What have you done to produce more consitent neck tension? Ie. Anneal every firing, turning ID and OD of neck, sorting brass, etc...  I'm just curious.

For me, my loads have produced 1/4" at 100 and can regularlly do 1/2". At distances, I know it's my wind calls more than my load that is my issue.

To be honest, I don't do anything special to produce consistent neck tension. The improper neck sizing was actually my mistake since I accidentally mixed my semi prepped brass with the fully-processed brass I had picked up from Kaleo Arms.

The semi-prepped 308 brass (actually 7.62mm NATO) was sized without the decapping rod so the necks weren't expanded back to proper size.

I ended up measuring all of my brass and separating out the semi-processed stuff. The groups in the pictures (with the exception of the flyers, which were caused by my semi-processed fiasco) were using the fully processed Kaleo Arms brass.

I don't have any plans to turn necks, weigh brass, weigh bullets, nor anything of that nature. I figure that, if I can find a decent load that stays easily under 1" at 100 yards then I'll be happy.  I seemed to have found that load so I think I'm good for now.

I'm also too lazy to sort brass by weight. The most I'll do is sort brass by headstamp. Since almost all of my 308 brass is LC, I don't bother with sorting by year (although I'm learning that I probably should).

In case you're curious, my load was:
308 Win
Hornady 168 gr A-MAX
Ramshot TAC @ 42.8 gr
Federal LRP
LC Brass (various years)
COAL: 2.800"
No crimp
This load was around 2642 fps with a single digit ES and single digit SD
Out of a 20" Ruger bolt action

Since I'm using LC brass, the load is a little on the warmer/hot side, but I'm okay with that.

Lately my fascination has been with trying to improve my position shooting (standing, kneeling, sitting, prone) and weak hand shooting.

Pew
Thank you for the sound advice.

Rifle - I only have a cheap 223 ruger predator.  Is it good enough?  I have howa 6.5 cm barrel action coming but that is a 1-2 year project.  I was thinking of the ruger 6.5 cm predator (I'm cheap) but bought the howa on impulse.

Shooter - I'm just starting.  I've only been shooting 22 and only shot the predator once to zero the scope.  I think I'll get a lead sled to minimize shooter error.

Reloading - I'm trying to watch, read and ask - hoping to be able to produce fairly decent ammo when I start.  I understand there is long road ahead with much to learn/understand.  I have two "mentors" but they load with different intentions (one loads 223 only for semi auto and wants his ammo to std spec so they work in all his semi auto, the other loads 223 for the shooting fair so he has quantity and safety in mind...he doesn't even shoot 223).

At this point I'm just trying to make decent 223 for shooting practice and begin learning to make precision 223 (weighing powder and using a single stage).  Goal is to eventually make precision 6.5 cm.

Thanks again for your help.  I'm learning a lot from everyone here

At this point I'm just trying to make decent 223 for shooting practice and begin learning to make precision 223 (weighing powder and using a single stage).  Goal is to eventually make precision 6.5 cm.

Thanks again for your help.  I'm learning a lot from everyone here

Post your results when you can. What length and twist is your barrel?

I need to polish the seater....leaves a ring

22" barrel, 1/8 twist

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v391/tim808/IMG_0058_zpsl56ixylh.jpg

I need to polish the seater....leaves a ring

wow, you're loading them pretty short.  Nosler's loading data notes a different COAL.  of course the loading data is only a starting point.

wow, you're loading them pretty short.  Nosler's loading data notes a different COAL.  of course the loading data is only a starting point.

Kinda looks like he went past the ogive. That extra space is needed if he wants to go to the MAX 25.5 gn.

It could be an optical illusion but looks like an extraction mark on the bullet like it was pulled.

All in all, it's a beautiful bullet.

I've never tried Viht. Maybe it's time to try some N133.

I need to polish the seater....leaves a ring

That usually only happens to me when I have the OAL set incorrectly (too short) on my seating die and push the bullet in too far and I compress the powder to the point the bullet won't move any more. The bullet stops moving and the die continues causing the ring on the bullet. Don't ask me how I know that.

Your spec sheet shows an OAL of 2.2 when you could easily load it to 2.26 if shooting it from an AR. Probably longer if you are shooting it from a bolt gun. Also, your spec sheet shows IMR powder but I don't see what type of IMR powder you are using.

I've never tried Viht. Maybe it's time to try some N133.

I have a little experience with Viht powders. All my experience has been good to excellent. The powders burn clean which makes cleaning at the end of the day a little nicer. Accuracy has been good to excellent. But with a lot of experimentation I have been able to duplicate or better the accuracy with other powders. The downside is of course price. So considering the accuracy issue with a cheaper powder is possible I stopped experimenting with Viht powders tho I spend a little longer cleaning.

