Sheldon Tyau from Hawaii Historic Arms Assoc told me a story of a a Hawaii sportsmans alliance (or something like that) where all of the gun clubs and businesses came together under one banner to oppose the Hawaii handgun and assault weapons ban in the 1990s.  They also put a 2 page newspaper ad with a large list of organizations and also planned a 2a conference with the neighbor islands flying in, but didn't take place.

Anyone familiar with this?  I think reforming this is the way to go in the future.

Sheldon Tyau?

Sheldon Tyau?

Yep

I don't remember too much about that because I was preoccupied with kids.
Sorry

Can you tell us if there were any favorable results from the alliance?  Seems like we still had the AW ban, registration, and mag limits all in the 90's.  Or were the laws way worst like how the bump stock bill was way worst until we got involved?  I mean no disrespect either, just curious.  Because I was in elementary/middle school during this time.

Can you tell us if there were any favorable results from the alliance?  Seems like we still had the AW ban, registration, and mag limits all in the 90's.  Or were the laws way worst like how the bump stock bill was way worst until we got involved?  I mean no disrespect either, just curious.  Because I was in elementary/middle school during this time.

We got to keep handguns and ar15s.  The compromise was handgun training requirements, assault pistol ban, and mag limits.

We got to keep handguns and ar15s.  The compromise was handgun training requirements, assault pistol ban, and mag limits.

They let us keep handguns? Well, that's mighty white of them.

They let us keep handguns? Well, that's mighty white of them.

LOL

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I've been spending time at the library looking for the coalition newspaper ad in the 1990s.  Scrolling through thousands of pages really sucks and takes a lot of time.

It'll be worth it if it helps reforming the Hawaii coalition again.

I found a couple of notable ads by the Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership opposing the assault weapons ban proposed in Hawaii and Congress in 1994.

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These ads gave me a great idea for future legislative testimony.  Ill print it on a poster and hold it up while I testify.  Then ill ask who's in favor of gun control.  Epic trolling opportunity.

These ads gave me a great idea for future legislative testimony.  Ill print it on a poster and hold it up while I testify.  Then ill ask who's in favor of gun control.  Epic trolling opportunity.

"It can't happen here."

Said many Jews shortly before they were loaded into boxcars destined for the "Arbeit Macht Frei" "work camps".

For example, Auschwitz:

"It can't happen here."

Said many Jews shortly before they were loaded into boxcars destined for the "Arbeit Macht Frei" "work camps".

For example, Auschwitz:

Gun owners in Hawaii are registered, and already targeted.
Were it not for the fact they can't even do day to day operations
efficiently you would find a law disarming the public being passed.
If they could they would  hunt you down and take your guns away.
It is the Hawaiian government way, only one party runs this state.
But they don't have enough money, the jails are already full, and we
know where the cops live, so we get to pretend we have rights.

The problem with these ads featuring Nazi rhetoric and examples is that

 1) there are no legitimate sources to cite where Hitler ever said anything about gun registration, and the ones that are referenced have been proven to be falsely attributed to Hitler or complete frauds, similar to the "behind every blade of grass" quote attributed to Yamamoto, which is now believed to come from MacArthur.

2) gun restrictions, and ultimately prohibition and confiscation,  were implemented by the Weimar Republic, not the Nazis. Laws were passed in January of 1919, essentially banning the possession of all firearms, of which was then increased in severity after the Treaty of Versailles, and were law until 1928,when restrictions were relaxed and licensing/registration protocols were put into place. Therefore, it is far more justifiable that the victors in WWI are responsible for what happened to gun ownership, the rise of Hitler and ultimately the Jews being unable to protect themselves, as we implemented the harsh requirements and stipulations of the Treaty of Versailles that inspired The harsh gun laws in the Weimar Republic, which did nothing to stop the Nazis taking power and everything that happened after.


Its important to be sure that the information you put out is correct.  This issue of believing and promoting false propaganda is as much an issue for the pro-gun community as it is for the antis

I didnt know about the pre Nazi gun restrictions.  The Nazis, along with Hitler at the helm, would still bear responsibility since they continued to ban and confiscate guns for Jews and other citizens for the purpose of rising to power and killing off the Jews.

I don't think Jews owning guns would have changed much though since most of them were conned into going to the death camps.  If the Jews knew they were going to get slaughtered when the Nazi party took over then I'm sure they wouldve had an armed rebellion.

I think the ad is still accurate and serves as a lesson to not start down the gun control path or unexpected things can happen.

I didnt know about the pre Nazi gun restrictions.  The Nazis, along with Hitler at the helm, would still bear responsibility since they continued to ban and confiscate guns for Jews and other citizens for the purpose of rising to power and killing off the Jews.

