Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property (Read 3829 times)

tim808

Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« on: April 11, 2020, 05:33:37 PM »
How do you folks deal with them?

Do you choose a different hunting rifle if you think your group may bump into some?

Do you follow them till they get off the property?   Take their photos and or their vehicles/plates?

Any of them ever mess with your vehicles?


« Last Edit: April 11, 2020, 05:44:26 PM by tim808 »

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2020, 06:07:03 PM »
In most parts, that's what's called poaching.  Poaching is any illegal hunting or trapping of an animal.

Poaching has been going on forever.  One of the first and most effective things to do is mark your property.  Yeah, signs won't stop a trespasser, but it will at least take the "I didn't know" excuse out of play.

Trespassers have to be on notice they are trespassing.  If not, the Cops can only issue a warning.  Only if they return after the warning can they be charged with breaking the law.  The signs can serve as that warning.

It's never a good idea to confront a group.  Call the Cops.  Let them handle it.  If retaliation is a concern, make sure to have plenty of surveillance cameras installed ahead of time.

https://www.whitetailproperties.com/blog/what-landowners-can-do-to-help-stop-poaching

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

groveler

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2020, 06:24:57 PM »
How do you folks deal with them?

Do you choose a different hunting rifle if you think your group may bump into some?

Do you follow them till they get off the property?   Take their photos and or their vehicles/plates?

Any of them ever mess with your vehicles?
This is Big island,
Your property where you live and do business is your "Residence".
Deadly force is legal to protect your and family.
I had someone trespassed a few years back. We had some words.
My SIL had a rifle trained on them that they didn't see.
I later made a phone call, it was fixed,  and I got an apology
in person.
Not wise to trespass on the BI.
Hunters will get the word and stay clear.
You city people operate differently.
You expect cops to fix things for you.
They can't and they won't.
Like everybody here I don't violate
any Constitutional Federal, State, or Local law.
But my eyesight is really bad these days. I see nothing
and cannot report nothing.








bass monkey

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2020, 07:10:10 PM »
I used to work at kualoa ranch.
We always used to run into poachers while working.
We would tell them they trespassing and they got to go. Also that everyone is told to shoot the dogs if we come across any.

That was a little different though because there is only 1 "contractor" allowed to hunt there, so he wasn't happy to hear about poachers and would tell the community.
Also someone else on staff was a hunter from the area,  so there's that.

But listening to their trespassing stories in other places, usually when someone starts shooting at them or their dogs they leave.  And owners get a reputation for shooting dogs

RSN172

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2020, 07:15:30 PM »
My friend went to his 55 acre ranch with feed for his cattle, pigs and sheep.  His property is completely fenced with big signs PRIVATE PROPERTY, NO TRESSPASSING,  NO HUNTING, KEEP OUT.  As well as a Cattlemen Assn sign and his name and phone number.  As he opened the gate and drove in, he saw a guy in his 20s with a dead pig and a bow.  He had his 30 Carbine and a 357 Mag.  He threatened to shoot, telling the kid if he killed him he would tell the cops he pointed a loaded bow at him and shot in self defense.  He told me the kid actually started crying and begging for his life and that he only wanted food for his family.  He told the kid why didn't you call the number on the sign and ask?  He also told him he knew somebody dropped him off because he didn't see a vehicle and he knows he didn't walk.  He told him to take the pig, get out and tell your friends if he ever catches anybody up here again, he will just shoot them and feed them to the pigs.  This was 5 years ago and he never had trespassers since.  He is a Vietnam vet on PTSD disability.
Happily living in Puna

tim808

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2020, 07:43:00 PM »
Flapp - thanks for the advice and the link.  I don’t know why but I think everyone called them outlaws, I don’t recall anyone ever saying poacher.

Groveler - was the guy hunting or was he going to “borrow” some items from the home....or maybe scouting for nurseries?

I heard some stories about Helco not being let into some properties after the hurricane.  assumption was they probably had nurseries.

