And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy. (Read 2991 times)

Flapp_Jackson

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #20 on: August 12, 2018, 11:51:48 PM »
So technically, he was never acquitted of manslaughter. However (AFAIK), double jeopardy is supposed to prevent the prosecutor from trying lesser charges in subsequent trials until one finally sticks. The prosecutor is supposed to look at the evidence at hand and select the charge that fits the crime. The courts are not a buffet with a pile of clean plates for each trip.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_jeopardy

If you read my post, it spells out what is a lesser, included crime and what is considered a separate crime.

The facts a prosecutor needs to prove for 2nd Degree Murder are exactly the same as they are for manslaughter except murder requires one additional element: malice.  There are no elements for manslaughter that are not included in the murder charge.

Manslaughter is a subset of the facts for Murder, so if you acquit on Murder and charge manslaughter in the same trial, double jeopardy attaches to both charges.

Here's a better example of when they could refile:

Deedy kidnaps a woman, carjacks her vehicle in the process, and sexually assaults her.

The state can try him on kidnapping, grand theft auto and sexual assault charges in one trial.  If he's acquitted of GTA and kidnapping, but the jury deadlocks on rape, the state can choose to refile the rape charge.  Rape is not a "lesser charge" relating to GTA and kidnapping.  It's a separate crime even though it was part of the same criminal course of conduct.

Manslaughter is a lesser charge of the same crime when also charging 2nd Degree Murder. So an acquittal for one is an acquittal for both.

That's my read on it. Based on what I've looked into, that's how double jeopardy protects us from being tried for 1st degree murder, then going through another trial for 2nd degree murder, and another trial for manslaughter, and another trial for aggravated assault, and so on.  The Constitution protects us from prosecutors filing charge after charge for the same essential crime until they get a conviction.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2018, 10:35:04 PM by Flapp_Jackson »
Belief leads people to accept the most ridiculous things as the absolute truth.

changemyoil66

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #21 on: August 13, 2018, 10:13:17 AM »
Either way his career at the SS is over.  If he does stay, then he will have desk duty for the rest of his career.

I did enjoy the testimony by his friend.  "There's a difference between "haole" and "f-ing haole".

changemyoil66

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #22 on: August 13, 2018, 10:25:58 AM »
See florida stand your ground post.

DA went after him for manslaughter and not murder.  Compared to Deedy.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #23 on: August 13, 2018, 10:33:54 AM »
Either way his career at the SS is over.  If he does stay, then he will have desk duty for the rest of his career.

I did enjoy the testimony by his friend.  "There's a difference between "haole" and "f-ing haole".

He's a State Department Special Agent, not Secret Service.

He's been working at State Dept this whole time. If he was going to be fired, I think it would have already happened.

If he's meeting or exceeding the standards of his position, it's almost impossible to fire him. 
Belief leads people to accept the most ridiculous things as the absolute truth.

2ahavvaii

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #24 on: August 13, 2018, 10:51:11 AM »
wasting state money with all these trials.

RSN172

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #25 on: August 13, 2018, 01:00:59 PM »
I read that this trial has him in financial ruin.  He should have bought ccw insurance.

groveler

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #26 on: August 13, 2018, 02:32:46 PM »
I read that this trial has him in financial ruin.  He should have bought ccw insurance.

Like all cops, they know they can't convict, but they can run you through the "system"
until you are broke.  There is no repercussions for their un-ethical behavior,
especially in Hawaii. It is what Democrats do.

groveler

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #27 on: August 13, 2018, 02:38:02 PM »
This whole thing was making Hawaii look like a third world S-hole, IMO. Incompetence all around.
I've lived here 18 years or so.  Hawaii IS a  third world S-hole.
Guam is about as crooked as can be but is a far better example
of a functional government than Hawaii.
Guam at least recognizes the 2nd amendment.

changemyoil66

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #28 on: August 13, 2018, 02:44:48 PM »
I had to re-watch his testimony on the news. In 2011, I was not able to be a gun owner so I didn't look up self defense laws.

