HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms (Read 12080 times)

changemyoil66

HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« on: January 17, 2019, 10:32:19 AM »
https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/measure_indiv.aspx?billtype=HB&billnumber=25&year=2019

Emailed my rep who introduced and called Brower's office.  Receptionist said HIFICO already called and asked if I was a member/director. 

Thanks HIFICO for being proactive, and the bill was just introduced yesterday.

RSN172

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2019, 10:43:06 AM »
Another bill introduced without thinking.  No more hunting trips to Lanai and Molokai unless you have friends or family there.
Happily living in Puna

changemyoil66

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2019, 10:55:05 AM »
Another bill introduced without thinking.  No more hunting trips to Lanai and Molokai unless you have friends or family there.
Tell them to call also. Idk any hunters.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

tillamook

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2019, 11:10:06 AM »
has there been there a run of hotel room shootings that I'm not aware of? 

punaperson

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2019, 11:52:34 AM »
It's quite the popular bill. Sixteen reps are signed on as "introduced by". that's 31% of the House. I don't recall seeing any bills last session with that many co-sponsors.

BROWER, HASHEM, HASHIMOTO, HOLT, KOBAYASHI, LOWEN, MORIKAWA, NAKAMURA, NAKASHIMA, NISHIMOTO, OHNO, QUINLAN, SAN BUENAVENTURA, SAY, TAKAYAMA, TAKUMI

has there been there a run of hotel room shootings that I'm not aware of? 
You make the same mistake I do of expecting to find some rational, logical and/or evidence-based rationale for legislation that is introduced re firearms.  :shaka:

macsak

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2019, 11:54:23 AM »
has there been there a run of hotel room shootings that I'm not aware of?

if it only saves one life...

punaperson

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #6 on: January 17, 2019, 12:06:28 PM »
Here are the email addresses of the co-sponsors of the bill in case anyone besides me want to write them and ask "What the fuck?" "Could you please tell me the rationale and evidence upon which this bill is claimed to enhance public safety?"

repbrower@Capitol.hawaii.gov, rephashem@Capitol.hawaii.gov, rephashimoto@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repholt@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repkobayashi@Capitol.hawaii.gov, replowen@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repmorikawa@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repnakamura@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repnakashima@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repnishimoto@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repohno@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repquinlan@Capitol.hawaii.gov,  repsanbuenaventura@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repsay@Capitol.hawaii.gov, reptakayama@Capitol.hawaii.gov, reptakumi@Capitol.hawaii.gov

zippz

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #7 on: January 17, 2019, 01:32:17 PM »
Besides the 2nd amendment violations this affects

Hunters traveling from the mainland and interisland
Competitive shooters traveling interisland
Leosa
Shooters traveling for training courses
Firearms instructors
Gun exhibitors and salesmen from the mainland
Armed guards

zippz

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #8 on: January 17, 2019, 02:13:20 PM »
https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/measure_indiv.aspx?billtype=HB&billnumber=25&year=2019

Emailed my rep who introduced and called Brower's office.  Receptionist said HIFICO already called and asked if I was a member/director. 

Thanks HIFICO for being proactive, and the bill was just introduced yesterday.

Thanks for taking the initiative.  It does have a lot of cosponsors which means they like this bill and want to push it through.  I'm hoping they realize how many people are affected and trash it early so we can spend our resources on other stuff.

tillamook

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2019, 02:18:47 PM »
Besides the 2nd amendment violations this affects

Hunters traveling from the mainland and interisland
Competitive shooters traveling interisland
Leosa
Shooters traveling for training courses
Firearms instructors
Gun exhibitors and salesmen from the mainland
Armed guards

LEO's from the mainland, since they are also not allowed to carry outside their hotel rooms. 
Hale Koa hotel on Wakiki for military members.  Father was an MP and we stayed there when I was a kid
Pelosi's entourage on the Big Island.

« Last Edit: January 17, 2019, 03:11:20 PM by tillamook »

zippz

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2019, 02:27:34 PM »
Forgot to add incoming PCS Military in temporary lodging.

punaperson

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2019, 03:37:03 PM »
Besides the 2nd amendment violations this affects

Hunters traveling from the mainland and interisland
Competitive shooters traveling interisland
Leosa
Shooters traveling for training courses
Firearms instructors
Gun exhibitors and salesmen from the mainland
Armed guards
LEOSA is exempted, as are all the other categories exempted from the other laws about handgun mags over 10 rounds, etc. It is the exact same wording, they just copied it from that section 134-11.

