Neutering Magazines (Read 2915 times)

jskd82

Neutering Magazines
« on: November 21, 2018, 06:29:12 AM »
Anyone know the actual ruling on blocking "high capacity" handgun mags? I've called firearms department on different islands and they all say different things...  One saying they require a gunsmith to block the mags and give them a notarized letter.... Another says take it to a gunshop and they can do it, when I asked if I could buy the block myself and just epoxy or rivet the base plate, he was unsure and said the gunshop would know how to permanently do it.  All I can find is the following.....

(c)  The manufacture, possession, sale, barter, trade, gift, transfer, or acquisition of detachable ammunition magazines with a capacity in excess of ten rounds which are designed for or capable of use with a pistol is prohibited.  This subsection shall not apply to magazines originally designed to accept more than ten rounds of ammunition which have been modified to accept no more than ten rounds and which are not capable of being readily restored to a capacity of more than ten rounds.

It just says not capable of being readily restored, nothing about having a gunsmith or gun shop do it....  Anyone block their own mags and ran into law enforcement?

PalisadesKid

Re: Neutering Magazines
« Reply #1 on: November 21, 2018, 08:39:33 AM »
Personally, I read the laws on the books (HRS) as written. I'll leave it at that.

What you will find, when others respond to this, is that often HPD officers will and have a history of making things up as they go along. For example, when you buy a complete AR lower and register it, they say to bring back the completed rifle to re-register it again, YET there is NOTHING, literally nothing in HRS that says this is required.

I've been more than aware of people blocking their own magazines, especially when the Glock Gen 5s FIRST came out and Glock was late on making factory 10 round magazines.. so people blocked them themselves or did have a gunsmith do it, but there was no "PAPERWORK" involved.


Anyone know the actual ruling on blocking "high capacity" handgun mags? I've called firearms department on different islands and they all say different things...  One saying they require a gunsmith to block the mags and give them a notarized letter.... Another says take it to a gunshop and they can do it, when I asked if I could buy the block myself and just epoxy or rivet the base plate, he was unsure and said the gunshop would know how to permanently do it.  All I can find is the following.....

(c)  The manufacture, possession, sale, barter, trade, gift, transfer, or acquisition of detachable ammunition magazines with a capacity in excess of ten rounds which are designed for or capable of use with a pistol is prohibited.  This subsection shall not apply to magazines originally designed to accept more than ten rounds of ammunition which have been modified to accept no more than ten rounds and which are not capable of being readily restored to a capacity of more than ten rounds.

It just says not capable of being readily restored, nothing about having a gunsmith or gun shop do it....  Anyone block their own mags and ran into law enforcement?

changemyoil66

Re: Neutering Magazines
« Reply #2 on: November 21, 2018, 08:56:44 AM »
There is no definition of what "readily restorable" is, nor any case law.  So what would a reasonable person do?  Keep in mind many of the 10rd factory mags do not have a welded base plate.  Some have an insert that is mid mag (HK) , some just have a dimple (CZ) that prevents that 11th round from entering.

But in the end having any mag that is not a 10 rounder is a misdemeanor (keep 2a rights).  Unless it is inserted into a pistol, then it's a felony (lose 2a rights).

drck1000

Re: Neutering Magazines
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2018, 09:15:06 AM »
I've never heard of the notarized letter thing.  I have had mags blocked to 10 rounds many times.  IMO (not legal advice), the key statement is:

Quote
. . . magazines originally designed to accept more than ten rounds of ammunition which have been modified to accept no more than ten rounds and which are not capable of being readily restored to a capacity of more than ten rounds.

I've had pieces of plexiglas epoxied to the follower and dimples made in the sides of the mags to limit the travel of the follower.  I haven't "run into LE" with these, but from what I can tell, those methods are generally accepted in states with mag restrictions less than STANDARD CAPACITY. 

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Neutering Magazines
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2018, 11:53:01 AM »
There are court cases where the term "readily" was defined as "not requiring the use of a tool/tools."  That's why the bullet button was invented for CA compliance. A bullet was used as a "tool" to remove the mags.

So, if you can restore >10 rd capacity of a mag by simply replacing parts with no tools needed, you'd be on shaky ground.

Making the floor plate permanently fixed satisfies the law.

Also, a >10 rd mag disassembled has been said to not be a mag by definition, since it cannot hold a single round of ammo in that state.  It's considered a "parts kit."

The games we play to comply with bad laws.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

6716J

Re: Neutering Magazines
« Reply #5 on: November 23, 2018, 08:12:43 AM »
well if you need to get them...

http://www.magazineblocks.com/magento/products/magblock-kits.html?limit=all

Also if you epoxy them in place, go buy some additional floorplates for whatever you have so you can change them back when you leave Hawaii
I'd rather have a bottle in front of me, than a frontal lobotomy.

London808

Re: Neutering Magazines
« Reply #6 on: November 23, 2018, 05:16:15 PM »
I would just buy 10 round mags and be done with it, There is some court cases that may be on the way to changing magazine limits.
"Mr. Roberts is a bit of a fanatic, he has previously sued HPD about gun registration issues." : Major Richard Robinson 2016