Great shooting and perfect engineering.

I came close to buying a 6940 for my first AR. Eventually got a DDM4 V5. The 6940 is a great gun, but I was talked away from that gun because of the monolithic rail and inability to change it in the future. I ended up eventually buying an LMT with a monolithic rail, so go figure. Haha.




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I came close to buying a 6940 for my first AR. Eventually got a DDM4 V5. The 6940 is a great gun, but I was talked away from that gun because of the monolithic rail and inability to change it in the future. I ended up eventually buying an LMT with a monolithic rail, so go figure. Haha.

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The rail was actually the reason I bought it.  Like you, I was warned there is a proprietary tool and fitting on it, and changing would require expense.  But having a single piece upper and front-to-rear scope rail means never worrying about misalignment or loosened parts.  There's no seam between the front and rear rail sections.  One long rail means it's solid.  The front sight/gas block is also a benefit.  The sight folds down and is just as solid as the A2 sight/gas block.  The sight design allows the barrel to be free floated -- benefit #3.  It definitely is a plus for accuracy.

All in all, I'm happy I chose it over the 6920 for just a couple hundred bucks more.  I've come to like other handguards better than the quad rail, but that's not a deal breaker. Plenty of room for add-on toys!

 

The rail was actually the reason I bought it.  Like you, I was warned there is a proprietary tool and fitting on it, and changing would require expense.  But having a single piece upper and front-to-rear scope rail means never worrying about misalignment or loosened parts.  There's no seam between the front and rear rail sections.  One long rail means it's solid.  The front sight/gas block is also a benefit.  The sight folds down and is just as solid as the A2 sight/gas block.  The sight design allows the barrel to be free floated -- benefit #3.  It definitely is a plus for accuracy.

All in all, I'm happy I chose it over the 6920 for just a couple hundred bucks more.  I've come to like other handguards better than the quad rail, but that's not a deal breaker. Plenty of room for add-on toys!

 

Free float vs non-free float was another aspect that I forgot to mention. Most of my guns are free float and I have one KISS/beater gun that isn't free float. Does it make a difference? I'm sure it does, but I'm no precision shooter.

Quad rail was one thing that I was initially interested as well. Now, I like the keymod rails for lighter while still allowing what I want to be mounted. My guns are pretty simple and don't have a bunch of stuff on it. ARs aren't super heavy guns, but I now prefer to keep them lighter if I can. Haha.

I am sure if I got a 6940 as my first AR that I would have liked it and had been happy. That said, I was always sure I'd have more than one.


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Has anyone run into a factory built, DI gassed AR that they didn't like ?

Maybe folks should list some brands they have had first hand personal experience with that they would recommend staying away from.
(Not the gun snob DPMS sucks, but I've never owned or shot one type thing)

I've owned and shot DPMS, Del-Ton, PSA, S&W Sport and LMT

All of them ran like champs under range conditions (probably least stress possible) with decent mags.
Accuracy varied but not by a lot more than my limited skill set.
(1:9 twist works well with 55gr. Ammo)

Note: I've become a fan of the mid-length gas system. Not much discussion on gas lengths yet which is another consideration.

Has anyone run into a factory built, DI gassed AR that they didn't like ?

When you put it that way, nope.  I own a Spikes build / Bushmaster / BCM-Noveske build, all work fine so far.  My buddy also has a Bushmaster and a Colt that work fine. 

I have a PSA complete upper and it's been good so far. Only about 400-500 rounds. I bought it because it was known as one of the high/overgassed uppers with the intent on testing with low powered ammo, like Tula. Two of my midlength gas guns don't function well with cheap stuff like Tula. Now that I have the upper, Tula has been hard to find and when I do, it's about sale price as 193...

I'm not a brand snob either. I do recommend companies that are known for producing high quality guns and that I have personal experience with. I've shot DPMS, S&W and others, but not more than say 100-200 rounds. They were fine really. The only guns that I could caution against are polymer lowers. I've heard that the newer ones are "improved", but I've seen so many break, and usually at the loop where the buffer tube connects to. Yeah, I've seen some polymer lower guns perform well, but just too risky for me and it's not like standard lowers are expensive.


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Right now Smith & Wesson and Ruger have $500 AR's brand new.

Right now Smith & Wesson and Ruger have $500 AR's brand new.