Imr xbr 8208 powder

I mentioned oal of 2.26 to my mentor...but I had bought blems in a ziplock bag that had no loading info on the bag so we used 2.20 which was listed on the hogdon site.  We didn't think .06 would make much of a difference

The ring on the bullet is from the seater.   I have to polish the seater

12 rds at 23.5
12 rds at 24.0
12 rds at 24.5

Will check for signs of over pressure.   Will use shoot federal 55 gr 223 ammo as a baseline before I shoot the test loads

Will also set up a chrono on a tripod to measure velocity

I think most of my practice will be a Tokyo Marui Vrs 10 and a 22

The bullet stops moving and the die continues causing the ring on the bullet. Don't ask me how I know that.

How do you know that?

How do you know that?

I told you not to ask. 

That's a short OAL.
I'd guess that you are pushing the bullet too deep into the case causing the ring. There's probably nothing wrong with the seater. Are you feeling crunchy when you are seating the bullet?
I've had that ring before so I backed off the powder charge from very crunchy to less crunchy

Imr xbr 8208 powder

I mentioned oal of 2.26 to my mentor...but I had bought blems in a ziplock bag that had no loading info on the bag so we used 2.20 which was listed on the hogdon site.  We didn't think .06 would make much of a difference

The ring on the bullet is from the seater.   I have to polish the seater

12 rds at 23.5
12 rds at 24.0
12 rds at 24.5

Will check for signs of over pressure.   Will use shoot federal 55 gr 223 ammo as a baseline before I shoot the test loads

Will also set up a chrono on a tripod to measure velocity

I think most of my practice will be a Tokyo Marui Vrs 10 and a 22

I also use 8208 XBR for 223 and 308.  it is good stuff.

i would be careful when simply pulling the data off of the Hodgdon website.  I don't see your bullet listed for any of the tested loads.  as such, you need to be cautious when guessing on your seating depth and powder charge.

if you're unsure, you should probably load your cartridges to a longer overall length since this will tend to reduce pressures.  at the same time, it is possible to load it too long where you're not getting the proper tension or you're jamming the bullet into the rifling; in either case, you'd open yourself up to potential problems.

Hi Ren,
No crunching.  From what I read, reddings basic seater will sometimes leave a ring....just depends on the bullet.  Reddings will send another seater if asked.  I guess you just mention type of bullet you use.

Hi Pew
Good point.  I'll pull the bullets.  I'll make a new batch. 

Thanks for the data on noslers.  I remember seeing it before but forgot about it.

I load my Hornady 55gr to 2.20" as is recommended in their manual. This is my bulk plinking stuff and not too worried about precision accuracy. In a 5.56 chamber it's a huge jump to the lands but it shoots pretty good.

About the groove at the ogive, I will add from what others have said. Forster seating dies do the same. They recommend you take a bullet, apply polishing compound, chuck it in a drill and polish the seating stem, They can custom make a seating stem for you if you need. My Forster only does that if I seat the bullet several times like when adjusting the seating depth and running the same round several times.

About the original question, this was posted on another online forum that I frequent from a well accomplished national level shooter. The same question was asked about loading precision ammo on a progressive. I thought it made sense.

Quote: " I think it comes down to how far out you are shooting, and what you are using to measure powder with.
For 223, you are going to need very precise powdee charges for any kind of long range accuracy (800+). Since you posted on the other LR shooters page, you can get away with a lot more when your powder charges are larger. A tenth grain variation for a 223 is TWICE as large as the same variation on a 308."

FWIW, these guys are using scales that measure to the hundreths not tenths of a grain.

I was inspired to start loading my Nosler 62 gn with 22.2 to 24.0 gn TAC. The OAL is set at 2.180" for the Varmageddon bullet. It has a light cannelure and I use a very light crimp.

Rk
Are you going 22.2, 23.0 and 24.0?

Rk
Are you going 22.2, 23.0 and 24.0?

Good question. I tend to focus more on accuracy (for what it's worth) rather than load development so I shoot a lot. This time, I'm making ten sets of ten loads between 22.2 and 24.0. The Nosler website says that 23.5 gn is the most accurate. I don't have a chrono but hope to get one on Thursday. I already have loads ready for my Mosin 91/30, 300BLK, and AK so probably won't be shooting the AR this time. Your post inspired me to start loading it and only got through 30 tonight. I'm going to try the cast boolits I ordered for the Mosin (right side). Hopefully, I'll get better results than before.

Hi rk
Why 3 different types of bullets?  (Great sale?)

Does hard cast leave a lot of lead in the barrel?

How are the polymer coated bullets?  I thought those were only made for pistols