Ukraine vs. Russia (Read 336643 times)

Kuleana

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1540 on: November 20, 2024, 01:08:21 PM »
Does this war prove that Russia is NOT one of the most powerful armies in the world as was previously thought?

Because they sure are having a hard time.  It's not like they are fighting a war overseas with the logistics of sending men, weapons, and supplies thousands of miles away.

They are literally fighting their neighbor.  WTF.
The Russian Federation is not fighting Ukraine alone but the US empire and NATO's contribution of financial and military resources short of direct intervention.  Take that contribution out of the equation and Russia would have won this war already.

Kuleana

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1541 on: November 20, 2024, 01:09:44 PM »
Biden's peaceful transition:


The way things are going, the World will be lucky to make it to January 20th of next year.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1542 on: November 20, 2024, 01:14:17 PM »
Seeing how you did not believe or was even aware that the Ukrainian war is a proxy war instigated by the US empire, I guess your source of information is also questionable and at the very least parroting the pro-US anti-Russian propaganda as well.

That's not a rebuttal.

Look up ad hominem.  Hint: It's not a rap artist.

You've now made a claim (albeit a "guess").  Where is your evidence that my source of information is "questionable?"

I used a reliable 3rd party to show your source sucks.  Where is your evidence for your claim?
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Kuleana

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1543 on: November 20, 2024, 01:18:14 PM »
I used a reliable 3rd party to show your source sucks.  Where is your evidence for your claim?
Reliable 3rd Party?  According to whom?  You?

If you don't agree with the source that's on you.

Do you support the US imperial proxy war in Ukraine and please have the decency of giving me a yes or no answer.

macsak

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1544 on: November 20, 2024, 01:21:17 PM »
i'm only useful if someone breaks a toof...

With the tremendous loss of life from both sides of the Ukrainian war, someone of his talents would be of great use at the battlefront.

For the Ukrainians at this point, I don't think Ukraine cares about the background of the people they send to the Russian meat grinder.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1545 on: November 20, 2024, 01:27:53 PM »
Reliable 3rd Party?  According to whom?  You?

If you don't agree with the source that's on you.

Do you support the US imperial proxy war in Ukraine and please have the decency of giving me a yes or no answer.

LOL!!

Again, no evidence to support your assertions. 

Media Bias/Fact Check and Newsguard are respected sources which evaluate the trustworthiness of information published by known journalism websites.

While not perfect, they have a high rate of success in accurately analyzing and evaluating information sources.

Don't agree?  You're entitled to your opinion?  Too bad your opinions are just that -- not fact.

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Kuleana

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1546 on: November 20, 2024, 01:29:11 PM »
LOL!!

Again, no evidence to support your assertions. 

Media Bias/Fact Check and Newsguard are respected sources which evaluate the trustworthiness of information published by known journalism websites.

While not perfect, they have a high rate of success in accurately analyzing and evaluating information sources.

Don't agree?  You're entitled to your opinion?  Too bad your opinions are just that -- not fact.
That's fine.

You forgot to answer my question though, do you support the US imperial proxy war in Ukraine and please have the decency of giving me a yes or no answer.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1547 on: November 20, 2024, 01:32:23 PM »
That's fine.

You forgot to answer my question though, do you support the US imperial proxy war in Ukraine and please have the decency of giving me a yes or no answer.

I support no wars.  i do, however, support the defense of a nation's sovereignty and borders.

Russia was the aggressor.  You can rattle off as many US Empire reasons for Russia starting a war, but the truth matters.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

changemyoil66

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1548 on: November 20, 2024, 01:52:37 PM »
With the tremendous loss of life from both sides of the Ukrainian war, someone of his talents would be of great use at the battlefront.

For the Ukrainians at this point, I don't think Ukraine cares about the background of the people they send to the Russian meat grinder.

No it won't as it's proven that dentist would TQ someone's neck to stop a leg from bleeding out. It's because they're not real doctors.

changemyoil66

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1549 on: November 20, 2024, 01:55:50 PM »
Does this war prove that Russia is NOT one of the most powerful armies in the world as was previously thought?

Because they sure are having a hard time.  It's not like they are fighting a war overseas with the logistics of sending men, weapons, and supplies thousands of miles away.

They are literally fighting their neighbor.  WTF.

In the early stages, I thought Russia was holding back.  But since it's been more than a year, Russia isn't holding back.  Before the war, some of their big ticket equipment wasn't working.  This is a common Russia problem. Like they have X subs, but how many are actually operational?  I get that stuff breaks so being 100% is difficult, but they way too far from that to claim that random stuff is breaking by chance.

