Maunakea TMT Protests (Read 272995 times)

groveler

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1060 on: October 02, 2019, 02:04:47 PM »
No, I didn’t. Generally don’t...
Well, I read your comments.
In fact I read most all the comments on this site.
I'm a fast reader.
Keep up your efforts.

drck1000

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1061 on: October 02, 2019, 02:14:12 PM »
Well, I read your comments.
In fact I read most all the comments on this site.
I'm a fast reader.
Keep up your efforts.
I actually do read most of your comments.  Missed that one.  That said, your comments tend to be basically the same thing, so maybe I just read the first couple of lines before tuning out. . .

ren

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1062 on: October 02, 2019, 02:27:16 PM »
At this point, I think they should abandon TMT and turn that place into a permanent stage for Merrie Monarch.
Deeds Not Words

Kuleana

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1063 on: October 02, 2019, 09:39:11 PM »
Can't wait for the "kingdom" to be restored so we will have even more benefits of being ruled by superstitious racist dictators (once they resolve the heavy fighting about who the true top of the royalty pile is...).

Why do keep insulting Hawaiians who wish to see the rightful and legal restoration of their nation and sovereign government as all superstitious racist dictators? 

ren

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1064 on: October 02, 2019, 10:02:29 PM »
Why do keep insulting Hawaiians who wish to see the rightful and legal restoration of their nation and sovereign government as all superstitious racist dictators?

that's a point / demerit for him
Deeds Not Words

rklapp

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1065 on: October 02, 2019, 10:13:16 PM »
However,  OHA is elected.  Hawaiians should organize and elect people that will not be "puppets".

I never hear anything much about the OHA candidates, I have a hard time even finding what policies they root for. Should use your American freedoms to better your situation.

Organize grass roots informational campaigns.  Since anyone can vote for OHA trustees, more info needs to be disseminated.   Also, voter registration drives, and encouragement to actually vote when the time comes. 

I would vote for pro Hawaiian candidates (as long as they are pro 2A of course)
What is the sovereign nation’s official policy on gun rights?
Yahh! Freedom and justice shall always prevail over tyranny, Babysitter Girl!
https://ronsreloading.wordpress.com/

ren

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1066 on: October 03, 2019, 08:52:18 AM »
What is the sovereign nation’s official policy on gun rights?

nothing guaranteed.
Deeds Not Words

aieahound

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1067 on: October 03, 2019, 09:25:34 AM »
Hawaiians who wish to see the rightful and legal restoration of their nation and sovereign government 

Kuleana,

Haven’t the courts ruled on this?

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2009-apr-01-na-supreme-court-hawaii1-story.html

http://www.abajournal.com/magazine/article/greetings_from_independent_hawaii
« Last Edit: October 03, 2019, 09:38:24 AM by aieahound »

Kuleana

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1068 on: October 03, 2019, 09:16:12 PM »
Kuleana,

Haven’t the courts ruled on this?

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2009-apr-01-na-supreme-court-hawaii1-story.html

http://www.abajournal.com/magazine/article/greetings_from_independent_hawaii

No.  None of the US Courts have ever touched a case with the primary issue was the US unconstitutional annexation of Hawaii in 1898.

I believe there has been complaints/suits filed in both federal and state court and none of those complaints have ever been officially given due process.

If such a case did occur and ruled against Hawaiians, it would have already have been presented publicly and offered as rebuttal evidence for those against the restoration of the Hawaiian nation state.

eyeeatingfish

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1069 on: October 03, 2019, 10:46:22 PM »
No.  None of the US Courts have ever touched a case with the primary issue was the US unconstitutional annexation of Hawaii in 1898.

I believe there has been complaints/suits filed in both federal and state court and none of those complaints have ever been officially given due process.

If such a case did occur and ruled against Hawaiians, it would have already have been presented publicly and offered as rebuttal evidence for those against the restoration of the Hawaiian nation state.

Just to clarify, if instead of annexing Hawaii, America just declared war and took over by force, then you would not say the whole thing was illegal? It seems your suggestion that the annexation was illegal depends on technical language about annexation.

Kuleana

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1070 on: October 04, 2019, 03:32:32 PM »
Just to clarify, if instead of annexing Hawaii, America just declared war and took over by force, then you would not say the whole thing was illegal? It seems your suggestion that the annexation was illegal depends on technical language about annexation.

First of all, let me say the US and Hawaii are still in a state of war.

In affairs between recognized nation states, the relationship between them can only be in a state of war or peace.  A state of war exists when one side declares war on the other or when one side commits acts of war without any declaration.  Once war begins, a state of peace can only come about via a treaty of peace, which may or may not include any territory lost during that war.  If there is no such treaty of peace, like in the case of the Korean War, there is no official end to hostilities and territory taken at the end of such hostilities is not official and can be described at occupied territories (e.g. West Bank, Gaza Strip, and the Golan Heights are illegally occupied by Israel).

