Police Brutality During Covid-19 (Read 29990 times)

Kuleana

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #80 on: May 27, 2020, 06:42:14 PM »
if someone breaks into your home or steals your car do you still call these fascist cops?

To file a report?  Yes.

To get my stuff back?  No.

To protect myself or my family?  Hell No.

ren

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #81 on: May 27, 2020, 07:31:27 PM »
To file a report?  Yes.

To get my stuff back?  No.

To protect myself or my family?  Hell No.

just to file a report by fascist goons? Why even bother? How would you know that they would file an accurate, objective, non-biased, non-fascist report?

A blanket categorization of an organization like the local police based on the actions of a few is inaccurate. It is akin to labeling an entire race based on the actions of a few. I wouldn't say that ALL HAWAIIANS are anti-TMT or anti-US based on your limited perspective.
This single event is a travesty. Agreed.
Deeds Not Words

ren

Deeds Not Words

Kuleana

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #83 on: May 27, 2020, 08:18:41 PM »
just to file a report by fascist goons? Why even bother? How would you know that they would file an accurate, objective, non-biased, non-fascist report?

A blanket categorization of an organization like the local police based on the actions of a few is inaccurate. It is akin to labeling an entire race based on the actions of a few.


Why not ask Groveler on his take to your questions?   :shaka:

ren

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #84 on: May 27, 2020, 08:24:00 PM »

Why not ask Groveler on his take to your questions?   :shaka:

you started this thread - own it
Deeds Not Words

Kuleana

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #85 on: May 27, 2020, 08:26:35 PM »
you started this thread - own it

So, are you scared to ask this forum's most knowledgeable expert, Groveler, his take on cops?

macsak

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #86 on: May 27, 2020, 08:54:49 PM »
So, are you scared to ask this forum's most knowledgeable expert, Groveler, his take on cops?

he posts his take on cops several times a week, we don't need to ask him...

Kuleana

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #87 on: May 27, 2020, 09:18:53 PM »
just to file a report by fascist goons? Why even bother? How would you know that they would file an accurate, objective, non-biased, non-fascist report?

You seem to want to bait and switch the narrative to my person rather than staying on the topic of this thread, which is police brutality.

Are you so interested in the things I do, as to whether I deal with cops or not?

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #88 on: May 27, 2020, 10:15:55 PM »
So, are you scared to ask this forum's most knowledgeable expert, Groveler, his take on cops?

I don't see Ren being afraid to engage anyone on here.

Your tactics are rather juvenile, calling him scared like that. 

Did you run out of talking points so that now you have to deflect to someone else -- like you're part of some kind of tag-team?    :rofl: :rofl:
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

robtmc

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #89 on: May 28, 2020, 11:52:44 AM »
I-- like you're part of some kind of tag-team?    :rofl: :rofl:
Gee, who else appears to post here just to create animosity..........???

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #90 on: May 28, 2020, 11:57:50 AM »
Gee, who else appears to post here just to create animosity..........???

 Quiet.  AieaHound will hear you!   :wave:
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Jmoto808

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #91 on: May 29, 2020, 04:43:40 PM »
I know the definition of fascism all too well and can describe its many hybrid forms it can take in a society.

Do you?



I am not arguing against police brutality on behalf of Black Americans.

I am protesting fascist police brutality against all people regardless

 of race, color, ethnicity, gender, etc.

I really dont think you understand what fascism is. I think you understand what the medias definition of it is, just like when they use the word bigot anytime they please. Fascism by definition is when one dictator has entire control of a state, county, or city and those who resist can have their personal rights stripped upon them. Im not sure how citing the rare incident of a black man being killed by one white cop by definition means rhe police force are fascist. Last time i checked we still have miranda rights and last time i checked, if the police were to wrongully search and seize your property, you can overturn it in a court of law. So once again, im not sure you do actually know what it means. Is there bad cops, yes. Do they have the right to strip your personal rights as rhey please? No. If there was a true dictatorship within the police, well thats why you are here on this forum. Thats why the 2a was started.

