Just an inquiry.
I’m not trolling just a guy interested.

If members put the same effort into discrediting and fact checking Trump as they do Biden, what would the results be ?
What would the thread look like ?

Don’t get me wrong, I think Biden’s lost it. If Biden wins it it will be another Woodrow Wilson. Wife or Kamala Harris will run presidency.
But every coin needs to be looked at from two sides.

Never mind posting Trump’s “great” accomplishments, what are his fallacies ?

(FYI our vote for president doesn’t even count as president declared before our polls close. )

Just an inquiry.
I’m not trolling just a guy interested.

If members put the same effort into discrediting and fact checking Trump as they do Biden, what would the results be ?
What would the thread look like ?

Don’t get me wrong, I think Biden’s lost it. If Biden wins it it will be another Woodrow Wilson. Wife or Kamala Harris will run presidency.
But every coin needs to be looked at from two sides.

Never mind posting Trump’s “great” accomplishments, what are his fallacies ?

(FYI our vote for president doesn’t even count as president declared before our polls close. )

the thread would look like the msm does every day...

Easy. Just watch CNN.

Our members dig WAY deeper.

Biden ban assault weapons and impose mag limits.

Just curious what members would dig up on Trump if they tried.

And to be clear I am NOT anti-Trump.
I just think he lives in a glass house.
And anyone who declares themselves an independent would need to fact check and question both sides.
Republicans and Democrats be damned. ( I sound like groveler [ftp])
(Will I vote for Biden.....Hell to the No.)

I'm not a fan of Trump's demeanor. He is a shrewd businessman. I don't agree with some things he has Tweeted and I can understand the public's expectations of a President's demeanor. I like the results he has produced and that's what I vote on. He is results based, understandably because his background is in business.
Looking at the pool of candidates make me wonder where do we draw from. Who is willing to run for the US Presidential office who has the intellect, the sharp decision making and the ability to stomach the public. I believe that the ideal candidate is one who is not susceptible to being influenced by money (i.e. Clintons and Obama).
There are lots of fact checking and straight up lies with respect to President Trump. The hydroxychloriquine, the Atlantic article, half truths on both sides - its all part of the political spin cycle.
The most valid metric is the results. One term as President, Trump did so much more than Biden's 3 decades as a career politician. Biden's 1st Presidential bid was a total failure and he was decimated by the media's fact checking. Fast forward 30 years later and the media "forgets" all that and heralds him as the antidote to Trump. That's all that matters.

Nobody is glossing over Trump's "shortcomings."  If anything, EVERYBODY has admitted Trump could be a little more diplomatic in his Tweets and cut back on the insults and nicknames.  Maybe you have a messed up memory (alcohol related?).

Trump is not a shitty candidate. 

He kept more promises than the last 4 presidents combined -- and that's in just one term. 
Cite?
He's made progress on the wall, which would be done now if not for Congressional obstruction.
half falling over due to erosion? How much will it cost to fix it ?
He's ushering in peace in a region that has been tagged as where armageddon would start since biblical times.
Peace in Iran, Syria and Yemen ?

He's stopped the threats from North Korea without military action.
No missile testing since his visit ?

He's all but destroyed ISIS.
pulled out and left it to the Turkish  and Kurds to fight it out ?
And amongst each other ?
Assad still in power.  (Much to Russsia’s liking.)
That was a short lived escapade no matter what. 
He sparked the strongest economy in US history.
I’ll give you that but followed by the worst environmental policies and worst employment (COVID era). Also ask the soy bean farmers.
Unemployment has been at record lows.
what are the employment numbers ?

He's done more for minorities than any President since the Civil Rights Act.
Get rid of affirmative action ?
Again, cite?
He's rolled back regulations and taxes, giving people the freedom to invest in and grow businesses.
Which classes / income levels ? Long term?
The list is almost endless.  And, again, this is just the opening act.  Wait until the finale when he wins reelection.

I get it you’ll tell me to do my own homework because you can’t answer a direct question.

Trump didn't divide the country.  You're confusing the problems today with the racial and political divide Obama stoked.
Everything is Obama’s fault. 1/2 true.


In other words, we know what kind of President Trump has been:  effective.  What world are you living in?He's not shitty at all.

As for your homophobia, you should admit it so you can then try to get over it.  I don't have a problem with homosexuality.  For every 2 guys that want to hook up, that leaves two more girls out there still looking for someone.   

