Straight to your door?!  NO FFL REQUIRED!!

Does anyone have a list of "TOO OLD FOR FFL" firearms?!?

http://www.classicfirearms.com/long-guns/swiss1889

This may help.

URL: http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/curios-relics.html#definition

Q: What is a firearm curio or relic?

    Firearm curios or relics include firearms which have special value to collectors because they possess some qualities not ordinarily associated with firearms intended for sporting use or as offensive or defensive weapons. To be recognized as curios or relics, firearms must fall within one of the following categories:

        Have been manufactured at least 50 years prior to the current date, but not including replicas thereof; or
        Be certified by the curator of a municipal, State, or Federal museum which exhibits firearms to be curios or relics of museum interest; or
        Derive a substantial part of their monetary value from the fact that they are novel, rare, bizarre, or from the fact of their association with some historical figure, period, or event.

Hope this helps.

Dave

PS: I forgot to add, it still requires an 03 type FFL

Are you talking about c&r guns or older ones then that which don't need a ffl or anything?

If you go on the atf website they have a huge book list thing which states down the c&r guns

 

Are you talking about c&r guns or older ones then that which don't need a ffl or anything?

If you go on the atf website they have a huge book list thing which states down the c&r guns

No FFL required........cause they're too old

You mean Antiques!,,,

I have one of those.

You mean Antiques!,,,

I have one of those.

What does your wife have to do with this subject?   

Oh got it.  Nice rifle. You should click but it now

If it was actually made before 1898 (not just the model number) you don't need an FFL to bring it in and no need for HPD registration. No need to deal with it as a C&R

My bad. I failed to include the bottom portion of the ATF quoted section.

Q: What is a firearm curio or relic?

    Firearm curios or relics include firearms which have special value to collectors because they possess some qualities not ordinarily associated with firearms intended for sporting use or as offensive or defensive weapons. To be recognized as curios or relics, firearms must fall within one of the following categories:

        Have been manufactured at least 50 years prior to the current date, but not including replicas thereof; or
        Be certified by the curator of a municipal, State, or Federal museum which exhibits firearms to be curios or relics of museum interest; or
        Derive a substantial part of their monetary value from the fact that they are novel, rare, bizarre, or from the fact of their association with some historical figure, period, or event.

    [27 CFR 478.11]

Clicking on the 27 CFR 478.11 reveals the rest of what you originally asked.

URL: http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&rgn=div8&view=text&node=27:3.0.1.2.3.2.1.1&idno=27

Of note in that page is the definition of "antique".

Antique firearm. (a) Any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; and (b) any replica of any firearm described in paragraph (a) of this definition if such replica (1) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition, or (2) uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.

IMHO there are several things mentioned here that may or may not meet the definition as printed. However, that does look like a nice piece, even if I don't have the collector gene.

In any event, good luck on your endeavors.

Dave

No such thing.  Any firearm that uses centerfire ammo or rimfire that is still available commercially (pretty much anything ever made) requires a federal license 01,03 or 07 as
Far as I KNOW..

Black powder  non cartridge guns are a free for all at least in HI

No such thing.  Any firearm that uses centerfire ammo or rimfire that is still available commercially (pretty much anything ever made) requires a federal license 01,03 or 07 as
Far as I KNOW..

Black powder  non cartridge guns are a free for all at least in HI

If you read the advertisement for the gun in question. It explicitly tells you not to use any commercially available ammo, it says the firearm is not intended to handle the pressure of modern ammo.

I wonder if that's the reason why they can sell it that way?

I thought this was a thread about Al? 

I'm sorry, but what matters is what it's chambered in.  Secondly, low pressure rounds of almost every caliber are commercially available for Cowboy Action Shooting.

It's unlikely the ATF would accept, "yes, it is chambered in a modern caliber but I don't use modern ammo"

That's like, "yes, it is a machine gun but I never put it in auto"

As usual it's buyer beware but just cover your butt as much as possible.

Be certified by the curator of a municipal, State, or Federal museum which exhibits firearms to be curios or relics of museum interest;

Now, see, you guys should have passed the collection plate around, bought Lanai, established a museum there, appointed KK as curator, and had him certify ARs as curios or relics of museum interest.

Nooooo problem.

Terry, 230RN

If you read the advertisement for the gun in question. It explicitly tells you not to use any commercially available ammo, it says the firearm is not intended to handle the pressure of modern ammo.

I wonder if that's the reason why they can sell it that way?

Back then, everything was still loaded with black powder, smokeless powder like we use for modern cartridge firearms wasnt around yet.  .45-70's are about the best examples out there.