I wasn't accusing you of making up the number, rather I wanted to see you bring in a source as an opening to bring in the context of what that number means and doesn't mean. I see people frequently using such numbers to suggest that covid isn't really killing people. Not saying you were doing that but I have seen others doing that.

then why bring it up in response to my post?

I think people misunderstand just what these numbers mean and I think some have exploited this to give people the impression that covid isn't killing people, only the comorbidities are. The fact that comorbidities are so common doesn't mean that the covid didn't kill the person. If I had terminal cancer and someone shot me through the heart my death certificate might still say cancer even though obviously the bullet killed me. A lot of these comorbidities are things that probably wouldn't have killed the person or at least wouldn't have killed them for many years. Death certificates usually list all conditions a person has when they die, it isn't the doctor saying exactly what killed the person.

I have a heart condition, atrial fibrilation, but the heart doctor says it isn't something to worry about, puts no restrictions on my activities, and doesn't provide medication for it. But if I died with covid tomorrow people would say it wasn't covid because of the comorbidity even though the comorbidity shouldn't have killed me.

On top of that, some of the comorbidities are things caused by covid. So for example covid  can cause pneumonia and on the death certificate both covid and pneumonia would be listed. Claiming that covid didn't kill the person the pneumonia must have would clearly be a flawed argument. Take a look at the list, it even mentions depressive episodes totaling about 1000 deaths. Am I supposed to think that the depression killed the person and not the covid?

But in the end what does it matter if only 6% of people are dying with only covid? Hospitals are still full, many more people are dying annually than non pandemic years, and it doesn't mean covid isn't a risk. It is still killing 1.6% of Americans who catch it and making about 5% (IIRC) of people who catch it serious ill. If the roller coaster operator told me that only 1 out of 100 riders died on the ride I wouldn't get on.

proof?

please show me where i said that was a good thing
the "all causes" death decrease this year almost equals the "covid related" death increase over the "all causes" death figure last year
meaning that the net 2020 plus 2021 "all causes" deaths are about where they were expected to be without "covid related" intervention...

For a while (and maybe still?) there were people who believed covid wasn't real or that it was real but it wasn't killing everyone. The fact that the monthly average deaths rose significantly in America showed that even if covid wasn't killing people, something sure as heck was killing a lot more people than usual.

So are you saying that if you average 2021 total deaths and 2020 deaths it will equal the average death rate before the pandemic (roughly speaking)? Are you reasoning that therefore covid isn't actually killing people more on average? If not what are you concluding?

I looked at a number of graphs but I don't see anything suggesting that 2020 should have fewer deaths than an average year. I did see that covid deaths have been declining in 2020 though.

We should restrict everything since it can affect others. Bananas especially cause someone can slip on a peel and fall and crack their head open.



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Youre avoiding the issue again.

For a while (and maybe still?) there were people who believed covid wasn't real or that it was real but it wasn't killing everyone. The fact that the monthly average deaths rose significantly in America showed that even if covid wasn't killing people, something sure as heck was killing a lot more people than usual.

So are you saying that if you average 2021 total deaths and 2020 deaths it will equal the average death rate before the pandemic (roughly speaking)? Are you reasoning that therefore covid isn't actually killing people more on average? If not what are you concluding?

I looked at a number of graphs but I don't see anything suggesting that 2020 should have fewer deaths than an average year. I did see that covid deaths have been declining in 2020 though.

please show me where i said that

For a while (and maybe still?) there were people who believed covid wasn't real or that it was real but it wasn't killing everyone. The fact that the monthly average deaths rose significantly in America showed that even if covid wasn't killing people, something sure as heck was killing a lot more people than usual.

So are you saying that if you average 2021 total deaths and 2020 deaths it will equal the average death rate before the pandemic (roughly speaking)? Are you reasoning that therefore covid isn't actually killing people more on average? If not what are you concluding?

I looked at a number of graphs but I don't see anything suggesting that 2020 should have fewer deaths than an average year. I did see that covid deaths have been declining in 2020 though.

please show me where i said that

proof?

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality This mentions 1.6% mortality rate

I cannot find a source that specifically states 5%, I think I may have heard that on the radio. I did find one source that showed a hospitalization rate of 2% but that was just for Indiana. Othere states may be higher but I can't find a national average yet.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33729203/

I found this that shows 20% one but it was was Feb to March 2020 which would likely skew numbers since it was right in the beginning.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1105402/covid-hospitalization-rates-us-by-age-group/

please show me where i said that

I didn't say you were making that claim. Note that I specifically asked you to elaborate about certain comments because I didn't want to misunderstand or assume what you meant.

