Do not confuse outliers, as being the norm or standard.

Just because the US had its first Black president, with debatable commentary of his success, does not mean there will be another Black president anytime soon nor it can said that Blacks now have an equal opportunity to life, similar to the White majority.

Do not confuse outliers, as being the norm or standard.

Just because the US had its first Black president, with debatable commentary of his success, does not mean there will be another Black president anytime soon nor it can said that Blacks now have an equal opportunity to life, similar to the White majority.

I'm a free man. I separated from the Air Force a year before I moved here. Why would I stayed because of many reasons, but if I hated Hawaiians, nothing else would have kept me here.  I should not have wanted to raise my 4 and 7 year olds in a place where we were hated.

The rest of your response is regurgitated nonsense.

So say the in-the-closet admirer of President Barack Obama.


It's old and doesn't coincide with logic or reality.

Your opinion.


It's all academic grandstanding.

Look who's talking.

And just because one recent DC outsider made it to the Presidency is no guarantee another will or another will do as good a job.

Exactly.


You really don't have a point, other than you want to see equal outcomes for all rather than offer exceptional opportunities to exceptional people.

No, I want the illegal occupation of Hawaii to end, so that Native Hawaiians have a chance of bettering themselves without the dictates of Washington DC.


I guarantee you, the exceptional people started out in most instances as ordinary people working their way toward something better.

Not arguing against that.

So say the in-the-closet admirer of President Barack Obama.

Your opinion.

Look who's talking.

there is such a thing as Indians
they come from India...

Remember that everybody came from somewhere, including Polynesians to these islands...

You know the solution to this whole thing is you and yours need to become revolutionaries, take up arms against the imperialist U.S. dogs and take your islands back by force! Of course another option would be to convince America to leave and restore the Kingdom of Hawaii. Of course we’ll have restore everything and leave like we found it when Cook arrived. I’d vote for that! Then you could invite another country in to rebuild, like China, Russia, Iran, etc and things will be great again for good old Hawaii. Ahh but if you’re lucky, you can keep your kingdom but don’t count on it... deja vu will set in as they decide you can’t rule yourselves and.... we’ll you should know the outcome....

I went to college under a 4-year Air Force ROTC Scholarship. There were 2 other 4-yr scholarship students in my class:  a White woman and a Black woman.

I had passing SAT scores, a low A/high B average from high school. I worked 2-3 part time jobs in high school because my family was poor -- food stamps, free school lunches, etc.

I graduated college with a BA in Computer Science. The day I showed up for in-processing, I had $25 in my bank account and less than $20 on me. I walked out of the finance office with over $3000, and just 5 days until payday.

I made my choices, and life worked out very well for me.

Equal opportunity -- not equal outcome.

True, but after domesticating these islands for over 1000 years, they developed specific genetic and cultural traits that made them uniquely kanaka maoli, or indigenous native Hawaiians to those who remain uneducated to the ways of the first peoples of these islands.

See, This is a perfect example of the ignorance of transplants to these islands that give all non-indigenous or non-locals a bad name.

You continuously make statements that assert the Hawaiian people would go back to living in grass Shacks and pounding poi as a normal way of living. You probably have no idea how much the Hawaiian people have contributed to the world, because you apparently are a very close minded, ignorant individual.

You must not know that at one point in time,  the nation of Hawaii was the most literate nation in the world, because everyone, to include the majority of the Hawaiian people, we're reading the Bible. You must also not know that Hawaii was the first country/state to have a printed newspaper west of the rockies, in both English and Hawaiian.

Ever heard of the civil war? The kingdom of Hawaii supplied most of the sugar that fed northern troops. And speaking of the civil war,  did you know that Hawaiians of indigenous decent fought and died for the North?

I can go on and on about achievements had and contributions made by Hawaiians, but i doubt you could even process this information, due to how close minded you are about the first people's of these islands.

And technically,  its the republic of Hawaii that would be restored, not the kingdom, as the kingdom was overthrown and advocated, and what currently exists is the occupied nation of the Republic of Hawaii, due to the illegal annexation of these islands through joint resolution; same as How Texas is still legally the Republic of Texas, as the joint resolution to include Texas in the union was also illegal.

And You act like Hawaiians wouldn't be able to fight lol. Im proud to be almost half native Hawaiian. I went to a school designated for the indigenous peoples of this land.  I volunteered to serve in military, and voluntarily requested to deploy to a real combat zone during my time of service,  in which time i learned be tactically and technically proficient in warfighting disciplines. Best part of it all: there are thousands of Hawaiians just like me, if not better, and are also now making significant strides and contributions in fields that you likely would not even have the mental capacity to understand,  so yeah...i think we'd be alright without your help, or your residency.

Please leave your Mahalo Rewards card at the door before leaving.

Most Hawaiians will never get an ROTC scholarship, let alone go to college,  because the living conditions and educational environments that they are raised in do not promote self-empowerment, striving for excellence or pursuing intelligence,  something that Hawaiians once did, but we suppressed from doing after the missionaries arrived;

"a Masters in CJ"

You could just shorten that to "Here's my victim card. Where do I get my EBT card and rent subsidies?"

I guess my assessment of Native Hawaiians' potential is unrealistically far above yours.

My bad.   

Nah no victim card. I'm actually a proponent of Hawaiians getting away from the victim mentality that is plaguing our progress as indigenous people and Americans.