But don't let the above fool anyone, invading Russia would still be a very bad idea as history has proved that over and over.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1550 on: November 20, 2024, 02:16:46 PM »
In the early stages, I thought Russia was holding back.  But since it's been more than a year, Russia isn't holding back.  Before the war, some of their big ticket equipment wasn't working.  This is a common Russia problem. Like they have X subs, but how many are actually operational?  I get that stuff breaks so being 100% is difficult, but they way too far from that to claim that random stuff is breaking by chance.

But don't let the above fool anyone, invading Russia would still be a very bad idea as history has proved that over and over.

The Soviet Union was a Global Super Power until Dec 26, 1991.  Merry Christmas!

Since then, with many states declaring independence from the new Russian government, Russia has in many estimates devolved into a 3rd World Country.

Energy and wheat exports have kept them afloat, but the Ukrainian war is taking its toll.

Much of the Cold War military apparatus was dismantled and sold to other countries.  After they lost the Cold War, they couldn't afford the massive military they once boasted.  In fact, the Cold War ended primarily because Ronald Reagan began increasing US military budgets to a level the USSR was unable to keep up with. 

The last major war the USSR fought was a 10-year war in Afghanistan (1979-1989), which they lost.

Russia is currently involved in 5 wars.  Two of them are against Al-Qaeda.

Russia/USSR has been at war with someone almost continuously since the mid 800s (not 1800s, but 800s).  My math tells me they've been fighting off and on for 1,194 years give or take.  Finding a way out of a war with Russia that doesn't involve surrender or some sort of appeasement is short-sighted.

By comparison, the US fought for its independence against Great Brittain a mere 249 years ago.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

astroboy

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1551 on: November 20, 2024, 02:22:13 PM »
The Russian economy is in serious trouble. Mortgages at 30%, and the ruble to dollar exchange
rate is about to take a huge turn for the worse. Are they going to pay people in potatoes and vodka?
Oleks spoke about a Russian proverb: There is no such thing as an ugly woman if you have enough vodka.
There is no such thing as a bad economy if you have enough vodka.

Ivan speaks on the Russian economy.


 

changemyoil66

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1552 on: November 20, 2024, 02:29:03 PM »
The Soviet Union was a Global Super Power until Dec 26, 1991.  Merry Christmas!

Since then, with many states declaring independence from the new Russian government, Russia has in many estimates devolved into a 3rd World Country.

Energy and wheat exports have kept them afloat, but the Ukrainian war is taking its toll.

Much of the Cold War military apparatus was dismantled and sold to other countries.  After they lost the Cold War, they couldn't afford the massive military they once boasted.  In fact, the Cold War ended primarily because Ronald Reagan began increasing US military budgets to a level the USSR was unable to keep up with. 

The last major war the USSR fought was a 10-year war in Afghanistan (1979-1989), which they lost.

Russia is currently involved in 5 wars.  Two of them are against Al-Qaeda.

Russia/USSR has been at war with someone almost continuously since the mid 800s (not 1800s, but 800s).  My math tells me they've been fighting off and on for 1,194 years give or take.  Finding a way out of a war with Russia that doesn't involve surrender or some sort of appeasement is short-sighted.

By comparison, the US fought for its independence against Great Brittain a mere 249 years ago.

A few years ago at DEFCON, I spoke to a few well known hackers.  They stated that the tech in Russian nuke missiles were from the 80's. Which in the digital hacking world, is a plus for them as it's considered analog tech and harder to hack into. Whether this was on purpose or not is another story.  I never looked into this as I didn't want the search history on my computer.

Kuleana

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1553 on: November 20, 2024, 03:11:47 PM »
I support no wars.  i do, however, support the defense of a nation's sovereignty and borders.
Are the goalposts being moved?

As a self-considered Hawaiian that you proclaimed in a post to me earlier then, you must be in favor of the restoration of the Hawaiian nation state that was illegally annexed and still currently being illegally occupied by the US empire since 1898.   :shaka:



Russia was the aggressor.  You can rattle off as many US Empire reasons for Russia starting a war, but the truth matters.
How can you on one side support all of the illegal wars, invasions, and occupations the US empire has partaken in your lifetime against Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan, etc. and condemn the Russians that you feel is doing the same to Ukraine?


Flapp_Jackson

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1554 on: November 20, 2024, 03:50:33 PM »
Are the goalposts being moved?

As a self-considered Hawaiian that you proclaimed in a post to me earlier then, you must be in favor of the restoration of the Hawaiian nation state that was illegally annexed and still currently being illegally occupied by the US empire since 1898.   :shaka:


How can you on one side support all of the illegal wars, invasions, and occupations the US empire has partaken in your lifetime against Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan, etc. and condemn the Russians that you feel is doing the same to Ukraine?