In the case of Hawaii, the US did commit an act of war by participating in the overthrow of Queen Liliuokalani in 1893.  After her being deposed, the so-called Republic of Hawaii was never recognized as the legitimate government by the US, as evidenced by the US not immediately annexing Hawaii as the Caucasian insurrectionists/traitors who instigated the overthrow of Liliuokalani had hoped and was the sole reason why they overthrew her at the very beginning.  Fast forwarding to 1898, the US was getting into war with Spain and her colonies and the imperialist President McKinley wanted Pearl Harbor as a naval base to control the sea-lanes in the Pacific. He initially tried to annex Hawaii LEGALLY via the US State Department, but was the vote to annex Hawaii was DEFEATED in the Senate due to the famous Kue Petition that was presented to Congress showing Hawaiians did not want to be part of the US.  Not giving up, the imperialists in US Government got Congress to draft and pass the Newlands Resolution in 1898, which President McKinley signed.  Since Congress has no jurisdiction to enact legislation of territorial acquisition, the annexation of Hawaii in 1898 is illegal based on US Constitutional Law.

Consequently, since no official treaty of peace or annexation exists, a state of war exists between the US and Hawaii and America's government / military presence in Hawaii as of date is illegal and can only be described as an illegal occupation.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2019, 03:51:33 PM by Kuleana »

macsak

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1071 on: October 04, 2019, 03:39:26 PM »
First of all, let me say the US and Hawaii are still in a state of war.

In affairs between recognized nation states, the relationship between them can only be in a state of war or peace.  A state of war exists when one side declares war on the other or when one side commits acts of war without any declaration.  Once war begins, a state of peace can only come about via a treaty of peace, which may or may not include any territory lost during that war.  If there is no such treaty of peace, like in the case of the Korean War, there is no official end to hostilities and territory taken at the end of such hostilities is not official and can be described at occupied territories (e.g. West Bank, Gaza Strip, and the Golan Heights are illegally occupied by Israel).

In the case of Hawaii, the US did commit an act of war by participating in the overthrow of Queen Liliuokalani in 1893.  After her being deposed, the so-called Republic of Hawaii was never recognized as the legitimate government by the US, as evidenced by the US not immediately annexing Hawaii as the Caucasian insurrectionists/traitors who instigated the overthrow of Liliuokalani had hoped and was the sole reason why they overthrew her at the very beginning.  Fast forwarding to 1898, the US was getting into war with Spain and her colonies and the imperialist President McKinley wanted Pearl Harbor as a naval base to control the sea-lanes in the Pacific. He initially tried to annex Hawaii legally via the US State Department, but was the vote to annex Hawaii was defeated in the Senate due to the famous Kue Petition that was presented to Congress showing Hawaiians did not want to be part of the US.  Not giving up, the imperialists in US Government got Congress to draft and pass the Newlands Resolution in 1898, which President McKinley signed.  Since Congress has no jurisdiction to enact legislation of territorial acquisition, the annexation of Hawaii in 1898 is illegal based on US Constitutional Law.

Consequently, since no official treaty of peace or annexation exists, America's government and military presence in Hawaii as of date is illegal and can only be described as an illegal occupation

who recognizes Hawaii as a Nation-State?

Kuleana

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1072 on: October 04, 2019, 03:50:05 PM »
who recognizes Hawaii as a Nation-State?

From my understanding, the Court of Arbitration in the Hague, the UN Human Rights Council, and the National Education Association (NEA).  In the case of the NEA, the illegal occupation of Hawaii by the US will be taught to American K-12, undergraduate, and graduate students, whose teachers are affiliated by the NEA.

macsak

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1073 on: October 04, 2019, 03:51:19 PM »
From my understanding, the Court of Arbitration in the Hague, the UN Human Rights Council, and the National Educational Association (NEA).  In the case of the NEA, the illegal occupation of Hawaii by the US will be taught to American K-12, undergraduate, and graduate students, whose teachers are affiliated by the NEA.

sorry, which Nation-State recognizes Hawaii as a Nation-State?

groveler

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1074 on: October 04, 2019, 03:55:10 PM »
who recognizes Hawaii as a Nation-State?
At the risk of boring DRCK1000 and others.
At one time Hawaii was recognized as a Nation,
by some other nations.
Kind of like Texas was an independent Republic.
But most recently Hawaii voted to become a
state in the USA.
We know what happens when states try to
change their mind.   It doesn't go so well
for them.
Keep running over that flat possum in the road.
It is entertaining.

ren

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1075 on: October 04, 2019, 04:20:52 PM »
  x 121
Deeds Not Words

mrgaf

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1076 on: October 04, 2019, 08:06:45 PM »
At the risk of boring DRCK1000 and others.
At one time Hawaii was recognized as a Nation,
by some other nations.
Kind of like Texas was an independent Republic.
But most recently Hawaii voted to become a
state in the USA.
We know what happens when states try to
change their mind.   It doesn't go so well
for them.
Keep running over that flat possum in the road.
It is entertaining.

  :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:  :thumbsup:
To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead.  Thomas Paine.

No man can get rich in politics unless he is a crook.  It cannot be done. Harry Truman

Only good liberal is one taking a dirt nap.

Heavies

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1077 on: October 04, 2019, 08:10:23 PM »
Way off topic again. :stopjack:

RSN172

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1078 on: October 05, 2019, 04:59:28 AM »
Happily living in Puna

oldfart

Re: Maunakea TMT Protests
« Reply #1079 on: October 05, 2019, 08:18:38 AM »
Price tag for the maunalolos is up to 8 million dollars.
I don't want to pay for this.

The protestors better start paying their share. Where are the celebs when you need their money?

If they can't pay a few million, how are they going to manage an 8 million acre mountain???
What, Me Worry?