I can personally vouch for the S&W AR's as I have shot a few. The stock trigger is not bad, reliability and accuracy is very good. I have not shot the Rugers but I have handled a couple. Trigger is not as good as the S&W IMHO but I am sure accuracy is good as well as reliability. If it were my money I would certainly put the S&W near the top of my list.

My first AR was a Ruger AR556.  Great gun if you're looking into something with iron sights.  I think I paid $600 for that one a year ago.   The last AR I bought was literally the cheapest thing Sportsman Outdoor Warehouse had (on line)...  American Tactical Imports model for $450.  The original plan was to Barbie Doll the everloving crap out of it.  Load it up full of ridiculous accessories, paint it...  basically make a range clown out of it.  But before I did that I threw a cheap Monstrum scope on it and took it to the range.  F-me if that thing didn't shoot pretty nice.  Looking back I kind of wish I'd have picked this one up first.  Probably would have skipped buying the Ruger and jumped into a Smith & Wesson M&P (I have an M&P .22 and I love it) or maybe even something a little fancier (Daniel, F1...   $1500+/- range).   

I'm sure everyone has pointed this out already but ARs are like potato chips.  You can't have just one.  Best advice based on my own experiences is to get something cheap with detachable sights so you can play with different scopes and red dots.  Just get a 5.56, don't worry about all the variants, just keep it simple the first time around.  Get a feel for the genre and figure out what you like/dislike want/need and then spend some money on your next one to make sure you get what you really want.  Who knows, after playing around with it you might decide a cheap range monkey is all you really ever wanted...  save yourself some money.   

At the LIFE fun shoot yesterday, Daniel from KGS had us try out the new Springfield Saint AR15.  It felt solid, shot nice, and had good features to it.  It's a small step up in price from the bargain AR15's and I think it's a good price for what you get.  I think he was selling it for $700 or $800.


http://www.springfield-armory.com/products/saint/

At the LIFE fun shoot yesterday, Daniel from KGS had us try out the new Springfield Saint AR15.  It felt solid, shot nice, and had good features to it.  It's a small step up in price from the bargain AR15's and I think it's a good price for what you get.  I think he was selling it for $700 or $800.


http://www.springfield-armory.com/products/saint/

Dwayne's a nicer guy...just saying..

Someone asked offline, but I'll add to discussion here, about what problems I've seen with guns that would indicate lesser or "not as high" quality.

Some things I've seen personally are BCG gas key not properly staked (the key actually started working loose), castle nut not properly staked or in some cases red Loctite or some other really strong adhesive used and allowed castle nut to come loose, and gas blocks coming loose.  All those on factory guns. 

Are guns from known quality manufacturers immune from problems?  Definitely not.  I've had the selector tab break on my LMT after maybe 1,000 rounds.  It happened during a class in Alaska and luckily I had a second gun with me.  Now I typically bring along some spare parts and springs.  If I don't need them, there's a good chance it will help someone else in the class.  My backup gun had saved multiple people after stuff on their guns shit the bed, including stuff like optics. 

The hole for the grip on my DD (that I no longer have) was misaligned such that standard grips wouldn't tighten down properly.  DD tried to bubba the replacement grip after sending them the gun with the grip, saying that the lower was in spec.  Well, replacement grips fit on all my Colts, LMT and BCM as well as other A2 grips except for the one that came with the DD gun. 

OP, if you're still in the market, go for the Saint or a 6920 if you can find one in your price range. It's not that the lesser brands like Del-Ton, BPMS, Bushmaster, etc can't produce a gun that works. The problem is they produce many more that fail more frequently. If you're already paying several hundred for a rifle, might as well save a little more to get one that will be much less likely to malfunction or break, and that you'd likely be able to pass down to your children if you decide to do so. Or maybe you decide you love shooting and want to put 5k rounds through it a year. Either way, a little bit more in the initial investment will allow you to do that. Personally, if I'm going to spend over $50, whatever I'm buying better work.


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At the LIFE fun shoot yesterday, Daniel from KGS had us try out the new Springfield Saint AR15.  It felt solid, shot nice, and had good features to it.  It's a small step up in price from the bargain AR15's and I think it's a good price for what you get.  I think he was selling it for $700 or $800.


http://www.springfield-armory.com/products/saint/

Off topic but that Rifle would look so much better with the SA Logo instead of "SAINT"

Seems like a few fans of the Ruger AR, so here's a pretty good deal on them.

