Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms (Read 39717 times)

tillamook

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #20 on: November 29, 2017, 07:02:05 AM »
Once you sign that form giving permission for the HPD to access your medical records this gives me, as a physician, ability to report anyone.  I could say you failed a drug test in the past, or that you are not mentally fit to own one.  Skip due process, right taken away, property confiscated (violates 2nd amendment and 4th amendment  - "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures"   Seizing property without due process. 

This is why it is not a good idea to give police access to medical records or allow physicians ability to determine your rights without due process.  Also why I would never register a firearm here.  Because I'm pretty sure the police are not reimbursing these people after they confiscate them   

changemyoil66

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #21 on: November 29, 2017, 09:19:45 AM »
Anyone know how other states are handling this since MJ is illegal on the federal level?  Or is it because we have registration which leads only to confiscation.

I wrote in another thread that my friend was denied in Vegas to even shoot at the tourist range because he told them he just came from the MJ store, but didn't consume anything.

shdws

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #22 on: November 29, 2017, 12:31:38 PM »
Anyone know how other states are handling this since MJ is illegal on the federal level?  Or is it because we have registration which leads only to confiscation.

I wrote in another thread that my friend was denied in Vegas to even shoot at the tourist range because he told them he just came from the MJ store, but didn't consume anything.

I've heard from a fellow 2a'er in northern cali and he has told me its roughly the same as we have here.  Seems like Hawaii just looks up to daddy california to make the laws and plays copycat.

For us here in HI though, I believe its just specifically related to the wording of "federal law" in that statute that zippz posted.

aieahound

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #23 on: November 29, 2017, 12:50:24 PM »
Does anyone know if these are folks who applied for a new permit or permit renewal this year?

Or are they actually combing the Med. Marijuana registration list and comparing it to the registered gun owner list?

If you didn't sign over your privacy rights to med records how could they get it ?
Unless the first time you apply for a permit it's a lifetime consent form.

http://www.civilbeat.org/2017/11/honolulu-police-tell-medical-marijuana-patients-to-give-up-their-guns/

"Yu also did not respond to questions about whether the letters were sent only to gun permit applicants or to people with existing permits or both."

Yu said that the HPD gained access to the state’s database of medical marijuana patients in September 2016.

“Checking the database is now part of the department’s standard background verification for all gun applicants,” Yu wrote.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2017, 01:24:23 PM by aieahound »

tillamook

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #24 on: November 29, 2017, 01:14:19 PM »
Anyone know how other states are handling this since MJ is illegal on the federal level?  Or is it because we have registration which leads only to confiscation.

I wrote in another thread that my friend was denied in Vegas to even shoot at the tourist range because he told them he just came from the MJ store, but didn't consume anything.

It survived an Oregon supreme court case.  Having a MJ card in Oregon could not prohibit you.  Oregon is rapidly moving toward California and Hawaii type legislation though. 

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #25 on: November 29, 2017, 01:18:23 PM »
Does anyone know if these are folks who applied for a new permit or permit renewal this year?

Or are they actually combing the Med. Marijuana registration list and comparing it to the registered gun owner list?

If you didn't sign over your privacy rights to med records how could they get it ?
Unless the first time you apply for a permit it's a lifetime consent form.

If you read the articles, they say the police have access to the patient list because it used to be managed by the dept of public safety.

The Cops are using that access to obtain the names and crosschecking them with registrations.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

aieahound

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #26 on: November 29, 2017, 01:26:40 PM »
If you read the articles, they say the police have access to the patient list because it used to be managed by the dept of public safety.

The Cops are using that access to obtain the names and crosschecking them with registrations.

Please cite the source where it says they're cross-checking the patient list with registrations.
You sure not cross-checking with permit applications?

(See my updated post above and the Civil Beat article)

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #27 on: November 29, 2017, 01:44:00 PM »
Please cite the source where it says they're cross-checking the patient list with registrations.
You sure not cross-checking with permit applications?

(See my updated post above and the Civil Beat article)

Why are you hung up on that minor detail?  You know people always use firearm registration and permits interchangeably.  Registrations are more complete than permits, since someone with a long gun permit may have zero long guns registered to them, as an example.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

shdws

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #28 on: November 29, 2017, 01:48:36 PM »
Why are you hung up on that minor detail?  You know people always use firearm registration and permits interchangeably.  Registrations are more complete than permits, since someone with a long gun permit may have hero long guns registered to them, as an example.

I'm also interested in whether or not this is a proactive or retroactive type deal.  Using it to deny new permits is one thing.  Going back through the database to confiscate is basically what we fear as gun owners regarding registration and why many are opposed. 

changemyoil66

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #29 on: November 29, 2017, 01:52:30 PM »
Interesting how this is making national headlines.  Even though the law has been around for a while now.  I've seen the letter posted on many IG 2a accounts as well.

I guess Hawaii is the 1st state to enforce this law.  Probably CA will do a "me too" enforcement next?  Hence why many are choosing to go "featureless" on their rifles so they don't have to register them.

aieahound

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #30 on: November 29, 2017, 01:53:24 PM »
One thing's for sure. HRA won't fight it.

