2018 OHA candidates OAHU (Read 43330 times)

Kuleana

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #20 on: August 10, 2018, 06:59:32 AM »
So what's the plan to retake this illegally occupied nation?


It is already happening all around you.

FYI.  The US is falling apart from within, if you have not noticed lately.

ren

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #21 on: August 10, 2018, 07:31:25 AM »
I don't see it. I've been going to work and see other people doing the same.
Examples?
Deeds Not Words

Kuleana

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #22 on: August 10, 2018, 10:29:02 AM »
I don't see it. I've been going to work and see other people doing the same.
Examples?

For starters:

1. Income distribution within the US (i.e., the 1% is getting richer at the expense of everybody else).
2. Unending rise of illegal immigrants overtaxing the already depleted welfare system to collapse.
3. Rise of racial tensions among Whites, Blacks, and Latinos.
4. Calls for succession from a number of US states (e.g., California and Texas)
5. Steady erosion of the US Constitution and Bill of Rights (e.g., Abuse of Executive Orders, 2nd Amendment, etc.).
6. Ever increasing un-payable US National debt.
7. Steady rise of Latino-based organized crime activity in the US.

ren

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #23 on: August 10, 2018, 03:23:32 PM »
For starters:

1. Income distribution within the US (i.e., the 1% is getting richer at the expense of everybody else).
2. Unending rise of illegal immigrants overtaxing the already depleted welfare system to collapse.
3. Rise of racial tensions among Whites, Blacks, and Latinos.
4. Calls for succession from a number of US states (e.g., California and Texas)
5. Steady erosion of the US Constitution and Bill of Rights (e.g., Abuse of Executive Orders, 2nd Amendment, etc.).
6. Ever increasing un-payable US National debt.
7. Steady rise of Latino-based organized crime activity in the US.

Those were started by the Hawaiian Kingdom?
Deeds Not Words

Inspector

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #24 on: August 10, 2018, 03:36:38 PM »
I question whether any living native Hawaiians (1/32 or 1/64 now?) would prefer to live under our current republic or under a monarchy?

Based on the history of the way the Hawaiian monarchy was ruled prior, I would think any intelligent person would rather have the freedoms we enjoy now over living under the thumb of a ruling family whose whim they would be subject to. JMHO
SCIENCE THAT CAN’T BE QUESTIONED IS PROPAGANDA!!!

Kuleana

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #25 on: August 10, 2018, 03:38:59 PM »
Those were started by the Hawaiian Kingdom?

Those were some of the examples clearly showing how the US is in decline.

Kuleana

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #26 on: August 10, 2018, 03:48:28 PM »
I question whether any living native Hawaiians (1/32 or 1/64 now?) would prefer to live under our current republic or under a monarchy?

The opinion of whether any living Native Hawaiian would want to live under a monarchy or a republic is irrelevant.  The illegal occupation of any nation is a matter of law; whereby, once an occupation ends, the control of that nation reverts back to the remaining living or descendants of that nation.

I personally like democratic republics myself.



Based on the history of the way the Hawaiian monarchy was ruled prior, I would think any intelligent person would rather have the freedoms we enjoy now over living under the thumb of a ruling family whose whim they would be subject to. JMHO

If you read the history of Hawaii during the monarchy, especially after Kamehameha III, you will find that Hawaiian subjects enjoyed many of the civil liberties similar to Americans at that time.  Keep in mind, those responsible for the overthrow of Queen Liliuokalani  were very wealthy Hawaiians of American decent.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #27 on: August 10, 2018, 03:53:38 PM »
Those were some of the examples clearly showing how the US is in decline.

His question was "So what's the plan to retake this illegally occupied nation?"

You replied:


It is already happening all around you.

FYI.  The US is falling apart from within, if you have not noticed lately.


He then replied:

I don't see it. I've been going to work and see other people doing the same.
Examples?

Your response was related to your "FYI", not his question "what's the plan?"

So, are you implying the "plan" to restore Hawaii is to destroy the US from within?
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Kuleana

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #28 on: August 10, 2018, 04:24:56 PM »
"So, are you implying the "plan" to restore Hawaii is to destroy the US from within?"