$479 shipped from Sportsmansguide


http://www.sportsmansguide.com/product/index/ruger-ar-556-semi-automatic-556-nato-223-remington-161-barrel-tactical-gray-301-rounds?a=2142616&SID=1411061FOF8756199381835544&CJ=1&cjaffilid=8263350&cjaffsite=FlexOffers.com%2c+LLC&cjadv=CJTSGUSA&cjadvid=1522857&utm_source=FlexOffers.com%2c+LLC&utm_medium=CJ&utm_campaign=Redirect-Enabled+Deep+Link


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I recommend to the OP if they are still not sure which AR to purchase then they might consider purchasing a subscription to Gun Tests Magazine. It is basically the Consumer Reports reviews for firearms. They also maintain a database of all their reviews and recommendations going back many years so you can search to your heart's content.

Here is the link: http://www.gun-tests.com/

Especailly if this first one has to be "right" because I probably won't be buying many, nor often.

I am at odds with some comments here in this thread as my own experiences, uses and requirements for rifles may differ from others. Given your comment above and if I were giving this advice to a family member for a one and done rifle, I would suggest a Colt 6920 complete, a Colt OEM 2 , or I might also suggest a BCM rifle. 

This is a buyers market these days and will remain so for the near future, so buying quality for a good price is easy.  I will admit that the market is forcing others to produce decent quality rifles for a bit less, but IF you ever wanted to do certain "upgrades" on parts quality to the rifle, you will probably end up spending a bit more down the road.  Also you are going to get pretty much exactly what you are expecting with my above suggestions, no guessing, no fuss.

As for personal experiences and opinions with this pattern of rifle, mine may be a bit different than others.  Many rifles, even home builds may seemingly shoot just fine for your average KKHD shooter, but it is when you really put a rifle to the test with accuracy and heavy use is where you may see the flaws show up.  I cannot even begin to count the number of home builds and cheap manufacturer rifles that I have worked on that did just fine until they hit a hard use, high round count course. 

For someone that wants a rifle that looks like an AR15 to put in a safe or to shoot recreationally from a bench at KKHD, then there are other lesser expensive options that will work just fine and I may even suggest a few when asked.  However, if someone wants a rifle that is relatively inexpensive in relation to quality of parts, manufacture process, testing process and known reliability under any type of use, then paying a bit more upfront for a known quantity is advised.  If anyone were to mention home or personal defense, then the latter is a must IMO.

I am at odds with some comments here in this thread as my own experiences, uses and requirements for rifles may differ from others. Given your comment above and if I were giving this advice to a family member for a one and done rifle, I would suggest a Colt 6920 complete, a Colt OEM 2 , or I might also suggest a BCM rifle. 

This is a buyers market these days and will remain so for the near future, so buying quality for a good price is easy.  I will admit that the market is forcing others to produce decent quality rifles for a bit less, but IF you ever wanted to do certain "upgrades" on parts quality to the rifle, you will probably end up spending a bit more down the road.  Also you are going to get pretty much exactly what you are expecting with my above suggestions, no guessing, no fuss.

As for personal experiences and opinions with this pattern of rifle, mine may be a bit different than others.  Many rifles, even home builds may seemingly shoot just fine for your average KKHD shooter, but it is when you really put a rifle to the test with accuracy and heavy use is where you may see the flaws show up.  I cannot even begin to count the number of home builds and cheap manufacturer rifles that I have worked on that did just fine until they hit a hard use, high round count course. 

For someone that wants a rifle that looks like an AR15 to put in a safe or to shoot recreationally from a bench at KKHD, then there are other lesser expensive options that will work just fine and I may even suggest a few when asked.  However, if someone wants a rifle that is relatively inexpensive in relation to quality of parts, manufacture process, testing process and known reliability under any type of use, then paying a bit more upfront for a known quantity is advised.  If anyone were to mention home or personal defense, then the latter is a must IMO.

I think it depends on the person, too.  I helped my daughter build her first AR, but  that was after she practiced with my Colt 6940 and home-builds.  I think she became much more comfortable operating an AR after she saw how it's assembled and what each main part's function is.  She, like me, has an engineering mind, and half the fun of shooting is in learning and appreciating the various designs, features and capabilities of the various guns we own.

