Let me first start by saying as a position I am absolutely against forced vaccinations (stick) but I support education and carrot type methods to convince people to take the vaccine. Now onto the questions.

1. To those who think mask mandates are unconstitutional:
At what point does a mask mandate become unconstitutional and how is it unconstitutional? What specific part of the constituion prevents a government from mandating a mask or requiring vaccines for employment, school, etc.? Imagine I have Ebola (mortality rate up to 50%) and I go to a no-mask freedom rally, would you support my decision to not wear a mask? If you say yes then I applaud your consistency but I would have to be forced to point out that the consequences could be quite deadly.  If you say no because Ebola is much much more dangerous then my next question is: Where do you draw the line? (What combination of mortality rate and/or spread rate) and how would the constitution justify it where it doesn't justify it for covid?

2. To those who don't want to be vaccinated:
We are seeing many hospitals being pushed to the max in terms of capacity and if the numbers continue to climb we are going to see hospitals triaging patients, deciding which ones to turn away and which ones to treat. So for example does the ER take the patient who has bad covid or the one having a stroke? Does a patient with a cancerous tumor needing surgery get a bed or a covid patient needing a ventilator?  (I am sure you get the idea). The spike in serious covid infections taking up room in hospitals is mostly unvaccinated people so it begs the question of whether those who have chosen to refuse the vaccine should be placed behind those who did. I don't want to judge people who don't want to take the vaccine but if my child were seriously ill or injured and the ER told me to come back the next day because they were full of unvaccinated covid patients I would be livid. So what should be done with people who have chosen to remain unvaccinated if/when this overload occurs?

(Interesting anecdote story of something similar. In one small town on the mainland there was a real problem with heroin overdoses. Ambulances were saving people left and right with the Narcan drug but they were using it so often that it was depleting their budget. The city decided that if they already saved a heroin used from an overdose 3 times they would no longer use the life saving drug that way they could still afford to operate)

1. If it is not a properly fitted N95 then it is a useless virtue signal, and the Constitution protects us from persecution from religious cults and mass psychosis 

2. Probably 80% of the cases in the hospital are vaccinated, but the numbers are fudged to make it appear the other way around. At some point we should be asking ourselves if the vaccinated deserve to be treated in hospitals since they were so reckless with their health by trusting the mainstream media, FDA, and big pharma.

Not to bust balls because you decided to use Ebola as you example. But you contract that disease by exposure to  bodily fluids. It's not airborne. Its a bit harder to get.  Also Ebola has a 50% chance of killing you. Apples / Oranges.

You can go back 200 yrs and from the Spanish Flu til now COVID is one of the least deadly of the 'pandemics' in recent history. There was a run of the mill flu outbreak in the 80s that clocked 3x the number of deaths COVID so far.

Last point is we have had medical procedures/ protocols developed over the past couple hundred years of how to deal with outbreaks of infectious disease and this whole lock down, don't work, mask up, rat out your neighbors send the police after every one is flat out media / government induced panic without any useful medical purpose or supported science and when never done before. Especially not globally.

Never once has medicine told anyone to Quarantine all the healthy people. It's a meme and stupid and horrible one and it has done real psychological damage to a lot of people.

Kids in school  today aren't ever  going to trust science or government by the time they grow up. They know BS when they see it.

Youre under the impression that all who stay there are getting effective treatment. My client was denied stuff like hcq and remdisivr because they were not FDA approved. Just given an 02 tank for a few weeks and fluids (IV). Then sent home. Apparently he was bad enough to be kept there, but still denied any kind of drugs.

So are they truly trying to get people better faster?



Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

As to people filling hospitals, I am sure they are sick, but how sick? Are they keeping them in a bed just because they are infectious and can't let them run loose?

 I started feeling a cold coming on recently, so I went and got tested for COVID. The automatic online check boxes to get an appointment for test and boiler plate info was pretty simple. Take Tylenol, fluids and other cold remedies, get tested and only go to the hospital if you are severely winded after 40 steps. When they tell you test results it says 'negative, but you still might have COVID, stay away from people for 4 days, Tylenol fluids etc.

CDC information came out yesterday said 80% of people Hospitalized and ventilated for COVID had diabetes, obesity issues or both.

The media narrative doesn't match the actual medical advice you get when seeking care.

When the pleas are more emotional rather than logic, but then have to follow the science…

They did quarantines and mask measures for Spanish flu,  small pox and other viruses.   It aint that unique.  Back then people also fought it and lost to the supreme court.   Thankfully during small pox time there were less idiots than today. 

They did not lock down healthy people idiot.

They did not lock down healthy people idiot.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/api.nationalgeographic.com/distribution/public/amp/history/article/how-cities-flattened-curve-1918-spanish-flu-pandemic-coronavirus

Yeah they just closed Churches and other event areas....


www.news18.com/amp/news/buzz/covid-19-didnt-introduce-lockdown-to-the-world-a-look-back-at-the-history-3072605.html

1. If it is not a properly fitted N95 then it is a useless virtue signal, and the Constitution protects us from persecution from religious cults and mass psychosis 

2. Probably 80% of the cases in the hospital are vaccinated, but the numbers are fudged to make it appear the other way around. At some point we should be asking ourselves if the vaccinated deserve to be treated in hospitals since they were so reckless with their health by trusting the mainstream media, FDA, and big pharma.