I didn't say you were making that claim. Note that I specifically asked you to elaborate about certain comments because I didn't want to misunderstand or assume what you meant.

then why didn't you just put the middle paragraph and skip the first and last?
i would have merely answered if you didn't try and pontificate in the beginning and the end...

then why didn't you just put the middle paragraph and skip the first and last?
i would have merely answered if you didn't try and pontificate in the beginning and the end...

Wasn't pontificating anything. I like to include context, more detail the better.

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality This mentions 1.6% mortality rate

I cannot find a source that specifically states 5%, I think I may have heard that on the radio. I did find one source that showed a hospitalization rate of 2% but that was just for Indiana. Othere states may be higher but I can't find a national average yet.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33729203/

I found this that shows 20% one but it was was Feb to March 2020 which would likely skew numbers since it was right in the beginning.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1105402/covid-hospitalization-rates-us-by-age-group/

there's a difference between "mortality rate" and "observed case fatality rate"...

Wasn't pontificating anything. I like to include context, more detail the better.

which one reads clearer and would encourage someone to reply?

For a while (and maybe still?) there were people who believed covid wasn't real or that it was real but it wasn't killing everyone. The fact that the monthly average deaths rose significantly in America showed that even if covid wasn't killing people, something sure as heck was killing a lot more people than usual.

So are you saying that if you average 2021 total deaths and 2020 deaths it will equal the average death rate before the pandemic (roughly speaking)? Are you reasoning that therefore covid isn't actually killing people more on average? If not what are you concluding?

I looked at a number of graphs but I don't see anything suggesting that 2020 should have fewer deaths than an average year. I did see that covid deaths have been declining in 2020 though.

OR

So are you saying that if you average 2021 total deaths and 2020 deaths it will equal the average death rate before the pandemic (roughly speaking)? Are you reasoning that therefore covid isn't actually killing people more on average? If not what are you concluding?

Youre avoiding the issue again.

Read into what im saying. It answers ur question.

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https://twitter.com/Rachael_wv/status/1436352364655648769

Seems to fit here.  I'd warn you about language, but I don't care if you are
offended.  I wasn't,  it is what I grew up around.
 

there's a difference between "mortality rate" and "observed case fatality rate"...

I'll admit I had to look up the difference between the two to find the difference. I was just using the term generally since I didn't know there was a specific difference. So I checked the Johns Hopkins website again to see whether it was listing mortality or case fatality. The 1.6% mentioned for the USA is the case fatality ratio.

which one reads clearer and would encourage someone to reply?

For a while (and maybe still?) there were people who believed covid wasn't real or that it was real but it wasn't killing everyone. The fact that the monthly average deaths rose significantly in America showed that even if covid wasn't killing people, something sure as heck was killing a lot more people than usual.

So are you saying that if you average 2021 total deaths and 2020 deaths it will equal the average death rate before the pandemic (roughly speaking)? Are you reasoning that therefore covid isn't actually killing people more on average? If not what are you concluding?

I looked at a number of graphs but I don't see anything suggesting that 2020 should have fewer deaths than an average year. I did see that covid deaths have been declining in 2020 though.

OR

So are you saying that if you average 2021 total deaths and 2020 deaths it will equal the average death rate before the pandemic (roughly speaking)? Are you reasoning that therefore covid isn't actually killing people more on average? If not what are you concluding?

I don't know. My post covered three things total. The middle sentence alone would have addressed all the issues I felt were relevant.

The third line specifically was whether the data you seemed to be referencing to make the statement about averaging was accurate or not.

I'll admit I had to look up the difference between the two to find the difference. I was just using the term generally since I didn't know there was a specific difference. So I checked the Johns Hopkins website again to see whether it was listing mortality or case fatality. The 1.6% mentioned for the USA is the case fatality ratio.

now look up "infection fatality rate"...

I'll admit I had to look up the difference between the two to find the difference. I was just using the term generally since I didn't know there was a specific difference. So I checked the Johns Hopkins website again to see whether it was listing mortality or case fatality. The 1.6% mentioned for the USA is the case fatality ratio.

someone who strives to speak as carefully as you do should have not done that...

People taking a stand

Lol