There's much to be said for assembling a rifle and test-firing it successfully its first time at the range!   

This is easier to recommend if there is a friend or family member with the experience and tools to assist.  Otherwise, .... Colt!

I am at odds with some comments here in this thread as my own experiences, uses and requirements for rifles may differ from others. Given your comment above and if I were giving this advice to a family member for a one and done rifle, I would suggest a Colt 6920 complete, a Colt OEM 2 , or I might also suggest a BCM rifle. 

This is a buyers market these days and will remain so for the near future, so buying quality for a good price is easy.  I will admit that the market is forcing others to produce decent quality rifles for a bit less, but IF you ever wanted to do certain "upgrades" on parts quality to the rifle, you will probably end up spending a bit more down the road.  Also you are going to get pretty much exactly what you are expecting with my above suggestions, no guessing, no fuss.

As for personal experiences and opinions with this pattern of rifle, mine may be a bit different than others.  Many rifles, even home builds may seemingly shoot just fine for your average KKHD shooter, but it is when you really put a rifle to the test with accuracy and heavy use is where you may see the flaws show up.  I cannot even begin to count the number of home builds and cheap manufacturer rifles that I have worked on that did just fine until they hit a hard use, high round count course. 

For someone that wants a rifle that looks like an AR15 to put in a safe or to shoot recreationally from a bench at KKHD, then there are other lesser expensive options that will work just fine and I may even suggest a few when asked.  However, if someone wants a rifle that is relatively inexpensive in relation to quality of parts, manufacture process, testing process and known reliability under any type of use, then paying a bit more upfront for a known quantity is advised.  If anyone were to mention home or personal defense, then the latter is a must IMO.

I own a 6920, 6720 and OEM2.  The OEM2 is still awaiting a handguard to complete, but the 6920 and 6720 have been awesome.  I also own a BCM and along with LMT, those are the two that get shot the most.  My suggestion for "one and done" would be between Colt, BCM and LMT.  Yeah, it's an awesome ARs buyers market right now.  I got my OEM2 for much less than MSRP, where just a few years ago, something like that could easily have been sold for much more. 

I haven't put my guns through as heavy (and frequent) use as you do with yours, though I have tried.  And if I had more $$$ for ammo and "better" range access.  Haha.  I feel comfortable that I've put my training guns through "enough" that I am confident with them in terms of function and durability.  Like you, I've seen so many home builds and lower quality manufacturer guns shit the bed in classes or even through bench shooting.  That's why I also recommend factory guns from known quality manufacturers if the intended use is for defense.  As mentioned by many in this thread, it all depends on the intended use of the gun.  If it's a project gun to enjoy plinking and just general range fun, then there are many options that will be cheaper than Colt of BCM, but like many things in life, you get what you pay for and personally, I am willing to and recommend spending a little bit more for that. 

I think it depends on the person, too.  I helped my daughter build her first AR, but  that was after she practiced with my Colt 6940 and home-builds.  I think she became much more comfortable operating an AR after she saw how it's assembled and what each main part's function is.  She, like me, has an engineering mind, and half the fun of shooting is in learning and appreciating the various designs, features and capabilities of the various guns we own.

There's much to be said for assembling a rifle and test-firing it successfully its first time at the range!   

This is easier to recommend if there is a friend or family member with the experience and tools to assist.  Otherwise, .... Colt!

I finally built my first AR many years after buying my first AR.  Like you, I have an "engineering mind", but for some reason, I wasn't really interested in building an AR when I first got into ARs.  I guess I was more interested in shooting techniques than the inner workings of the gun.  That and I am not really into tweaking my guns that much, changing this out for that, and keep things pretty close to stock. 

That said, I do value in knowing how to assemble the gun and helps with being able to change things out for maintenance purposes.  I still don't see myself building many guns.  I do find a sense of satisfaction in building something and having it function properly and shoot well.  In your case, you already have a proven 6940.  If something were to go wrong with your build, then the 6940 will still be there.  That's another reason why I recommend a factory build for a first and possibly only AR.  Then great to build future ARs. 

Again, it's not that I turn my nose at other brands or those who build ARs.  Just not my preference.  If one is confident in their abilities to build a gun, then rock on.  I am just not willing to put my confidence in building ARs for more than range or project guns.