Also heard from some ladies in my office about 2 occasions where someone they knew (relative or friend) were shot and killed as they were clearing their properties

Bass - I’ve heard that about kualoa regarding dogs.

RSN - I can see why no one ever went back!!   Kid must have thought that was all she wrote
« Last Edit: April 11, 2020, 07:50:13 PM by tim808 »

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2020, 07:48:37 PM »
I'd wager most people are normal.  They will react to warnings appropriately and never bother you again.

Unfortunately there is that small minority of people who, for reasons of nature, nurture or "self medication", aren't rational enough to react as anticipated.

They're out there.  Judge each situation with prudence.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2020, 08:07:13 PM »
Flapp - thanks for the advice and the link.  I don’t know why but I think everyone called them outlaws, I don’t recall anyone ever saying poacher.


As I said, that's in most places.  Some define poaching as trapping or killing an animal that's either valuable or protected by law (like elephants for their tusks) and/or animals trapped or hunted on government-owned or managed land.

I've been taught it's any illegal hunting or trapping if the land and wildlife belongs to someone other than yourself -- unless you have the owner's permission.  Maybe they trespassed, did not have hunting licenses, were hunting what they killed out of season, used dogs where/when not legal, used illegal means, etc, etc.

Basically, anytime someone takes an animal to which they had no legal right or in a way which was not legal, that's poaching to me.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

RSN172

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2020, 09:30:48 PM »
When I was growing up on Molokai, we called illegal hunting “outlaw”.  Poaching is not a term that locals use or used, at least not when I was there, which was from birth to 18 years old.
Happily living in Puna

tim808

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2020, 10:28:11 PM »
Same on Lanai.  Outlaw just sounds better

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #10 on: April 12, 2020, 12:21:43 AM »
Not surprising.  I tried the Google translator, and there is no equivalent Hawaiian word for "poach".  "Outlaw" and "Criminal" do have Hawaiian equivalents.

If Google is correct, then that might explain it.

Just a guess.

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

tim808

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #11 on: April 12, 2020, 01:55:11 AM »
When my son was going to Wiz Kids for tutoring, a tutor from Maui mentioned her family had deer in a “pen” (?) and a guy went after a deer. 

I recall he shot a deer but I can’t recall if he was able to get it into his vehicle... but he did get away

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #12 on: April 12, 2020, 02:11:15 AM »
When my son was going to Wiz Kids for tutoring, a tutor from Maui mentioned her family had deer in a “pen” (?) and a guy went after a deer. 

I recall he shot a deer but I can’t recall if he was able to get it into his vehicle... but he did get away

My mother told me a story about my father.  He and a friend were out drinking and had been gone a couple of days (not an unusual occurrence).  She got a call to come bail him out of jail.   :shake:

He and his buddy thought it would be a good idea one night after a day of drinking to pick up some fresh meat for the families.  So, they drove into a pasture and tried to lift a cow into the bed of the truck.  Luckily for the cow, the owner saw the truck on his land and called the sheriff.

Yes, the cow was still mooing.

Yes, they were charged with cattle rustling, among other things.

No, they weren't hanged.   :rofl:

I never thought much about his predicament.  All I could think about was, "Poor cow!"
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

tim808

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #13 on: April 12, 2020, 08:36:39 AM »
When and where was that?  I thought people shoot at rustlers....at least in the movies they do.

Unless the farmer knew your dad and knew he went on benders once in a while.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #14 on: April 12, 2020, 10:47:58 AM »
When and where was that?  I thought people shoot at rustlers....at least in the movies they do.

Unless the farmer knew your dad and knew he went on benders once in a while.

If you get all your knowledge from Hollywood, you need to pick up a book!   :rofl:

Rustlers being shot at happened in the old West, when cattle and horses were depended on to live.

Nowadays it's like any other property. 
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

RSN172

Re: Outlaw hunters and dogs on private property
« Reply #15 on: April 12, 2020, 12:02:04 PM »
I firmly believe car thieves today should be executed.
Happily living in Puna