Restoration efforts are already taking place on many fronts.  Educationally, Hawaiians, Americans, as well as foreigners, domestic and abroad, are being made aware of the illegal occupation of Hawaii by the US, within the public school systems, academia, and international audiences.  Politically, successful efforts have been made to reach out for support from international agencies.  Culturally, the Hawaiian language and culture is becoming nomalized and adopted within the local government, especially by the youth.

There is no need for any of the enemies of America to foster the decline of the US.  The US is self-destructing very steadily under its own weight.   

groveler

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #29 on: August 10, 2018, 04:32:59 PM »
This sovereignty issues is all about money.
The people inhabiting the islands where are NOT indigenous, to here,
but they  were cheated out of land.  Hawaiians  weren't strong enough
to keep it.  That is a story that has occurred in all the world.
I encourage "racially pure" Hawaiians  to re-form whatever tribe they think
they are and go for it.  It will be like Jim Jones in Guyana, except with a different King
and different Gods.
All my ancestors were cheated out of their land. killed, raped, enslaved,
suffered all manners of abuse, from outside invaders.
But I don't use my race as a crutch, nor do I live in the past, I learn from
the past but do not dwell in it.  I only want the all citizens of
modern Hawaii to have all the same freedoms and chances that
the laws provide.  That is ALL citizens, not the ones that think they are
"special" 

Inspector

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #30 on: August 10, 2018, 04:53:05 PM »

Kuleana, I don’t agree with your premise that the opinions of whether native Hawaiians want to live in either society are irrelevant. This means you are saying that native Hawaiians don’t have a choice. And if they did it doesn’t matter. Their opinions are quite relevant and they show it every time they vote for any elected officials. OHA, Federal, State or otherwise. I say the reason why native Hawaiians have not risen up and taken back their land is that they hare happy the way they are. And as long as they continue to get some measley handout or be put on a list for some sort of handout, they will never prefer a monarchy to this country.

Truly, those that want to live in such a society could easily go live on an uninhabited island in the chain. Oh wait, some already do... But then they need to have an opinion that is relevant in order to make that happen.
SCIENCE THAT CAN’T BE QUESTIONED IS PROPAGANDA!!!

Inspector

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #31 on: August 10, 2018, 04:54:35 PM »
The problem with your other premise that subjects living in the maonarchy after Kam III can have all of that taken away with the wave of a hand at any minute. Sorry, none of your premises seem real to me.
SCIENCE THAT CAN’T BE QUESTIONED IS PROPAGANDA!!!

ren

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #32 on: August 10, 2018, 05:06:05 PM »
"So, are you implying the "plan" to restore Hawaii is to destroy the US from within?"

Restoration efforts are already taking place on many fronts.  Educationally, Hawaiians, Americans, as well as foreigners, domestic and abroad, are being made aware of the illegal occupation of Hawaii by the US, within the public school systems, academia, and international audiences.  Politically, successful efforts have been made to reach out for support from international agencies.  Culturally, the Hawaiian language and culture is becoming nomalized and adopted within the local government, especially by the youth.

There is no need for any of the enemies of America to foster the decline of the US.  The US is self-destructing very steadily under its own weight.   


Those are very broad generalizations that show no plan in action.
Deeds Not Words

Kuleana

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #33 on: August 10, 2018, 09:33:08 PM »
Kuleana, I don’t agree with your premise that the opinions of whether native Hawaiians want to live in either society are irrelevant. This means you are saying that native Hawaiians don’t have a choice. And if they did it doesn’t matter. Their opinions are quite relevant and they show it every time they vote for any elected officials. OHA, Federal, State or otherwise.

When I said the voices and opinions of Native Hawaiians are irrelevant, I meant it in the context of law.  Whether some Hawaiians like the US does not matter with respect to the fact that they are still Hawaiian nationals and will have to accept political authority of their nation, if and when the occupation of Hawaii by the US ends.


I say the reason why native Hawaiians have not risen up and taken back their land is that they hare happy the way they are. And as long as they continue to get some measley handout or be put on a list for some sort of handout, they will never prefer a monarchy to this country.

