Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter (Read 16411 times)

eyeeatingfish

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #40 on: December 20, 2023, 10:29:08 PM »
Are you making up terms now?  That's an oxymoron, moron.

You either make a statement, or you indirectly imply something.  You can't indirectly state anything!  LOL!!

You'd be funny if you weren't so annoying.

False assumptions?  Which ones are false?  You have proof?

And why would the study need to have a separate category for mass shooters?  Are they somehow different than murderers with lower body counts?  Some ATTEMPTED mass shooters were stopped before they reached the requisite number to be classified a mass shooting.  Which category do you put them in?

You're moving the posts again, trying to make what I POSTED (not stated) irrelevant based on your irrelevant criteria.

Lame.


That is your rebuttal? You are going to go grammar technicality after I showed your claims to be wrong? Ok, sure, i'll give you that freebie.

Yes, false assumption. You stated "Show me a mass murderer, and i'll show you a psychopath." You couldn't produce evidence to show all mass murderers were psychopaths and could only produce evidence that murderers on average are higher than the normal population for psychopathy. You didn't even show this data applied to mass shooters (I checked your article, none of them mentioned mass shooters). Then on top of that I gave you evidence where mass shooters were interviewed and not only did not all of them have psychopathy, only about half of them had schizophrenia which, as you pointed out, commonly contained aspects of psychopathy. So your assumption was incorrect.

Why have a separate category for mass shooters? Because they are a whole different animal killing for different reasons than other murderers. You think you can lump serial killers, dictators, suicide bombers, and people who shoot up a school under one umbrella in terms of a psychological analysis? I answered this before when I pointed out that these school/work shooters frequently have a suicidal element to them. They aren't killing to control a population, they aren't all killing for some thrill, they aren't all killing on a religious quest. Listen to the interview and see how this guy's reasons were very different from most other mass murderers. See, this is the problem with simply labeling them as evil and thinking you understand it because you don't. If you don't understand them you are going to fail at helping/stopping them.

BTW, what you posted isn't irrelevant, it just doesn't support your claim.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #41 on: December 20, 2023, 11:49:51 PM »

That is your rebuttal? You are going to go grammar technicality after I showed your claims to be wrong? Ok, sure, i'll give you that freebie.

Yes, false assumption. You stated "Show me a mass murderer, and i'll show you a psychopath." You couldn't produce evidence to show all mass murderers were psychopaths and could only produce evidence that murderers on average are higher than the normal population for psychopathy. You didn't even show this data applied to mass shooters (I checked your article, none of them mentioned mass shooters). Then on top of that I gave you evidence where mass shooters were interviewed and not only did not all of them have psychopathy, only about half of them had schizophrenia which, as you pointed out, commonly contained aspects of psychopathy. So your assumption was incorrect.

Why have a separate category for mass shooters? Because they are a whole different animal killing for different reasons than other murderers. You think you can lump serial killers, dictators, suicide bombers, and people who shoot up a school under one umbrella in terms of a psychological analysis? I answered this before when I pointed out that these school/work shooters frequently have a suicidal element to them. They aren't killing to control a population, they aren't all killing for some thrill, they aren't all killing on a religious quest. Listen to the interview and see how this guy's reasons were very different from most other mass murderers. See, this is the problem with simply labeling them as evil and thinking you understand it because you don't. If you don't understand them you are going to fail at helping/stopping them.

BTW, what you posted isn't irrelevant, it just doesn't support your claim.

Is it your belief that mass shooters are not murderers?

I mean, what's your argument?  That the category is too broad or something? 

You make no sense.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

eyeeatingfish

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #42 on: December 22, 2023, 11:37:52 PM »
Is it your belief that mass shooters are not murderers?

No, that wouldn't make much sense. Unless you want to go on some technicality of a mass shooter who only manages to wound.

Quote
I mean, what's your argument?  That the category is too broad or something? 

You make no sense.

My argument is that mass shooters like this need to be understood for their unique motivations, backgrounds, etc.  Calling them evil psychopaths doesn't do anything to that end. Putting them into the general murderer category provides very limited informational value.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #43 on: December 23, 2023, 12:25:59 AM »
No, that wouldn't make much sense. Unless you want to go on some technicality of a mass shooter who only manages to wound.

My argument is that mass shooters like this need to be understood for their unique motivations, backgrounds, etc.  Calling them evil psychopaths doesn't do anything to that end. Putting them into the general murderer category provides very limited informational value.

Why would a mass shooter have "unique motivations?"  Do you know of a list of motivations mass shooters have that other murderers do not?

You seem to be hung up on the labeling of someone based on their actions.  How else do you propose to determine whether or not someone is a psychopath?  Have them complete a 250 page questionnaire?

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

eyeeatingfish

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #44 on: December 26, 2023, 12:21:53 AM »
Why would a mass shooter have "unique motivations?"  Do you know of a list of motivations mass shooters have that other murderers do not?

You seem to be hung up on the labeling of someone based on their actions.  How else do you propose to determine whether or not someone is a psychopath?  Have them complete a 250 page questionnaire?



Why wouldn't mass shooters have different motivations from other types of murderers?

A large enough number of mass shooters survive that they can be studied to determine whether they are psychopaths or not. Why am I "hung up"? Because you don't fix the problem very well if you have a flawed understanding of their actions and motivations.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #45 on: December 26, 2023, 12:24:10 AM »
Why wouldn't mass shooters have different motivations from other types of murderers?

A large enough number of mass shooters survive that they can be studied to determine whether they are psychopaths or not. Why am I "hung up"? Because you don't fix the problem very well if you have a flawed understanding of their actions and motivations.

You're now answering questions with questions.

Waste of time.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

eyeeatingfish

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #46 on: December 29, 2023, 10:21:38 PM »
You're now answering questions with questions.