Your information is not correct on both points.

And this is type of disinformation is the basis for the difficulty in squelching the spread of the virus.

As of yesterday per Green, its 85% vaxxed in the hospital.

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

Your information is not correct on both points.

And this is type of disinformation is the basis for the difficulty in squelching the spread of the virus.

Everyone has been wearing a mask for 18 months, the spread hasnt stopped
70% of the population is vaccinated, the spread hasnt stopped.

Maybe its time to look for different solutions because the current ones arent doing dick?

Let me first start by saying as a position I am absolutely against forced vaccinations (stick) but I support education and carrot type methods to convince people to take the vaccine. Now onto the questions.

1. To those who think mask mandates are unconstitutional:
At what point does a mask mandate become unconstitutional and how is it unconstitutional? What specific part of the constituion prevents a government from mandating a mask or requiring vaccines for employment, school, etc.? Imagine I have Ebola (mortality rate up to 50%) and I go to a no-mask freedom rally, would you support my decision to not wear a mask? If you say yes then I applaud your consistency but I would have to be forced to point out that the consequences could be quite deadly.  If you say no because Ebola is much much more dangerous then my next question is: Where do you draw the line? (What combination of mortality rate and/or spread rate) and how would the constitution justify it where it doesn't justify it for covid?

2. To those who don't want to be vaccinated:
We are seeing many hospitals being pushed to the max in terms of capacity and if the numbers continue to climb we are going to see hospitals triaging patients, deciding which ones to turn away and which ones to treat. So for example does the ER take the patient who has bad covid or the one having a stroke? Does a patient with a cancerous tumor needing surgery get a bed or a covid patient needing a ventilator?  (I am sure you get the idea). The spike in serious covid infections taking up room in hospitals is mostly unvaccinated people so it begs the question of whether those who have chosen to refuse the vaccine should be placed behind those who did. I don't want to judge people who don't want to take the vaccine but if my child were seriously ill or injured and the ER told me to come back the next day because they were full of unvaccinated covid patients I would be livid. So what should be done with people who have chosen to remain unvaccinated if/when this overload occurs?

(Interesting anecdote story of something similar. In one small town on the mainland there was a real problem with heroin overdoses. Ambulances were saving people left and right with the Narcan drug but they were using it so often that it was depleting their budget. The city decided that if they already saved a heroin used from an overdose 3 times they would no longer use the life saving drug that way they could still afford to operate)

#1 Masks don't work.  I used to do jobs that required a respirator to survive the work. any small leak would have jeopardized your life.
Masks leak and you think a virus microns in size won't get out or in??
#2  I choose to be part of the control for this experiment.  It is called doing science.  You get your shots, go for it
I'll roll the dice. Insurance companies tried to recruit me to be an actuary once.  I would not write a life insurance
for you vaccinated people.
 

My Body My Choice

While we explore this rabbit hole of govt intervention in the personal business of my medical well-being maybe they should also mandate this for overweight people before they inundate our hospitals
https://www.khon2.com/news/national/earlier-diabetes-tests-recommended-for-overweight-us-adults/

I think we can agree that you should not get the vaccine if you don’t want it.

And then take some personal responsibility if you get the covid, and stay home and deal with it, and not encumber hospitals with your decision to skip the vaccine. 

I think we can agree that you should not get the vaccine if you don’t want it.

And then take some personal responsibility if you get the covid, and stay home and deal with it, and not encumber hospitals with your decision to skip the vaccine.

There is one of my axioms about life.
"people die in hospitals".

Stay home and die, it is far cheaper.
 

Maybe one good thing to come from this is republicans are starting to see "my body my choice"  perhaps they might start to support abortion rights.  Or they can be hypocrites.

inb4 someone calls me a hypocrite.  Covid isn't only your body.

And then take some personal responsibility if you get the covid, and stay home and deal with it, and not encumber hospitals with your decision to skip the vaccine.

If a rapist is injured while raping, should they also avoid the hospital?  Or how about a chomo, druggy or a drunk driver?  Medical professionals are not supposed to judge people on why they are there, but provide as much care as possible. 

All the examples I provide are also avoidable and made by decisions.  They also affect other people as well.

The bigger picture is have HI hospitals prepared at all since 2020 to handle another wave?  The have added more ICU/Ventilators since then. 

Right now is the new division in our country.  Vaxxed vs. unvaxxed. And guess which side is pushing the issue and wanting segregation and stuff like that.

There is one of my axioms about life.
"people die in hospitals".

Stay home and die, it is far cheaper.
 

Or catch Uber to the hospital.

I think we can agree that you should not get the vaccine if you don’t want it.

And then take some personal responsibility if you get the covid, and stay home and deal with it, and not encumber hospitals with your decision to skip the vaccine.

I agree let's move to personal responsibility. If you are convinced that contact with other humans is putting your health and safety at risk then YOU should stay home, if you are certain that a mask will save you from catching an infection than YOU should wear one at all times. And if you think going to work is something  that will increase your chances of injury and death then YOU need to figure out another way to pay your rent and feed yourself. And let's give back responsibility to actual physicians to choose drugs and treatment for their patients instead of letting the government dictate options.



Also personal responsibility doesn't end just because you submitted to the will of a government, Nuremberg trials proved that.