I already got back one response:

-A rationale 'page', which I don't have, was attached to this bill and mentioned the mass shooting in Las Vegas couple yrs ago, the deadliest in US history, many hundreds injured by gunfire and many hundreds more injured by human stampede [evidence, I don't have death and injury count for this shooting...but big numbers], etc.  ; there is/was on fake news internet,  that this shooting did not occur and is fake news.

 --I can probably get this rationale page if you want.

--The prime introducer represents Waikiki, where there are many big events, gatherings, parades which might lend to the scenario of Las Vegas shooting.  Waikiki hotels are concerned about gun violence and might be the behind-the-scenes initiator of this bill, don't know.

/bert kobayashi

  State Representative

  Diamond Head, Kahala, Kaimuki, Kapahulu

  586-6310

* * * * *
If "one time" events are going to be the rationale for laws to ban things... pretty sure no one will ever be allowed to have a gun, knife, car, hammer, gasoline, matches, swimming pools, etc. ever again. I wonder why they only apply that "logic" to guns? Go figure.

zippz

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2019, 03:47:12 PM »
LEOSA is exempted, as are all the other categories exempted from the other laws about handgun mags over 10 rounds, etc. It is the exact same wording, they just copied it from that section 134-11.
 be the behind-the-scenes initiator of this bill, don't know.

The Leosa law only prevents restrictions to having a carry permit and ammunition.  It doesn't override state laws on place restrictions and magazines.

Other states local law enforcement officers aren't law enforcement when coming across state borders unless agreements are made.  So those states without agreements will be affected by this law.  Unless Hawaii has agreements with all states.  Guess that's a FOIA thing. But it would still affect LEs on vacation and those retired.

tillamook

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #13 on: January 17, 2019, 03:47:35 PM »
Oh or course!  I did not think of that.  Now with this law in place,  a suicidal shooter would not sneak his 40  guns into his hotel room to legally murder hundreds of people (I think, I cant remember if murder is also illegal in Hawaii).   He'll probably just go play mini golf instead. 

I hope they also secure all hotel guests with hand and wrist cuffs with bright orange jump suits.    They need bars on all windows to stop a shooting as well (or replace all the windows with solid steel) 

 

Mdotweber

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #14 on: January 17, 2019, 05:21:11 PM »
Just emailed all backers of this proposed bill, 181 views at the time of this post. If even half of the people who cruised this post emailed them it could be a big enough push for our overlords legislators to reconsider.The time for being content with our rights being pissed away is over. Let's do this, if backlash is what concerns you I'm sure we are already on the shit list so what could it hurt. :thumbsup:
"Dont forget, incoming fire has the right of way"-Clint Smith?

new guy

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #15 on: January 17, 2019, 06:06:37 PM »
Your mindset is your primary weapon. - Jeff Cooper

Trumper

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #16 on: January 17, 2019, 06:23:06 PM »
but you can smoke some 420 in your rooms! :shaka:

zippz

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #17 on: January 17, 2019, 11:02:02 PM »
Lots of people are riled up on facebook too.  Hope the reps got lots of calls and emails.  They must be wondering what the hell happened, it's only the 2nd day of the session.

London808

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #18 on: January 18, 2019, 08:13:33 PM »
This is HIFICO's official repose, (DRAFT) that is being sent out to all the sponsors of this bill.
 

We write to you today, to ask for your reconsideration on your sponsorship of HB25 in this 2019 legislative session.
Measure Title:      RELATING TO PUBLIC SAFETY.
Report Title:      Firearms; Hotel Rooms
Description:      Prohibits any person, including a hotel guest, from storing, keeping, carrying, or possessing any firearm or ammunition in any hotel room assigned to a guest with certain exceptions.


We, Hawaii Firearms Coalition, understand that many bills, good and bad, may be brought to you for your attention and sponsorship which you may feel the need to act on, on behalf of your constituents. However, in your action of sponsoring HB25, you may have acted erroneously. We want to inform you that this bill is not only poor in scope but is vastly unconstitutional.