That may be true for the low educated, welfare dependent Hawaiians.  However, that is not true for a great number of other Hawaiians who are aware of the illegality of the US occupation of Hawaii based on US Constitutional law.  Have you seen the US Department of Interior hearings that were conducted to see whether Hawaiians were willing to be recognized to be a nation within a nation in 2014?  You can do a search on YouTube on those hearings and see for yourself what the preponderance of the Hawaiian responses were.


Most of those hearings did not make into the mainstream media, by-the-way, due to the overwhelming pro-restoration sentiment of the Hawaiian populous.


Kuleana

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #34 on: August 10, 2018, 09:37:18 PM »
The problem with your other premise that subjects living in the maonarchy after Kam III can have all of that taken away with the wave of a hand at any minute. Sorry, none of your premises seem real to me.

There is no historical evidence that I am aware since Kamehameha III, where the constitutional monarchy confiscated privately owned land or property.  In fact, I do not recall Kalakaua or Liliuokalani confiscating any land of those American descendant Hawaiians, who would later overthrow the monarchy for personal economic gain.

Kuleana

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #35 on: August 10, 2018, 09:40:14 PM »
This sovereignty issues is all about money.
The people inhabiting the islands where are NOT indigenous, to here,
but they  were cheated out of land.  Hawaiians  weren't strong enough
to keep it.  That is a story that has occurred in all the world.
I encourage "racially pure" Hawaiians  to re-form whatever tribe they think
they are and go for it.  It will be like Jim Jones in Guyana, except with a different King
and different Gods.
All my ancestors were cheated out of their land. killed, raped, enslaved,
suffered all manners of abuse, from outside invaders.
But I don't use my race as a crutch, nor do I live in the past, I learn from
the past but do not dwell in it.  I only want the all citizens of
modern Hawaii to have all the same freedoms and chances that
the laws provide.  That is ALL citizens, not the ones that think they are
"special"


Well, I got news for you.

Many Native Hawaiians have been facing tremendous institutionalized discrimination daily, since the Americans illegally took over Hawaii.

ren

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #36 on: August 10, 2018, 10:42:20 PM »
So there is no plan to end this occupation. Just sit back and enjoy American creature comforts for another 100 years and hope the US collapses. Its called assimilation. You lost already. Youre fooling yourself about education. Meanwhile lands are being developed and more homes are built.
The govt is trying to give to Hawaiians but this org called OHA is diverting those funds. Thats where your tactical fight should be. Some of these trustees have nice jewelry and cars huh?
Deeds Not Words

Kuleana

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #37 on: August 10, 2018, 11:27:05 PM »
So there is no plan to end this occupation. Just sit back and enjoy American creature comforts for another 100 years and hope the US collapses. Its called assimilation. You lost already. Youre fooling yourself about education. Meanwhile lands are being developed and more homes are built.
The govt is trying to give to Hawaiians but this org called OHA is diverting those funds. Thats where your tactical fight should be. Some of these trustees have nice jewelry and cars huh?

Who said, there where no Hawaiians fighting to end OHA.  There are many that do not get publicity for doing so.


« Last Edit: August 11, 2018, 09:03:41 AM by Kuleana »

Flapp_Jackson

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #38 on: August 10, 2018, 11:29:02 PM »

Well, I got news for you.

Many Native Hawaiians have been facing tremendous institutionalized discrimination daily, since the Americans illegally took over Hawaii.


Because you say so?  Or do you have supporting evidence of that claim?

Easy to make blanket statements and offer zero proof.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Kuleana

Re: 2018 OHA candidates OAHU
« Reply #39 on: August 11, 2018, 08:58:51 AM »
Because you say so?  Or do you have supporting evidence of that claim?

Easy to make blanket statements and offer zero proof.

Your statement is very telling in many ways.

First of all, it is clear that you don't know much of the history of Hawaii from its pre-European contact period to the present.

Second, given the very insulting nature of your information request, you clearly are not someone born from here, since most people who are locally born, do not require proof to know how Hawaiians have been and are still facing socio-economic disparity as a result to the racist behaviors by those in power.  Why do you think OHA was created in the first place?

Third, your replies to my posts in this thread appears more directed at me, rather than the issue being discussed; inferring to me, a Native Hawaiian, you are anti-Hawaiian whenever a Hawaiian tries to gain social justice.