Stop looking. You won’t find one. At least not one you won’t drive away or to addiction Trying to get away from you.

I’m not bashing Trump. He’s better than Biden.
But I’ve never seen YouTube videos of the stupid shit Trump says on this forum.
And there are plenty.
Plenty centrist leaning gun owners out there. Just saying.

P.S. I agree with Ren’s statement above. 

I’m not bashing Trump. He’s better than Biden.
But I’ve never seen YouTube videos of the stupid shit Trump says on this forum.
And there are plenty.
Plenty centrist leaning gun owners out there. Just saying.

P.S. I agree with Ren’s statement above. 

You left out how Trump didn't cure cancer, pass laws without Congress or write everyone in the country a personal check for $10,000.

No matter what Trump does, it's never going to be enough for his detractors.

If Trump said, "I love breathing", the TDS crowd would hold their breath until they passed out and then blame Trump when they woke up.

Why are you so concerned with what OTHER members here do not post?  Why aren't YOU sharing these little nuggets?  Do you even know if they exist?

Maybe the "problem" is the rest of us avoid the TDS-riddled content you crave, because we know most of it is 100% BS -- things that are taken out of context or insignificant.

The Biden "gaffs" are one thing.  Most of what is posted on here are not gaffs, but evidence of senility.  That's an actual issue to weigh when considering who to vote for.

I believe you are bashing NOT TRUMP, but the members on here you wish shared your disdain for Trump. 

Maybe you and EEF can get together and have an "Orange Man Bad" pity party.   

Educate yourself -- it's not my job.  Just like teaching a pig to sing is not my job.

https://www.promiseskept.com/

https://www.cbp.gov/border-security/along-us-borders/border-wall-system

An example of how the Leftist media evaluates promises kept by Trump:

Trump:  “Real change begins with immediately repealing and replacing the disaster known as Obamacare."

Even though that's something only Congress can do, Trump has eliminated the IRS penalty for not having health coverage, lowered prescription drug prices, and decreased dependence on government plans indirectly through economic growth by creating jobs, lowering unemployment and making businesses more able to afford better private insurance plans and putting more employees on full time status.

Politifact's analysis:  "Repeal Obamacare ==> promise broken."

It doesn't matter that he's made real, tangible progress, nor that the "promise" was outside of the executive branch's powers.  He's gone further than anyone believed he would.

Every effort Trump initiates gets dragged into court and blocked with injunctions.  Who's working for the people, and who's working against "whatever makes Trump look good?"

Watch the comments and personal attacks.

Just an inquiry.
I’m not trolling just a guy interested.

If members put the same effort into discrediting and fact checking Trump as they do Biden, what would the results be ?
What would the thread look like ?

Don’t get me wrong, I think Biden’s lost it. If Biden wins it it will be another Woodrow Wilson. Wife or Kamala Harris will run presidency.
But every coin needs to be looked at from two sides.

Never mind posting Trump’s “great” accomplishments, what are his fallacies ?

(FYI our vote for president doesn’t even count as president declared before our polls close. )

Are we talking as president or as a person? If we are talking prior to being president then there are whole loads of fallacies.

But if we are just talking as president then I would say his biggest fallacy is being an absolutely terrible leader. There is quite a bit of evidence of at least low level corruption and ethical violations but that aside, he just fails utterly as a leader of the country. He can lead his sheep fans just fine but not the country.

No matter what Trump does, it's never going to be enough for his detractors.

I wonder how many Hitler supports made the same types of claims about Hitler's opponents. Who cares he killed millions of people, look at how he raised the economy in Germany!

I wonder how many Hitler supports made the same types of claims about Hitler's opponents.

So you are making an assertion that the things Trump is doing for the United States is comparable to what Hitler did in the past? 

Are we talking as president or as a person? If we are talking prior to being president then there are whole loads of fallacies.

But if we are just talking as president then I would say his biggest fallacy is being an absolutely terrible leader. There is quite a bit of evidence of at least low level corruption and ethical violations but that aside, he just fails utterly as a leader of the country. He can lead his sheep fans just fine but not the country.

I believe he has lead quite well, and until COVID came up, has lead this country into being great again.  I agree with Ren's statements above.  He is rough, however, he is NOT a politician, neither is he a Republican.  He is an American though, and has proved it, in my opinion.

I wonder how many Hitler supports made the same types of claims about Hitler's opponents. Who cares he killed millions of people, look at how he raised the economy in Germany!