Harvey thinks it's cool they are giving gun owners 30 days to turn 'em in ( and acting like he never took a drink of alcohol in his life. Must be part of the Reefer Madness generation)

"Harvey Gerwig, head of the Hawaii Rifle Association, partially agreed, saying, “A person who is taking medicine shouldn’t be deprived of their Second Amendment rights.”

But Gerwig also said he considers the state’s medical marijuana program “a fraud on many levels.”

“You’ve got people who are using it for drug purposes, not for medicine,” he said. “In those cases I don’t think they should have a firearm.”

Gerwig credited the police department for giving people 30 days to give up their guns instead of seizing the weapons immediately. But he said it might still be hard for people to sell their firearms within that time frame, noting handguns take at least two weeks to transfer ownership."

Who would think Espero would be on our side:

State Sen. Will Espero said it doesn’t make sense to take guns away from medical marijuana patients.

“They should be going after the real hardcore criminals and bad guys versus patients who need some assistance with their health care needs,” Espero said.

http://www.civilbeat.org/2017/11/honolulu-police-tell-medical-marijuana-patients-to-give-up-their-guns/

changemyoil66

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #31 on: November 29, 2017, 01:55:40 PM »
I'm also interested in whether or not this is a proactive or retroactive type deal.  Using it to deny new permits is one thing.  Going back through the database to confiscate is basically what we fear as gun owners regarding registration and why many are opposed.

I wouldn't call it pro or retro, seems like someone behind the scenes is pulling the strings (probably Chin).  There have been a lot more of these letters being sent out for mental health confiscation.  My friend saw a marriage counselor 6 years ago, and has bought many guns since and renewed his permit 6x since.  Only this year he got a letter saying he needs a shrink to sign off that he is mentally stable.  And only after his permit was renewed.

aieahound

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #32 on: November 29, 2017, 01:59:38 PM »
I'm also interested in whether or not this is a proactive or retroactive type deal.  Using it to deny new permits is one thing.  Going back through the database to confiscate is basically what we fear as gun owners regarding registration and why many are opposed. 

Well put Shdws

shdws

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #33 on: November 29, 2017, 02:00:16 PM »
I wouldn't call it pro or retro, seems like someone behind the scenes is pulling the strings (probably Chin).  There have been a lot more of these letters being sent out for mental health confiscation.  My friend saw a marriage counselor 6 years ago, and has bought many guns since and renewed his permit 6x since.  Only this year he got a letter saying he needs a shrink to sign off that he is mentally stable.  And only after his permit was renewed.

The fact that HPD seems to enforce (or not enforce) laws how they see fit, or what their masters tell them to do is what is alarming.

Today, its pot.  Yesterday it was mental health.  Tomorrow, its using your cell phone while walking across the street.  Next Tuesday, its for looking at a cop funny.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #34 on: November 29, 2017, 02:04:42 PM »
There's really not much difference between medical use and recreational us when it comes to the effect of pot.  States who already had medical marijuana have passed/are considering legalizing recreational use based on that reasoning.

So, if Hawaii follows CO and WA, Harvey may have to revisit his opinion on recreational use being different than medical use if the illegal aspect of it is removed.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

rklapp

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #35 on: November 29, 2017, 02:19:27 PM »
If we could figure out who those 30 card holders are, we could get them to video tape the HPD knocking on their door.
Yahh! Freedom and justice shall always prevail over tyranny, Babysitter Girl!
https://ronsreloading.wordpress.com/

shdws

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #36 on: November 29, 2017, 02:20:06 PM »
Who would think Espero would be on our side:

I know, right?  I'm guessing (like in CA) hes getting briefcases of cash from the MJ industry to fight for them.  Allegedly, its how some dispensaries are getting the green light ahead of other shops that apply for permits because CA left it up to the individual municipalities. 

Anyway, this problem could be resolved if lawmakers amended that statute to say "state law" instead of "federal law" I believe, but I'm not a lawyer or lawmaker.

drck1000

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #37 on: November 29, 2017, 02:26:56 PM »
I'm also interested in whether or not this is a proactive or retroactive type deal.  Using it to deny new permits is one thing.  Going back through the database to confiscate is basically what we fear as gun owners regarding registration and why many are opposed.

2ahavvaii

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #38 on: November 29, 2017, 02:44:30 PM »
"Yu did not respond to Civil Beat requests for an interview with Ballard. Yu also did not respond to questions about whether the letters were sent only to gun permit applicants or to people with existing permits or both."

New chief, same lack of transparency, openness, and same shadiness.  Like was already said before about this so-called new chief, you can throw out the tainted koolaid, but if you're still drawing water from the alawai cesspool, it's still going to taste like sugar coated shit water.

2ahavvaii

Re: Honolulu police tell legal marijuana users to turn in their firearms
« Reply #39 on: November 29, 2017, 02:50:39 PM »


"Harvey Gerwig, head of the Hawaii Rifle Association, partially agreed, saying, “A person who is taking medicine shouldn’t be deprived of their Second Amendment rights.”

But Gerwig also said he considers the state’s medical marijuana program “a fraud on many levels.”


People abuse all sorts of prescription drugs and pain killers.  So his bias is hurting the people taking for legitimate reasons as well as the supposed "frauds".  Nice work.  If you have a prescription from a doctor (who is a professional), the assumption is that the prescription is legal, and not for nefarious purposes.  At least if you have some common sense.