20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons. (Read 20637 times)

ren

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #20 on: August 11, 2019, 01:02:37 PM »
with a right there comes a responsibility
Like the 1st amendment...you can yell what ever you want - but don't yell fire or bomb in some places that are inappropriate i.e. airport, shopping mall etc.
Deeds Not Words

Heavies

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #21 on: August 11, 2019, 01:06:30 PM »
with a right there comes a responsibility
Like the 1st amendment...you can yell what ever you want - but don't yell fire or bomb in some places that are inappropriate i.e. airport, shopping mall etc.
^^THIS^^

groveler

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #22 on: August 11, 2019, 01:17:21 PM »
If you can't figure that one out, I can't help you with my explanation.
I used to go up to Alaska to visit my brother and fish while he was at work,
he often loaned me his truck.
Since I was in bear country I carried a model 1911,  open or concealed.
I also,  depending on the location carried an SKS type 56 Carbine.
There is a un-wriiten way to behave set of rules with Alaska open carry.
In a market you covered the pistol, but kept it on you
and left the rifle in the truck.
You could walk down the city sidewalks and roads carrying both openly.
If you are in an area where you think if you left your rifle in the rifle rack
and it might get stolen from a vehicle,  then carry it with you and ask if you can
leave it with a store person till you're done shopping.
Just use a little sense.  That is the way it should work.


eyeeatingfish

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #23 on: August 11, 2019, 01:28:06 PM »
I see a lawsuit against the firefighter and police department coming up, and looks like he has a good chance of winning unless he made some sort of threat.  Guy likely did this to get attention which sucks, but it's still his right to do.

It's good to see a CCW take the initiative, however it seems like he did it out of fear instead of an actual threat.

Legally sure he could do that but given the context it was stupid.

I could also stand in a crowd and yell Alah Akbar "praise god" but given the context it would also be stupid.

I could glue flares to my chest in a row and walk around but it would be stupid.


Legal doesn't mean it was a good idea and legal doesn't mean that someone else's response wouldn't be reasonable.


I think the guy was trying to make a point but it wasn't a smart way or time to do it.

groveler

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #24 on: August 11, 2019, 01:28:44 PM »
The 20year old guy could sue the fireman.  But receiving an apology would be the proper thing to do.  The fireman may have been overzealous, but he's a firearm owner and took the initiative to do what he thought was right.

Can sue the police since they should've known better about charging him with terroristic threatening.
The cops know the charges will be dropped.  They won't get any pushback
from lawsuits.  After all the taxpayer is footing the bill.
They just charged him so they can take
his gun and force him to go through the courts to get it back.
This is called processing you through the system.
When you get your gun back in two years and thousands of lawyers dollars later,
you'll find it was stored in a leaky container and is rust damaged.
There is nothing you can do about it!
And you can't sue the cops.
Isn't modern Democrat America great?

punaperson

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #25 on: August 11, 2019, 01:44:40 PM »
If you can't figure that one out, I can't help you with my explanation.
Yeah, that's what I thought. You are unwilling to state your position. No surprise.

punaperson

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #26 on: August 11, 2019, 01:53:41 PM »
with a right there comes a responsibility
Like the 1st amendment...you can yell what ever you want - but don't yell fire or bomb in some places that are inappropriate i.e. airport, shopping mall etc.
^^THIS^^
The above example of yelling something that causes a panic and results in injuries and/or deaths of people is a totally false analogy to what happened at the Missouri Walmart. (Another big First Amendment exemption is libeling or slandering people.) He wasn't doing anything illegal, AND apparently he walked around for at least several minutes without anyone being trampled due to panicking when seeing him engaged in legal open carry. The only possible danger happened when the store manager panicked and set off the fire alarm. At that point the open carrier also exited the building, at which point there may have been some slight danger by the ex-fireman drawing his weapon on someone well outside the store. I'd like to see his (or any other ) video and if it includes people reacting to seeing him and if any of them "panicked".

punaperson

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #27 on: August 11, 2019, 02:01:35 PM »
I think the guy was trying to make a point but it wasn't a smart way or time to do it.
So said the vast majority of colonists who wanted the colonies to remain colonies in the 1770s and viewed acts such as "The Boston Tea Party" as "stupid" and seditious.

We can clearly see here in Hawaii how toeing the line and "no make stink" has resulted in such a wonderful legal climate for us to exercise our Second Amendment-protected rights. So said no one. Ever.

eyeeatingfish

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #28 on: August 11, 2019, 02:07:04 PM »
So said the vast majority of colonists who wanted the colonies to remain colonies in the 1770s and viewed acts such as "The Boston Tea Party" as "stupid" and seditious.

We can clearly see here in Hawaii how toeing the line and "no make stink" has resulted in such a wonderful legal climate for us to exercise our Second Amendment-protected rights. So said no one. Ever.

So instead we should push the envelope by doing things that are technically legal but scare the hell out of people?

Flapp_Jackson

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #29 on: August 11, 2019, 03:18:45 PM »
So instead we should push the envelope by doing things that are technically legal but scare the hell out of people?

Have you seen the way most people drive?   :shake:
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Heavies

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #30 on: August 11, 2019, 03:39:13 PM »
Yeah, that's what I thought. You are unwilling to state your position. No surprise.

I stated my position already. 

Heavies

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #31 on: August 11, 2019, 03:39:37 PM »
I used to go up to Alaska to visit my brother and fish while he was at work,
he often loaned me his truck.
Since I was in bear country I carried a model 1911,  open or concealed.
I also,  depending on the location carried an SKS type 56 Carbine.
There is a un-wriiten way to behave set of rules with Alaska open carry.
In a market you covered the pistol, but kept it on you
and left the rifle in the truck.
You could walk down the city sidewalks and roads carrying both openly.
If you are in an area where you think if you left your rifle in the rifle rack
and it might get stolen from a vehicle,  then carry it with you and ask if you can
leave it with a store person till you're done shopping.
Just use a little sense.  That is the way it should work.