Goal posts moved?  You're asking me?  Yes they have, but i've ignored it since you need all the advantages you can find.

Hawaii lost.  The USA won.  Get over it.  You don't have to like it, but you can't deny it.  In fact, you don't deny it.  You admitted over and over the annexation happened -- just that you think it was illegal.

Why would the US restore the "Hawaiian nation-state" when the Hawaiian nation-state chose to capitulate rather than fight annexation?  You had a choice THEN.  NOW, in reality, Hawaii is a US state.  Done.  Period.  End of story.

Hawaii is no longer a sovereign nation or monarchy but a US state.  Illegal or legal, the annexation happened.  Unless Hawaii wants to be the aggressor and fight a war with the US for their independence the way American colonists did against the British Empire, any comparison between Hawaii and Ukraine is moot.  Current reality trumps historical loses of kingdoms.  Should we go back in time and give back every plot of land that was ever taken by any nation through threat of force? should we bestow sovereignty to every conquered, discovered or annexed former nation which didn't like their fate? 

The military option for restoring a Hawaiian Kingdom no longer exists.  Move on.  Find a legal battle you can win instead.  But rehashing how it was an illegal annexation is not going to resolve anything unless you can get the feds to somehow agree to un-annex Hawaii.  Good luck with that.

I don't see Great Britain whining about the US using force to obtain their independence and saying they should somehow regain control of the colonies here.


The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

rpoL98

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1555 on: November 20, 2024, 04:21:56 PM »
In the early stages, I thought Russia was holding back.  But since it's been more than a year, Russia isn't holding back.  Before the war, some of their big ticket equipment wasn't working.  This is a common Russia problem. Like they have X subs, but how many are actually operational?  I get that stuff breaks so being 100% is difficult, but they way too far from that to claim that random stuff is breaking by chance.

But don't let the above fool anyone, invading Russia would still be a very bad idea as history has proved that over and over.
from what i've seen, at the beginning, their equipment wasn't worth a damn, compared to western kit.  They really got the short end of the deal with the chinese tires, and chinese grease seals.  those lasted 2 days.  Maybe some defense contractors, contracting officers got hauled in front of firing squads?  vacay to Gulag?

it seems the battlefield is creating the necessity for improvement.  their air defense systems today, are much better than they were 2 years ago, however still falls far short of american systems.  They are apparently now able to intercept ATACMS, just not all of them, yet.  They have innovated on the battlefield also.  for instance fiber optic FPV drones, can't be jammed.  They've figured out laser-guided artillery, using FPV drones to lase the target.  and their small unit tactics are also evolving to suit conditions, e.g. infantry on dirt bikes and ATVs is becoming common, not just a Special Forces tactic.  I see riders in the back of pickups with semi-auto shotguns, facing backwards, as primitive anti-drone defense.  and the now-famous russian turtle-tanks.  people laughed, how ridiculous, then they quickly started copying.  Couldn't copy them fast enough.

Russia is now equipping the drones with cellphone or wifi hot-spots or something, so that it can vacuum up cell phone data, usage, and imagery (e.g. trench locations) as the drone is on its' way to the target.  That's one clever way to collect electronic intel for follow-on targeting, locations of troop concentrations, etc.  They even adjust the drone routes to optimize this.

what's interesting, if I look at Funker530, and Telegram, most of the posted videos are of successful Ukrainian drone attacks, armored assault.  Judging from that, Ukraine is clearly winning the war, easily.  But the maps are undeniable, Russia is gaining territory in leaps and bounds.  From what I see, the M2 Bradley is proving its' worth better than the M1A1 Abrams.

Yeah, they are throwing a shit-ton of bodies at the front, humongous losses, but for the size of Russia, apparently they can afford it.  I think the guesstimated number is something like a thousand KIA per day, maybe 1,500.  and Ukraine is running out of manpower, but still yet refuses to draft 18YO to 25YO.  They need 500,000, they're at 160,000.  somewhat short there, eh?  US drafted 18YO for piddly-assed Viet Nam, Ukraine needs to ante-up, go all-in, or shut-up, stop yakking about the battle for existential survival (all talk, no action), and take the deal.  doesn't make sense for US to provide weapons if Ukraine isn't going to provide the persons to carry those weapons.  They'll just get stock-piled and sold on the black market.  Even Zelinsky himself went from being a broke-assed comedian to a multi-millionaire, with mansions in foreign countries, yachts.  Same ilk as Pelosi.  Always that "using the positions of political power for personal enrichment", same as Hawaii politicians.