Now that I have looked into it a little, it still doesn't change my attitude toward Elders. He started a fight with someone who was armed.  He didn't know when to back down.

But like above posted, a murder charge is different from manslaughter.  And looks like the DA dropped the ball on this one.  Whether intentional or not.

z06psi

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #29 on: August 13, 2018, 03:45:02 PM »
I've lived here 18 years or so.  Hawaii IS a  third world S-hole.
Guam is about as crooked as can be but is a far better example
of a functional government than Hawaii.
Guam at least recognizes the 2nd amendment.

 :thumbsup:

Started a new job last week.  Sat at my desk and started a conversation with a guy next to me.  Mentioned we just moved from Hawaii and his first question to me was "The police and government still corrupt over there?"

I just said "yes and the Police Chief is under Federal charges".

He said "Some things never change".

Kuleana

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #30 on: August 13, 2018, 04:59:35 PM »
I've lived here 18 years or so.  Hawaii IS a  third world S-hole.


Then you must be one insane individual.

Why do still live in Hawaii, while hating how we do things in here?

rklapp

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #31 on: August 13, 2018, 07:00:35 PM »
That's my read on it. Based on what I've looked into, that's how double jeopardy protects us from being tried for 1st degree murder, then going through another trial for 2nd degree murder, and another trial for manslaughter, and another trial for aggravated assault, and so on.  The Constitution protects us from prosecutors filing charge after charge for the same essential crime until they get a conviction.
So we agree. Good explanation.
Yahh! Freedom and justice shall always prevail over tyranny, Babysitter Girl!
https://ronsreloading.wordpress.com/

RSN172

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #32 on: August 13, 2018, 08:16:57 PM »
Kaneshiro going make a fool of himself by appealing Watson’s decision.

groveler

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #33 on: August 14, 2018, 09:04:21 AM »

Then you must be one insane individual.

Why do still live in Hawaii, while hating how we do things in here?

I did not say Hawaii was the only S-hole in America.
Fortunately the government here is so incompetent,
us rural guys can pretty much ignore Oahu.
Besides I really don't miss the yearly chore
of chopping 3 cords of wood for the winter, if I relocated.
I intend to stick around and do as much I can to legally destroy
the state government, OHA, and county government.

stangzilla

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #34 on: August 14, 2018, 09:16:48 AM »
here we go again 

Flapp_Jackson

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #35 on: August 14, 2018, 10:08:57 AM »
I did not say Hawaii was the only S-hole in America.
Fortunately the government here is so incompetent,
us rural guys can pretty much ignore Oahu.
Besides I really don't miss the yearly chore
of chopping 3 cords of wood for the winter, if I relocated.
I intend to stick around and do as much I can to legally destroy
the state government, OHA, and county government.

 :stopjack:
Belief leads people to accept the most ridiculous things as the absolute truth.

Kuleana

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #36 on: August 14, 2018, 10:38:35 AM »
I intend to stick around and do as much I can to legally destroy
the state government, OHA, and county government.

Sincerely, that sounds great!      :shaka:

z06psi

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #37 on: August 14, 2018, 02:24:51 PM »
I did not say Hawaii was the only S-hole in America.
Fortunately the government here is so incompetent,
us rural guys can pretty much ignore Oahu.
Besides I really don't miss the yearly chore
of chopping 3 cords of wood for the winter, if I relocated.
I intend to stick around and do as much I can to legally destroy
the state government, OHA, and county government.

 :geekdanc:

RSN172

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #38 on: November 08, 2019, 07:09:38 AM »
Deedy not done yet.  State wants to try him on assault charges and Fed Appeals Court approved it.

MEENGIRL

Re: And, It's Finally Over. No Third Trial for Deedy.
« Reply #39 on: November 08, 2019, 08:50:36 AM »
That would be double jeopardy right? I'm not a attorney. Just using common sense.  Smh