^^THIS^^

Heavies

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #32 on: August 11, 2019, 03:41:08 PM »
The cops know the charges will be dropped.  They won't get any pushback
from lawsuits.  After all the taxpayer is footing the bill.
They just charged him so they can take
his gun and force him to go through the courts to get it back.
This is called processing you through the system.
When you get your gun back in two years and thousands of lawyers dollars later,
you'll find it was stored in a leaky container and is rust damaged.
There is nothing you can do about it!
And you can't sue the cops.
Isn't modern Democrat America great?


Its Missouri, so I think as long as everybody has come to an understanding,  he'll get his stuff back.

punaperson

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #33 on: August 11, 2019, 04:00:36 PM »
So instead we should push the envelope by doing things that are technically legal but scare the hell out of people?
You mean like a black person sitting at a whites only lunch counter, or riding in the front of the bus, or attempting to enter a public school? You mean like asserting that we have a natural individual fundamental civil right to bear arms outside our home for the purpose of self-defense even though it "scares the hell out of" Ige, Lyin' Harry, Green, Rhoads, Lee, Baker, et al.? If concealed carry were legal, would you advise against it because you know that so many people, including the red shirt wearing Demanding Moms are "scared to hell" by people doing so? What about open carry? What kind, level, or amount of "fear" should determine what legal activities ought to be curbed?

"Push the envelope"?  "Technically legal"? "Scare the hell out of people"? Where do you come up with this crap?

There are a lot of people, who for whatever reasons and past experience are "scared" of cops... should the cops not go into those neighborhoods because they will "scare the hell out of people"?

Flapp_Jackson

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #34 on: August 11, 2019, 04:48:14 PM »
You mean like a black person sitting at a whites only lunch counter, or riding in the front of the bus, or attempting to enter a public school? You mean like asserting that we have a natural individual fundamental civil right to bear arms outside our home for the purpose of self-defense even though it "scares the hell out of" Ige, Lyin' Harry, Green, Rhoads, Lee, Baker, et al.? If concealed carry were legal, would you advise against it because you know that so many people, including the red shirt wearing Demanding Moms are "scared to hell" by people doing so? What about open carry? What kind, level, or amount of "fear" should determine what legal activities ought to be curbed?

"Push the envelope"?  "Technically legal"? "Scare the hell out of people"? Where do you come up with this crap?

There are a lot of people, who for whatever reasons and past experience are "scared" of cops... should the cops not go into those neighborhoods because they will "scare the hell out of people"?



The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

changemyoil66

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #35 on: August 11, 2019, 05:31:12 PM »
If hawaii allowed OC, would u not OC right away because it may scare people not used to it?

Im on the fence.  Yes with recent events, to do so may cause an uneccessary panic. But the walmart manager who pulled the fire alarm should have know better and been trained better. I think he paniced.

OCer hears fire alarm and runs out of the store just like everyone else. Ive run with a rifle slung and put at least 1 hand on it because a rifle bouncing around while running is not fun. Even if slung tightly, it still moves. So add people running out of the store, plus this guy with probabaly 1 hand holding his rifle against his body, would equal suspicion by anyone.

To me the manager is the most to blame.

Also the law and rights dont end because people might be scared. Regardless if he was testing anything or not.

I would have probably OCed a rifle for a few days if it were legal after recent events, instead of just carrying a pistol. Def not walk around in body armor. But it would be in my trunk with ammo cans.

Cops are in the wrong for charging him. Any other day of the week, he would have been free to go. They looked for a reason to take his gun away. I hope he sues the hell out of them.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

zippz

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #36 on: August 11, 2019, 06:08:52 PM »
Oh my God the insanity continues.  No more open carry for the police.

Police investigation prompts panic at Queen Kaahumanu Center

Shortly after 8 p.m., witnesses observed several officers walking through the complex with rifles.

Authorities said they were looking for a Wailea theft suspect.

Tenants and shoppers at the mall at the time say they had to be evacuated, however police said they did not order the evacuation.

https://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/2019/08/12/police-investigation-prompts-panic-queen-kaahumanu-center/

punaperson

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #37 on: August 11, 2019, 07:32:31 PM »
Oh my God the insanity continues.  No more open carry for the police.

Police investigation prompts panic at Queen Kaahumanu Center

Shortly after 8 p.m., witnesses observed several officers walking through the complex with rifles.

Authorities said they were looking for a Wailea theft suspect.

Tenants and shoppers at the mall at the time say they had to be evacuated, however police said they did not order the evacuation.

https://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/2019/08/12/police-investigation-prompts-panic-queen-kaahumanu-center/
Haha. I just came here to post that very article.

"Technically legal" but "stupid", yeah?! Dumb fakas "pushing the envelope"! Open carrying rifles in a mall after what happened last weekend? They "scared the hell out of people"!

drck1000

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #38 on: August 12, 2019, 12:23:32 PM »
with a right there comes a responsibility
Like the 1st amendment...you can yell what ever you want - but don't yell fire or bomb in some places that are inappropriate i.e. airport, shopping mall etc.
Yup.  So many (or too many) folks doing stuff because they could, without putting much thought into whether or not they should.  Similar with innovation.  Innovation for the sake of innovation can at times be counterproductive. . .

punaperson

Re: 20yo male arrested outside MO Walmart with weapons.
« Reply #39 on: August 12, 2019, 01:04:48 PM »
I stated my position already.
No you didn't. Not with any specificity or clarity.

Maybe someone else will be willing to tell us what you meant. What is "Heavies" position, exactly.