USA gets squeamish when it gets over tens per year, or hundreds combat losses.  But a thousand PER DAY?  Democrats would gladly pass a bill to make it mandatory for schools to teach chinese from kindergarten on up, and pledge fealty to Chairman Xi.

it seems lopsided video being posted also implies that Russia is locking down their information space somewhat effectively.  I see a lot of Ukraine FPV grenade-drops on Russians (savage, brutal), than vice versa.  Either it's not happening, or it's locked down.  from watching the FPV drone savage butchery, I can actually understand why advancing front-line russian soldiers would execute ukrainian drone operators on the spot if they run across them.  I can understand their sentiment.  Apparently the rules of war haven't yet been written for drone warfare.  That doesn't make it right, but war is hell.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2024, 04:32:12 PM by rpoL98 »

changemyoil66

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1556 on: November 20, 2024, 04:44:23 PM »
This is Russia's fighting style since at least WW2. Throw enough bodies at the target and hope it works. If your troops retreat, they get shot. 

What Russia saw with shit equipment was those in control stealing it and selling or buying cheap and pocketing. Like the fake bodyarmor vids.

On Iwo Jima (WW2) their plan was to make the US squimish for all the losses that they would give up as that's the American spirit to break.  Today, it would take less losses since we haven't had Vietnam type losses in decades.  As in not the total war losses, but daily, weekly type losses.

Q

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1557 on: November 20, 2024, 04:44:33 PM »
Are the goalposts being moved?

As a self-considered Hawaiian that you proclaimed in a post to me earlier then, you must be in favor of the restoration of the Hawaiian nation state that was illegally annexed and still currently being illegally occupied by the US empire since 1898.   :shaka:

Just curious about something off topic.


How many Hawaiian nationals who have been "forcibly" bestowed with US citizenships have officially renounced them? I ask because Keanu Sai dodged answering the same question and neither he nor any of his followers accepted my challenge to officially renounce their US citizenship. Even when I offered to pay for their trip to initiate the process, not one if them has accepted.

Kuleana

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1558 on: November 20, 2024, 08:37:26 PM »
Hawaii lost.  The USA won.  Get over it.  You don't have to like it, but you can't deny it.  In fact, you don't deny it.  You admitted over and over the annexation happened -- just that you think it was illegal.
Although the Hawaiian Kingdom government was overthrown, the Hawaiian nation state did not lose its sovereignty since there was no legal treaty of annexation.  Consequently, the US empire is still illegally occupying Hawaii based on US Constitutional Law.

It is you that have no evidence to prove your opinion that the US empire's occupation of Hawaii is legal under US Constitutional law.



Why would the US restore the "Hawaiian nation-state" when the Hawaiian nation-state chose to capitulate rather than fight annexation?
Hawaiian nationals did fight back via the Kue Petition and that's why there was no US Constitutionally legal treaty of annexation.   BTW, the truth of the current occupation of Hawaii is spreading throughout the American education system and will never be forgotten especially at the school that dons the name of the US president who sanctioned the illegal annexation in 1898.





You had a choice THEN.  NOW, in reality, Hawaii is a US state.  Done.  Period.  End of story.
It may the end of the story for you, but not for Hawaiian nationals who will always know and educate others the truth.



The military option for restoring a Hawaiian Kingdom no longer exists.  Move on.  Find a legal battle you can win instead.  But rehashing how it was an illegal annexation is not going to resolve anything unless you can get the feds to somehow agree to un-annex Hawaii.  Good luck with that.
There are no military solutions as of yet, but with the ever-rapid decline of US empire, it may not be necessary.

Much like the Zionists rehashing how the lands of present-day Israel were historically theirs, Hawaiians keeping the truth alive is necessary when the day the US empire de-occupies Hawaii willingly or unwillingly.


 :stopjack:

Now then, back to the US imperial proxy war against Russia.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2024, 08:46:10 PM by Kuleana »

Kuleana

Re: Ukraine vs. Russia
« Reply #1559 on: November 20, 2024, 08:45:11 PM »
Unless Hawaii wants to be the aggressor and fight a war with the US for their independence the way American colonists did against the British Empire, any comparison between Hawaii and Ukraine is moot.
Nice job of convoluting my initial question and deflecting to avoid answering that question which did not reference Hawaii at all.

Once again, how can you on one side support all of the illegal wars, invasions, and occupations the US empire has partaken in your lifetime against Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan, etc. and condemn the Russians that you feel is doing the same to Ukraine?
« Last Edit: November 20, 2024, 08:51:17 PM by Kuleana »