I saw one report talking about how we had 200 mass shootings this year and when I looked into the data one was in Hawaii, it was the shooting on the west side where a guy killed someone trying to rob him. 4 people were shot total so they called it a mass shooting but it was a gunfight between a robber and a normal citizen.  2 bad guys and 2 good guys. Only one bad guy died.

The reports nationwide there are way more than 200 mass shootings annually.  I mean a typical weekend in Chiraq probably has at least 4 (guesstimation).  And I'm sure HI had more than 1 last year.  you would have to look at all the shooting incidents and see if there are more than a total of 4 people involved.

You are conflating two different issues though. Those top 3 you listed were terrorist attacks, very different than our problem with mass shootings the USA.

Goal post moving business may be back.

Goal post moving business may be back.

Yeah.  We need to also stop conflating drug overdoses from heroin with those from fentanyl-laced heroin.

Apples and oranges.   


Totally ignored the point.  Terrorists are not any different from a school shooter raised in the US.  They both think they have a statement to make, and mass murder is how they intend to make it.

I guess if all our mass shootings in the US could be tied to terrorism, we could then breathe a sigh of relief. Problem solved!

I guess if all our mass shootings in the US could be tied to terrorism, we could then breath a sigh of relief. Problem solved!

They would still go after our guns.  Poddock wasn't the shooter in Vegas...#tinfoil.

We want to solve gun violence....but only the kind that effects WHITE PEOPLE

Democrats are obviously not as far off the plantation mentality as they would like the rest of us to believe.

The reports nationwide there are way more than 200 mass shootings annually.  I mean a typical weekend in Chiraq probably has at least 4 (guesstimation).  And I'm sure HI had more than 1 last year.  you would have to look at all the shooting incidents and see if there are more than a total of 4 people involved.

The usual standard is 4 or more killed but this number used 4 or more injured, that's why the Hawaii one was included. There may be more than one Hawaii incident but this one stood out because of the way the incident was.misrepresented.

Yeah.  We need to also stop conflating drug overdoses from heroin with those from fentanyl-laced heroin.

Apples and oranges.   


Totally ignored the point.  Terrorists are not any different from a school shooter raised in the US.  They both think they have a statement to make, and mass murder is how they intend to make it.

I guess if all our mass shootings in the US could be tied to terrorism, we could then breathe a sigh of relief. Problem solved!

If you can't tell the difference between a terrorist group with a political cause/agenda and school/work/etc shooters with mental health issues then you have no business on commenting on the topic. They are worlds apart and lumping in terrorist killings to school shooters to make school shooters seem not as much a problem is useless.

If you can't tell the difference between a terrorist group with a political cause/agenda and school/work/etc shooters with mental health issues then you have no business on commenting on the topic. They are worlds apart and lumping in terrorist killings to school shooters to make school shooters seem not as much a problem is useless.

One very tiny and rare subset of crimes can be used as an argument to strip rights away from law abiding citizens. The others demonstrate why those rights are essential. Not sure who you think you are fooling here.

If you can't tell the difference between a terrorist group with a political cause/agenda and school/work/etc shooters with mental health issues then you have no business on commenting on the topic. They are worlds apart and lumping in terrorist killings to school shooters to make school shooters seem not as much a problem is useless.

Are you telling me that a terrorist (often teenagers) killing people (including children) in a public place is totally different than an evil, deranged teen killing people in a public place?

What planet are you from?  Dead is dead.  Evil is evil.  A mass shooting event is a mass shooting event.

You think the victims are going to care who killed them?  Their families?  Their friends?

If you implement armed security, you think they will only stop one kind of lethal threat over others?

One very tiny and rare subset of crimes can be used as an argument to strip rights away from law abiding citizens. The others demonstrate why those rights are essential. Not sure who you think you are fooling here.

Yeah.  He wants to exclude terrorist-related mass shootings, even though the AUTHORITATIVE SOURCE saw fit to include them.

He pretends *I* created that list, just so he can argue.  He can't seem to do anything but argue over minor points.

