We were just talking then all of a sudden the subject of CCW arose.... (Read 3436 times)

changemyoil66

Re: We were just talking then all of a sudden the subject of CCW arose....
« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2023, 08:42:20 AM »
The hard part is that most people cannot use rational to change their minds or give them something to think about.  Emotion and the fake news is a powerful weapon.  Same goes with TDS. So it depends how open the other person is.

What I do instead is to ask questions or give points that they cannot say no to. Like " so you would support a rapist not being shot by their victim and being able to rape without worry".  If they say yes, then they look like a fool to anyone listening.  What may happen is they reply " the gun can be taken away and used against her".  Then I reply, well, then she's in the same situation.  But at least she had a fighting chance against a bigger stronger attacker.  Then add in it takes 1.5 seconds to draw and fire.  and throw in a woman 5'1 95 lbs vs a 6'0 300 lbs attacker.

Or "so HPD approved the course teachings and made up the annual shooting requirements, are you saying HPD is incompetent or cannot be trusted?"

Basically try to be passive aggressive.  And is someone really wants to have an open discussion, then I ask prior to if they're willing to listen to LOGIC. And if they say no, then I say "well then, there's no point in discussing because no amount of logic or reasoning will change your opinion".

The issue would be at a family gathering and letting them win by staying silent as not to interrupt or spoil the event.

spicynoodle_1

Re: We were just talking then all of a sudden the subject of CCW arose....
« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2023, 01:23:26 PM »
And obviously this person seemed like a "Karen".  Definitely anti-gun.  Started ranting about how Hawaii will change forever and that every person with a gun is a murderous, blood thirsty, mass shooter.

And I've stated here before that I am a "below the radar" type of guy.  I believe that when it comes to firearms, the less people know about me the better.  I believe no one needs to know I'm packing heat if or when I decide to apply for a license and do so.

Anyway I said nothing.  Corrected her a couple of times about the subject when it was obvious she got the information wrong about CCW rules and regulations as set forth by the Chief.  But otherwise tried to remain as neutral as possible.  Everyone is entitled to their opinions. 

I did tell her I believe in the Constitution of the United States and left it at that.  After a while the conversation drifted to something else.  I think she sensed I didn't agree with her when I stated about the constitution.

This was an in-law by the way.  So not a stranger but "family".  Even in my family, only my immediate family knows about my firearms ownership.  And they vowed to respect my request about my firearm ownership anonymity.

How would you guys handle this kind of situation?

I never try to debate opinions.  In other words, I never try to change a persons mind or opinion using my own opinions.  I like to stick to factual statements, like hard statistics.  And I leave it at that.  We usually agree to disagree.  Now football, on the other hand, is a subject that I get very heated over…. Another place and time tho…

changemyoil66

Re: We were just talking then all of a sudden the subject of CCW arose....
« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2023, 01:51:39 PM »
I never try to debate opinions.  In other words, I never try to change a persons mind or opinion using my own opinions.  I like to stick to factual statements, like hard statistics.  And I leave it at that.  We usually agree to disagree.  Now football, on the other hand, is a subject that I get very heated over…. Another place and time tho…

The hard part is feelings are greater than stats/logic.

Example: "Assault weapons" and all long guns (bolt action/single shot) added together  kill about 300 people a year (per FBI/CDC).  Hammers about 600.  Yet anti gunner doesn't want to ban hammers.  Just for kicks, golf clubs are about 200 a year.

groveler

Re: We were just talking then all of a sudden the subject of CCW arose....
« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2023, 02:54:37 PM »
You're just as enslaved as the rest of us - just by yourself
I'm pretty sure NOT!
I pretty much do as I damn well please.
Legally of course.
Keep in mind it is not a crime till you
are caught and convicted,
 :shaka:

drck1000

Re: We were just talking then all of a sudden the subject of CCW arose....
« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2023, 03:57:48 PM »
The hard part is feelings are greater than stats/logic.

Example: "Assault weapons" and all long guns (bolt action/single shot) added together  kill about 300 people a year (per FBI/CDC).  Hammers about 600.  Yet anti gunner doesn't want to ban hammers.  Just for kicks, golf clubs are about 200 a year.
It's worse.  It's near impossible to counter feelings.  Most times they are irrationally based and can't be countered with reason.  Like mentioned above, I don't really try to change minds.  However, it's usually easy to point out inconsistencies or flat out lunacy of some of the feelings with follow-up questions on why, basis, source, etc. 

Check out the arguments on effectiveness of banning of firearms in Australia.  Facts, data, etc be damned. . . nevermind that violent crime has been on a steady increase since the ban. . . but the MSM never includes those data points.  wonder why. . .

Flapp_Jackson

Re: We were just talking then all of a sudden the subject of CCW arose....
« Reply #25 on: January 03, 2023, 04:13:39 PM »
Why is it easier to fool someone than convince them they have been fooled?
Quote
Good ole psychology.

Self serving bias is a psychological phenomenon that protects the ego and boosts your self esteem.
Simply, your brain lies to you so your feelings won’t get hurt. When your brain forms an idea, it looks
for evidence, sometimes creating that evidence, to support the idea.

Ironically, this same phenomenon allows people to easily be fool[ed]. Once a person is convinced, self
serving bias kicks in to protect their decision and provide evidence to support it.
https://www.quora.com/Why-is-it-easier-to-fool-someone-than-convince-them-they-have-been-fooled?share=1
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

eyeeatingfish

Re: We were just talking then all of a sudden the subject of CCW arose....
« Reply #26 on: January 04, 2023, 09:09:52 PM »
And obviously this person seemed like a "Karen".  Definitely anti-gun.  Started ranting about how Hawaii will change forever and that every person with a gun is a murderous, blood thirsty, mass shooter.

And I've stated here before that I am a "below the radar" type of guy.  I believe that when it comes to firearms, the less people know about me the better.  I believe no one needs to know I'm packing heat if or when I decide to apply for a license and do so.

Anyway I said nothing.  Corrected her a couple of times about the subject when it was obvious she got the information wrong about CCW rules and regulations as set forth by the Chief.  But otherwise tried to remain as neutral as possible.  Everyone is entitled to their opinions. 

I did tell her I believe in the Constitution of the United States and left it at that.  After a while the conversation drifted to something else.  I think she sensed I didn't agree with her when I stated about the constitution.

This was an in-law by the way.  So not a stranger but "family".  Even in my family, only my immediate family knows about my firearms ownership.  And they vowed to respect my request about my firearm ownership anonymity.

How would you guys handle this kind of situation?

Sounds like a good exchange. Didn't really get far with her but it didn't sound negative so I would guess the door is still open for future conversations.