We have been led to believe that the cover letter included with the request of your sponsorship used the shooting in Las Vegas as the justification of its need. The criminal in this case ignored the laws against murder and assault to commit the shooting in Las Vegas. Surely, a law prohibiting the possession of firearm in the hotel room would also have been ignored. A law prohibiting firearms may even provide a false sense of security that such action could not possibly happen because firearms are not allowed in the hotel. Thus, causing people to ignore or dismiss warning signs.

Within regard to the constitutionality of implementing a ban, the subject of whether a firearm may be kept in a temporary dwelling has been addressed previously in the 9th circuit court of appeals, in the case MORRIS v. U.S. ARMY CORPS OF ENGINEERS. This case looked at a ban on the possession of firearms by campers staying in tents on Army Corp of Engineers property. In this case, the court found that as Heller finds the right to bear arms is protected within the home, a tent is as much like a home and that it is equally protected.

“No court has identified those core rights comprehensively. But one core right was described by the Supreme Court: The right of a law-abiding individual to possess a handgun in his home for self-defense. District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570, 128 S. Ct. 2783, 171 L. Ed. 2d 637 (2008). In addressing the need for self-defense in the home, the Supreme Court held that the home is "where the need for defense of self, family, and property is most acute." Id. at 628.
The same analysis applies to a tent. While often temporary, a tent is more importantly a place — just like a home — where a person withdraws from public view, and seeks privacy and security for himself and perhaps also for his family and/or his property. Indeed, a typical home at the time the Second Amendment was passed was cramped and drafty with a dirt floor — more akin to a large tent than a modern home. Americans in 1791 — the year the Second Amendment was ratified — were probably more apt to see a tent as a home than we are today. Heller, 554 U.S. at 605 (holding that "public understanding" at time of ratification  [**7] is "critical tool of constitutional interpretation"). Moreover, under Fourth Amendment analysis, "tents are protected . . . like a more permanent structure," and are deemed to be "more like a house than a car." U.S. v. Gooch, 6 F.3d 673 (9th Cir. 1993). The privacy concerns of the Fourth Amendment carry over well into the Second Amendment's security concerns “



Therefore, since a tent is equally protected as a home, as stated above. We feel a hotel room would be equally protected and any such infringement on that right by a government entity would also be unconstitutional.

Another case we would like to bring to your attention, with regards to HB25, is: Stoner v. California; heard in the Supreme Court of the United States. This case stated police obtained consent from a hotel clerk to search a guest’s room and used the search as grounds to make an arrest. Here, the court found “that (the) defendant had a reasonable expectation of privacy in his hotel room and that the hotel clerk did not have authority to give permission to the officers to search defendant's room.”

The court found that the hotel room is equally protected by the guests' 4th Amendment Rights as any other dwelling that they occupy. As such, the police could not conduct a search based on the hotel worker's consent. When a room is rented it becomes the persons domicile or place of sojourn.

Both these cases show that constitutionally protected rights apply equally to hotel rooms and other temporary dwellings as they would within the home. We respectfully ask that you reconsider your sponsorship of HB25 and openly withdraw your support from this bill.  We also ask that you move to withdraw this bill from this legislative session.

Hotels are already able to prohibit the possession of firearms on their property through hotel policy as such no law is required. The law would only serve to effect law abiding citizens and would have implications on visitors to the state as well as local residents. Hawaii offers different hunting environments and animals across the island chain and many residents and tourists travel with firearms to hunt. Many people travel to Lanai, for example, to hunt Axis deer, with Lanai having the largest free ranging population of axis deer in the world. With this law being in effect, this hunting could not continue and would negatively affect the environment and financial wellbeing on the island as well as the state in general.

We thank you for taking the time to read the provided information and hope that it has enlightened you to the situation at hand. We, again, respectfully request that you retract your sponsorship of this bill, and request that you make efforts to end its consideration in this legislative session.




If you have any questions regarding the included information and/or firearms information in general, you are more than welcome to contact us via the information below. We look forward to hearing your response to our request.


Kind Regards,
Hawaii Firearms Coalition
info@hifico.org
P. O. Box 283018
Honolulu, HI 96826
"Mr. Roberts is a bit of a fanatic, he has previously sued HPD about gun registration issues." : Major Richard Robinson 2016

Direjackalope

Re: HB25 Bans guns in hotel rooms
« Reply #19 on: January 18, 2019, 09:43:58 PM »
Well said gentlemen. Keep up the great work!