aieahound

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #92 on: May 29, 2020, 05:16:12 PM »
Gee, who else appears to post here just to create animosity..........???
Quiet.  AieaHound will hear you!   :wave:

I think robdmc might have been talking about EEF.
(Or you maybe?  :rofl:)
Snowflapp/Mauidog/DarmokarSalad/Moosed. Isn’t it about time to change your user name again?
 :geekdanc:

 :stopjack:
« Last Edit: May 29, 2020, 06:01:31 PM by aieahound »

Kuleana

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #93 on: May 29, 2020, 05:49:21 PM »
I really dont think you understand what fascism is. I think you understand what the medias definition of it is, just like when they use the word bigot anytime they please. Fascism by definition is when one dictator has entire control of a state, county, or city and those who resist can have their personal rights stripped upon them. Im not sure how citing the rare incident of a black man being killed by one white cop by definition means rhe police force are fascist.

Sorry, I don't get my news or base any of my views from the mainstream media.  Second of all, fascism has many meanings other that one you stated.  Fascism is also a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fascism).  Hence, it is a word that can also be used to described instances where police officers go beyond their SOPs and engage in acts of brutality.


 

Last time i checked we still have miranda rights and last time i checked, if the police were to wrongully search and seize your property, you can overturn it in a court of law. So once again, im not sure you do actually know what it means.

Yes, you can do what you prescribe, if the cops do not kill you first.

There have been a number of unjustifiable killings committed by fascist cops, if you have not noticed recently (e.g., George Floyd, Breonna Taylor, etc.).




Is there bad cops, yes. Do they have the right to strip your personal rights as rhey please? No. If there was a true dictatorship within the police, well thats why you are here on this forum.

You mean the same HPD who are trying to ban standard capacity long gun magazines at this year's legislature?




Thats why the 2a was started.

I agree with your expanding the meaning of the 2nd Amendment, but the true meaning of the 2nd Amendment lies more with arming and maintaining a regulated militia, in lieu of a standing army.

ren

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #94 on: May 29, 2020, 06:30:02 PM »


You mean the same HPD who are trying to ban standard capacity long gun magazines at this year's legislature?


You are mixing two separate issues here in an effort to influence the audience. Many of us obviously disagree with the laws HPD influences. There are officers who enter law enforcement to do the right thing. What that ONE officer did in Minnesota was wrong and was justifiably arrested. No one is arguing that. The argument here is the blanket labeling that all police are "fascist" and unjust. That is inaccurate and immature to label an organization of thousands based on the unethical actions of a few.
Deeds Not Words

Jmoto808

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #95 on: May 29, 2020, 06:35:04 PM »
Sorry, I don't get my news or base any of my views from the mainstream media.  Second of all, fascism has many meanings other that one you stated.  Fascism is also a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fascism).  Hence, it is a word that can also be used to described instances where police officers go beyond their SOPs and engage in acts of brutality.


 

Yes, you can do what you prescribe, if the cops do not kill you first.

There have been a number of unjustifiable killings committed by fascist cops, if you have not noticed recently (e.g., George Floyd, Breonna Taylor, etc.).




You mean the same HPD who are trying to ban standard capacity long gun magazines at this year's legislature?




I agree with your expanding the meaning of the 2nd Amendment, but the true meaning of the 2nd Amendment lies more with arming and maintaining a regulated militia, in lieu of a standing army.


But the problem is, you are labeling cops as fascist. I do not see a specific example of cops systemically using any sort of doctoral control or autocratic principles within America. The problem is, you are using few and far in between examples to label an entirety. Can individual cops have fascist ideas, sure, so can individual nurses, doctors, politicians, lawyers, garden men, etc. But to state that the whole is fascist, is ignorance at best.

It is just as ignorant as saying “if the cops do not kill you first” the problem with that statement is that is is implying that it is the common or norm for a cop to use lethal force before any means necessary. When we dig deeper into your point about minorities, its interesting because if we look at government data, a total of 228 civilians were killed by cops this year, but only 31 were black, the majority are white. So why is there this huge argument that cops are going out and killing minorities at a substantial rate?