 I also don't have a problem discussing my points and lack of said victim in person. In my experience,  People tend to act and talk differently when face to face and not hiding behind a computer screen; especially people from this forum.

You and I have met -- more than once.

You still using that lawn mower I gave you?   

Nope, actually crapped out after a few uses. Probably should have just cut my grass with the 54r I traded 

You also weren't openly disrespectful of the demographic that Im apart of; guess the internet tends to do that to people, which is why situations like this are precisely why individuals like Kuleana and myself are happy to talk to people about these and other issues regarding Hawaiian history and the current population in person,  just as he and I did following the days when we would go at it on This forum.

But like i stated: when in person, people tend to change their demeanor and tone when a computer screen doesnt divide them. We have both noticed that no one has anything to say to him when he encounters them in public, yet have a lot to say to and about him on this forum.

You and Kuleana, on the other hand, seem to have an attitude that Native Hawaiians have been somehow stripped of any reason to try to make a better life.  Kuleana seems to think this can only be remedied by Hawaiians being given sovereignty over themselves again. -- that somehow that'll make everyone motivated and thirstier for education.  It sounds like you might also share that belief.

When the Americans illegally annexed Hawaii in 1898, they immediately began a program of denationalization, a war crime by-the-way, that eradicated much of the culture, language, and history of Native Hawaiians in an effort to ensure future generations be ignorant and accepting of American rule.  Native Hawaiians of later generations were raised believing that it was the US that brought much of Hawaii into the 20th Century and that they were doomed to being a pre-contact primitive society, if not for the US.  This is, of course, a false narrative, as Q pointed out.  Hawaii prior to the overthrow and annexation was one of the most literate and progressive nations in the World.  Keep in mind it had a Constitution modeled after the US, which all Hawaiian subjects at that time shared similar to their counterparts in the US.

The problems Hawaiians face today can trace their roots to the exact date when the Americans took over Hawaii.  Although, the US has tried to improve this socio-economical condition of Hawaiians via federal monies towards human services and education, it is obvious that millions of dollars later it has and will not work.  Consequently, one must rationalize that only by returning the nation they occupy is the only and last viable way to address this situation.


And it's not all Hawaiian-born locals you're including in that assessment.  it's only Native Hawaiians.  Somehow all other ethnicities -- Japanese, Filipino, Samoan, Caucasians, and African Americans -- are predisposed to doing better because they, unlike Native Hawaiians, didn't suffer from their Kingdom being taken away from them?  Is that how you analyze the situation?

How can you even ask that question sincerely?  Are you familiar with what happened to the South after the American Civil War?  After being left in turmoil, many Northerners started appearing and began looting the place and getting rich beyond their dreams, while many Southerners had to live in near poverty during those reconstruction years.  The difference between that example and Hawaii is that those Northerners eventually went away and allowed Southerners to ultimately run their own affairs and benefit the wealth of their endeavors.  Native Hawaiians, on the other hand, had to not only compete with the many transplanted Americans, but also the many foreign immigrants that were let into their nation.  How could Native Hawaiians survive under those circumstances?


I would really like to know if that's how you think -- that only Native Hawaiians have "educational environments that they are raised in do not promote self-empowerment, striving for excellence or pursuing intelligence", but all others born and raised in Hawaii have been able to find that for themselves?

It doesn't make any sense that the indigenous population from not even a century ago lost all of that, but the people making Hawaii their home are able to find those things. You're almost arguing that there's a genetic or cultural characteristic that's unique to Native Hawaiians that either prevents them from taking advantage of the opportunities others find, or they are incapable of competing with for opportunities.

You can not imagine the psychological damage that Native Hawaiians today share in knowing how their nation was taken away from them.  Living in this condition definitely affects one's ability to learn and survive in a nation that they no longer control.  All these other Hawaii-born immigrants do not suffer or live with that history, since their predecessors all headed to Hawaii with the full purpose of making a better life.  Given the psychology and motivations of the different populations, it becomes clear which ethnic groups had and will do better socio-economically in the long-term.


I have the mindset of "don't forget where you came from, but don't let that limit where you can go."

Everyone has to adapt.  Your posts sound like you don't think "your demographic" is capable of adapting and thriving in a world outside of one controlled by a Hawaiian-only government.

See above.


If you think a valid argument for my opinion is, "You're a racist," then I guess we'll have to leave the discussion for just you Native Hawaiians and forget about trying to understand each other.

Your opinion on this issue is very naïve and ignorant, especially in fully understanding the conditions Native Hawaiians face in their own land and being ruled by an illegal power.  However, I do postulate that you would feel similarly, if you were Native Hawaiian.

Your opinion on this issue is very naïve and ignorant, especially in fully understanding the conditions Native Hawaiians face in their own land and being ruled by an illegal power.  However, I do postulate that you would feel similarly, if you were Native Hawaiian.

That may be true for the low educated, welfare dependent Hawaiians.  However, that is not true for a great number of other Hawaiians who are aware of the illegality of the US occupation of Hawaii based on US Constitutional law.  Have you seen the US Department of Interior hearings that were conducted to see whether Hawaiians were willing to be recognized to be a nation within a nation in 2014?  You can do a search on YouTube on those hearings and see for yourself what the preponderance of the Hawaiian responses were.


Most of those hearings did not make into the mainstream media, by-the-way, due to the overwhelming pro-restoration sentiment of the Hawaiian populous.