1 officer who was in the hallway has a wife who called him saying shes been shot and is dying. He wanted to go in, instead of waiting. This cop had to be detained and his gun taken away.

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1 officer who was in the hallway has a wife who called him saying shes been shot and is dying. He wanted to go in, instead of waiting. This cop had to be detained and his gun taken away.

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This is so sad.  :

Did his wife pass away?  If so, how sad and I wonder how he is dealing with this.

This is so sad.  :

Did his wife pass away?  If so, how sad and I wonder how he is dealing with this.

I'm afraid there would be a lot of dead cops if that had been me.
 

I'm afraid there would be a lot of dead cops if that had been me.
 

The hearings today are bringing to light a lot of things we already knew which were downplayed.

The guy that was supposed to have been the commander on the scene is giving his testimony in a private hearing -- go figure.  I guess that's one step removed from pleading the 5th.

Testimony confirmed that the Cops arrived on scene quickly, and they had the manpower and equipment needed to terminate the threat within 3 minutes of arriving.

Yet, they stayed outside, waiting for "someone" to give the order to breach.

That classroom door they said they were waiting on the keys to be able to open?  It was never locked.  In fact, it wasn't able to be locked.  Maybe that's why there were no keys for it?  Nobody from outside even tried to open it just to see if they could.

"Cluster F**k" doesn't begin to describe ...

The hearings today are bringing to light a lot of things we already knew which were downplayed.

The guy that was supposed to have been the commander on the scene is giving his testimony in a private hearing -- go figure.  I guess that's one step removed from pleading the 5th.

Testimony confirmed that the Cops arrived on scene quickly, and they had the manpower and equipment needed to terminate the threat within 3 minutes of arriving.

Yet, they stayed outside, waiting for "someone" to give the order to breach.

That classroom door they said they were waiting on the keys to be able to open?  It was never locked.  In fact, it wasn't able to be locked.  Maybe that's why there were no keys for it?  Nobody from outside even tried to open it just to see if they could.

"Cluster F**k" doesn't begin to describe ...

Security footage shows no one touching the doors to see if they were locked or not. Per Director McGraw, the doors also do not lock from the inside, only the outside by key.

Reminds me of the fail vid of the cop pushing on the glass door and unable to get in. The guy next to him pulls the door open.

*Edit

Also they're trying hard to not release the bodycam footage. #noteverythingisaconspiracy

Someone mentioned earlier that this incident is like the "Perfect Storm" of mass shootings.  Everything that could go wrong went wrong.

So sad.

Could there even be such a thing as "over training?"  What I mean is they train so much for everything and every scenario that when the time comes they freeze.  Or pause.

I remember it mentioned that they were trying to assess if it was a barricade incident or an active shooter incident.  I guess the protocols and actions taken are different with the two.

Someone mentioned earlier that this incident is like the "Perfect Storm" of mass shootings.  Everything that could go wrong went wrong.

So sad.

Could there even be such a thing as "over training?"  What I mean is they train so much for everything and every scenario that when the time comes they freeze.  Or pause.

I remember it mentioned that they were trying to assess if it was a barricade incident or an active shooter incident.  I guess the protocols and actions taken are different with the two.

The center pole of this perfect storm WAS the training they had.  They apparently instilled a sense of centralized control as the scenario begins, meaning one person gives the orders, and everyone else waits to be told what to do.

The better policy already exists:  first people on the scene must make contact with the gunman, attempt to stop the killing, and try to extract/give first aid to the injured.

When seconds count, the police are waiting an hour outside until they are told to enter building by the chain of command -- even if the top of the chain doesn't have his radio.

Regarding the topic brought up by EEF about stating not all librals/left/DNC want to ban the 2a. Well SCOTUS ruled and EveryTown had a zoom meeting. They stated they will try with all their might to find ways to work around this ruling. And that they have the "peoples" best interest in mind and hold the power to do so.  They are also going to be using cherry picked date that have no evidence or references to back them up to show that "blood baths will happen" due to this ruling.  So they're predicting the future.

Now this is just 1 of the 3 top anti 2a orgs. I can image MDA and Giffords are doing the same thing.