The fact that you stated, “the same cops pushing for legislature to ban magazines” nullifies your argument about fascism. Last time i checked, fascim doesn’t have checks and balances, if the police were fascist, they could ban it outright on their own. If that is not the case, then you are somehow implying that HPD is in control of Ihara, Kahele, Wakai, Thielen, Shimabukuro, Morikawa, Chang, and Nishihara who are all elected officials? Because they are the ones who introduced the Bill. Now if you are saying they are all working for HPD like how the msm says republican politicians “work for the NRA” then that’s fair, but doesn’t make it true.

The militia was not limited to being a standing army. there are numerous founding fathers who made this explicit in their explanations. George Washington stated “A free people ought not only be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government” No where do they mention the people fighting for the government, but rather to protect themselves from the government itself. James Madison who was initially opposed to the idea also stated, " That a well-regulated militia is the proper, natural and safe defence of a free government".

Kuleana

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #96 on: May 29, 2020, 07:05:29 PM »
But the problem is, you are labeling cops as fascist. I do not see a specific example of cops systemically using any sort of doctoral control or autocratic principles within America. The problem is, you are using few and far in between examples to label an entirety. Can individual cops have fascist ideas, sure, so can individual nurses, doctors, politicians, lawyers, garden men, etc. But to state that the whole is fascist, is ignorance at best.

If what you say is true, how can America label China as a communist regime, when clearly they are not a communist state?



It is just as ignorant as saying “if the cops do not kill you first” the problem with that statement is that is is implying that it is the common or norm for a cop to use lethal force before any means necessary. When we dig deeper into your point about minorities, its interesting because if we look at government data, a total of 228 civilians were killed by cops this year, but only 31 were black, the majority are white. So why is there this huge argument that cops are going out and killing minorities at a substantial rate?

Where did I specifically mention minorities, as a basis of my main argument of police brutality?




The fact that you stated, “the same cops pushing for legislature to ban magazines” nullifies your argument about fascism. Last time i checked, fascim doesn’t have checks and balances, if the police were fascist, they could ban it outright on their own. If that is not the case, then you are somehow implying that HPD is in control of Ihara, Kahele, Wakai, Thielen, Shimabukuro, Morikawa, Chang, and Nishihara who are all elected officials?

Just because the police are not the ruling body politic does not mean that they are not fascist or their actions exempt from being called fascist for any police brutality they committed on the populace.



The militia was not limited to being a standing army. there are numerous founding fathers who made this explicit in their explanations. George Washington stated “A free people ought not only be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government” No where do they mention the people fighting for the government, but rather to protect themselves from the government itself. James Madison who was initially opposed to the idea also stated, " That a well-regulated militia is the proper, natural and safe defence of a free government".

The militia was never meant to being a standing army for the simple reason they were the militia and the Founding Fathers did not believe in standing armies.  The US Constitution calls for a common defense and, since none of the FF wanted a standing army like that of the British empire they fought against, it was implied the militia and its citizen soldiers would be the ones to rally and defend the nation.

ren

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #97 on: May 29, 2020, 07:42:33 PM »
If what you say is true, how can America label China as a communist regime, when clearly they are not a communist state?

Another separate argument.
You label all police as fascist. They are not all fascist. They are not a fascist organization.
Deeds Not Words

Kuleana

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #98 on: May 29, 2020, 07:58:10 PM »
You label all police as fascist. They are not all fascist. They are not a fascist organization.

First of all, there are a number of very good cops, but that does that mean they are not or do not behave fascistically.

Second, tell that to Groveler.

ren

Re: Police Brutality During Covid-19
« Reply #99 on: May 29, 2020, 08:02:15 PM »
First of all, there are a number of very good cops, but that does that mean they are not or do not behave fascistically.

Second, tell that to Groveler.

Why do you keep falling back on Groveler? This is your argument.
Deeds Not Words