Show me where Trump's actions have resulted in the killing of millions of people.

Take all the time you need.      

So you are making an assertion that the things Trump is doing for the United States is comparable to what Hitler did in the past?

No, not really. Could have been any number of famous examples. Take Michael Jackson fans for example. When he was going to trial for allegations of sexually abusing children. His fans didn't want to believe the negative stuff and didn't like that the media covered it so much.

When some individual has such fans, the fans seem blinded to reality. If someone criticizes their idol it can only be because they are lying detractors. They don't want to believe the bad stuff stat CNN says about Trump so they find a way to justify ignoring it whether they are right or wrong. Take the position and find the evidence to support it rather than the other way around. Objective assessment ceases to exist and holding the line becomes the focus. After all, how could someone so good at music ever harm a child?

I believe he has lead quite well, and until COVID came up, has lead this country into being great again.  I agree with Ren's statements above.  He is rough, however, he is NOT a politician, neither is he a Republican.  He is an American though, and has proved it, in my opinion.

No doubt that Trump has brought some unique characteristics to the position of the president that have allowed him to accomplish certain things. Trump is by no means without accomplishments (even though presidential accomplishments are given fairly liberally). However when I refer to his failure as a leader I am not talking about getting some law signed or program started. By leader I meant someone who could serve as a stable figurehead for the country, someone who can lead both sides despite their differences, someone who could repair division instead of make it worse, someone whose word we could actually trust, someone who we wouldn't always have to worry about what his next tweet would be, someone foreign leaders could rely upon for stability, etc. I apologize if I made this analogy here already but imagine a general who was a savvy tactician and could draw up a great plan of attack but at the same time failed at encouraging and guiding his troops. I hope that helps explain what I meant by his failure as a leader.

Trump's the most investigated President EVER.  He was unsuccessfully impeached over a phone call.

If Trump were Hitler or the Devil, or even a MJ-type pedophile, I think his secret would be out by now.

Simply judging by his children, Trump is a decent person.  Monsters don't raise such independent, capable children into productive, well adjusted adults.

But, if you really want to talk about sycophantic idol worshippers, let's talk about the people who support Bill "A BJ in the Oval Isn't Really Sex" Clinton and his enabling, corrupt, lying spouse, Hildabeast.

If Trump is a tyrant, he's a really horrible one.  Rolling back regulations, quashing the ACA penalty tax, working with state governors to stop riots when he could have used the Insurrection Act, and so on.

All the bad things the TDS sufferers call Trump never seem to materialize through his actions.  They only have their interpretations of his words as evidence.

No doubt that Trump has brought some unique characteristics to the position of the president that have allowed him to accomplish certain things. Trump is by no means without accomplishments (even though presidential accomplishments are given fairly liberally). However when I refer to his failure as a leader I am not talking about getting some law signed or program started. By leader I meant someone who could serve as a stable figurehead for the country, someone who can lead both sides despite their differences, someone who could repair division instead of make it worse, someone whose word we could actually trust, someone who we wouldn't always have to worry about what his next tweet would be, someone foreign leaders could rely upon for stability, etc. I apologize if I made this analogy here already but imagine a general who was a savvy tactician and could draw up a great plan of attack but at the same time failed at encouraging and guiding his troops. I hope that helps explain what I meant by his failure as a leader.

You have a weird fantastical view of what a leader is actually capable of. There is no one in this political climate that can do what you are proposing a “good leader” should be able to do. The lines have been drawn and this country has never been more divided. What Democrat president could unite conservatives? There policies go completely against everything conservatives stand for and vice versa with democrats.

How do you expect Trump to unite people when the media plays his words and calls him a white supremacist for supporting law and order and border security?

You have a weird fantastical view of what a leader is actually capable of. There is no one in this political climate that can do what you are proposing a “good leader” should be able to do. The lines have been drawn and this country has never been more divided. What Democrat president could unite conservatives? There policies go completely against everything conservatives stand for and vice versa with democrats.

How do you expect Trump to unite people when the media plays his words and calls him a white supremacist for supporting law and order and border security?

I don't expect that any president could ever make us all suddenly agree on everything but they can improve the division, or at the very least keep it from getting worse. Trump just pours gas on the fire.

How do I expect Trump to unite when the media plays his words? If Trump's own words are so bad then I don't blame the media for reporting it. MSNBC and CNN didn't turn me off to Trump, his own words and actions did.