I don't think Jews owning guns would have changed much though since most of them were conned into going to the death camps.  If the Jews knew they were going to get slaughtered when the Nazi party took over then I'm sure they wouldve had an armed rebellion.

I think the ad is still accurate and serves as a lesson to not start down the gun control path or unexpected things can happen.

I don't understand that logic. If Hitler didn't implement gun restriction to begin with, how can you blame him for gun laws already in place?

The problem with the ad is that it is inaccurate and misleading, and knowledgeable opponents will call you out on it and use it to justify the the notion that you are spreading propaganda. If you want an idea to have lasting effect and significant impact,   it needs to be irrefutable factually, so that no one can prove you wrong.

I don't understand that logic. If Hitler didn't implement gun restriction to begin with, how can you blame him for gun laws already in place?

The problem with the ad is that it is inaccurate and misleading, and knowledgeable opponents will call you out on it and use it to justify the the notion that you are spreading propaganda. If you want an idea to have lasting effect and significant impact,   it needs to be irrefutable factually, so that no one can prove you wrong.

The same way Trump is being blamed for prohibited people getting guns and committing mass murder even though many of the problems with FBI. NICS, and lack of laws requiring states to report prohibitive information to the FBI could have been fixed under Obama's watch.  In fact, after Sandy Hook, all of these problems were studied and reported on.  There were Congressional hearings.  There were attempts to enact another AWB on steroids.

If something was implemented under the previous regime, and the current regime allows the status quo to remain as is, they share in the consequences.  Hitler's admin could have easily relaxed restriction on gun ownership -- even encouraged ownership -- if he thought it would have made Germany stronger.

I don't understand that logic. If Hitler didn't implement gun restriction to begin with, how can you blame him for gun laws already in place?

The problem with the ad is that it is inaccurate and misleading, and knowledgeable opponents will call you out on it and use it to justify the the notion that you are spreading propaganda. If you want an idea to have lasting effect and significant impact,   it needs to be irrefutable factually, so that no one can prove you wrong.

Can be viewed different ways

The same way Trump is being blamed for prohibited people getting guns and committing mass murder even though many of the problems with FBI. NICS, and lack of laws requiring states to report prohibitive information to the FBI could have been fixed under Obama's watch.  In fact, after Sandy Hook, all of these problems were studied and reported on.  There were Congressional hearings.  There were attempts to enact another AWB on steroids.

If something was implemented under the previous regime, and the current regime allows the status quo to remain as is, they share in the consequences.  Hitler's admin could have easily relaxed restriction on gun ownership -- even encouraged ownership -- if he thought it would have made Germany stronger.

But as you stated, Trump isn't responsible for the laws; he failed to act differently or disregard laws and policies implemented before he took office.

The ads zippz is referencing implies that Hitler enacted gun restriction and confiscation, which is in fact false, as those laws were already in place long before he ever took power. Further more, he did nothing illegal with regard to the anti-gun policies that he carried over, as they were justified and legal laws that were voted on, passed and implemented by both the Weimar Republic and the League of Nations (via the Treaty of Versailles).

So again,  if blame needs to be placed on anyone, it needs to be placed on those responsible for implementing the policy that prevented the common people from having the ability to stop what the Nazis did before they assumed power.

Also,  of course Hitler wouldn't implement policy that would allow the populace to rise up against his government. The reason why the Weimar Republic (and ultimately the League of Nations) passed those laws was precisely to prevent the same thing as they wanted to ensure the German people had no way to resist the malicious policies being imposed upon them, which ironically was the major catalyst for the Nazis to obtain power.

I start with,
I do not violate any constitutional  federal, state, or local laws.
But if you register your guns you are an idiot
that will be processed.

But as you stated, Trump isn't responsible for the laws; he failed to act differently or disregard laws and policies implemented before he took office.

The ads zippz is referencing implies that Hitler enacted gun restriction and confiscation, which is in fact false, as those laws were already in place long before he ever took power. Further more, he did nothing illegal with regard to the anti-gun policies that he carried over, as they were justified and legal laws that were voted on, passed and implemented by both the Weimar Republic and the League of Nations (via the Treaty of Versailles).

So again,  if blame needs to be placed on anyone, it needs to be placed on those responsible for implementing the policy that prevented the common people from having the ability to stop what the Nazis did before they assumed power.

Also,  of course Hitler wouldn't implement policy that would allow the populace to rise up against his government. The reason why the Weimar Republic (and ultimately the League of Nations) passed those laws was precisely to prevent the same thing as they wanted to ensure the German people had no way to resist the malicious policies being imposed upon them, which ironically was the major catalyst for the Nazis to obtain power.

Great points!  You got it.  I like your assertiveness and attention to detail.  I want you on my coalition team.  Meeting this Wed 6pm at Brewseum.  See you there.