Waste of time.

Wrong.

You are putting forth a flawed premise, I am asking you to make your case that a mass shooter wouldn't have any unique motivations to show your question is flawed. I'd argue that the burden of proof is on you to first make the case that all types of murderers are motivated by the same thing before asking me why a mass shooter would have a unique motivation.

Your argument for picking out psychopaths isn't even remotely scientific, you just set out your own standard.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #47 on: December 29, 2023, 10:27:36 PM »
Wrong.

You are putting forth a flawed premise, I am asking you to make your case that a mass shooter wouldn't have any unique motivations to show your question is flawed. I'd argue that the burden of proof is on you to first make the case that all types of murderers are motivated by the same thing before asking me why a mass shooter would have a unique motivation.

Your argument for picking out psychopaths isn't even remotely scientific, you just set out your own standard.

I never said all murderers have the same motivations, Mr. Strawman.  But, YOU made the claim and are continuing to double down on it saying mass shooters have unique motivations.

I asked what those motivations are.  if you could list them, maybe we can compare them to other murderers to see just how "unique' they are.

Not a mystery why you won't answer the question.  You know where it'll lead, and you can't stand being wrong.

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

eyeeatingfish

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #48 on: January 11, 2024, 01:06:46 AM »
I never said all murderers have the same motivations, Mr. Strawman.  But, YOU made the claim and are continuing to double down on it saying mass shooters have unique motivations.

I asked what those motivations are.  if you could list them, maybe we can compare them to other murderers to see just how "unique' they are.

Not a mystery why you won't answer the question.  You know where it'll lead, and you can't stand being wrong.

You said "Why would a mass shooter have "unique motivations?" If you thought they had unique motivations there would have been no reason to ask such a question. So are you disputing that mass shooters have unique motivations or not? Stop playing games.

From the reading I have done there are a number of unique motivations. Many of them I would describe as a unique form of revenge, lashing out at a person or a group they feel harmed by. Some also have delusions leading them to believe something false that they must accomplish. Read the book I mentioned, listen to this interview.

I know where it doesn't lead and that is your unscientific claim that all mass shooters are psychopaths.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #49 on: January 11, 2024, 10:32:30 AM »
You said "Why would a mass shooter have "unique motivations?" If you thought they had unique motivations there would have been no reason to ask such a question. So are you disputing that mass shooters have unique motivations or not? Stop playing games.

From the reading I have done there are a number of unique motivations. Many of them I would describe as a unique form of revenge, lashing out at a person or a group they feel harmed by. Some also have delusions leading them to believe something false that they must accomplish. Read the book I mentioned, listen to this interview.

I know where it doesn't lead and that is your unscientific claim that all mass shooters are psychopaths.

i've seen some stupid ways you've tried to wiggle your way out of things you've said, but this is a doozie!

"From the reading I have done there are a number of unique motivations. Many of them I would describe as a unique form of revenge..."

You can't add the word "unique" to a category of motivations (revenge) and pretend that makes it unique.  Well, maybe YOU can, but not reasonable people.

Is it your belief (based on "the reading you've done") that revenge sought by mass shooters is somehow different than revenge sought by other murderers?  How is one type of murder based on revenge different than another type of murder based on revenge?  Is a person who shoots his wife and her lover for revenge any different than a student who shoots 20 classmates and faculty members for bullying?

You have yet to describe how any motivation a mass shooter may use is in any way "unique" to mass shooters.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

changemyoil66

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #50 on: January 11, 2024, 11:18:18 AM »
It was nice and quiet to not see things being "objective" and made up.

The Columbine shooters targeted jocks because they bullied them.  But 1 jock was in the parking lot as they were loading up and this one wasn't a bully to either.  They told him to go home and he wasn't harmed.

With the weapons they used, there is no way that they can target only the jocks who were bullies to them.  But instead randomly shoot at anyone wearing a letterman jacket, uniform,  or hat.  How do they know that wasn't Brian who helped Dylan dry his hair after being swirlied by other jocks.

Gay club shooter, what was his "unique" motivation? Often not all at a gay club are gay.  I know lots of straight girls who go to gay clubs with their BGF because they don't want to get hit on all night.  heck, I even went to a gay club with my friend as a wingman in Vegas.  I left once he got his groove on and it was obvious he didn't me to keep him company.  Going to a club by yourself puts off a loser vibe.

So does "unique" exclude collateral damage?

A unique mass shooter would be someone who's doing one while standing on 1 leg, wearing a big foam cowboy hat, while eating an ice cream cone in his other hand.

eyeeatingfish

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #51 on: January 14, 2024, 01:42:19 AM »
i've seen some stupid ways you've tried to wiggle your way out of things you've said, but this is a doozie!

"From the reading I have done there are a number of unique motivations. Many of them I would describe as a unique form of revenge..."

You can't add the word "unique" to a category of motivations (revenge) and pretend that makes it unique.  Well, maybe YOU can, but not reasonable people.

Is it your belief (based on "the reading you've done") that revenge sought by mass shooters is somehow different than revenge sought by other murderers?  How is one type of murder based on revenge different than another type of murder based on revenge?  Is a person who shoots his wife and her lover for revenge any different than a student who shoots 20 classmates and faculty members for bullying?

You have yet to describe how any motivation a mass shooter may use is in any way "unique" to mass shooters.

It is called summarizing. If you wanted a more in depth explanation, might I suggest simply asking for one instead of being an a-hole. Unless you are incapable of doing that?
Go listen to the interview, he lays out his whole revenge model and you can listen to it yourself better than I could explain it. In short, he was going to kill a bunch of innocent people to punish his mom for all the terrible things she did to him raising him.
In a California incident a guy stabbed and shot girls because he was upset women would not date him (he was an incel) and he took his revenge against innocent women he found.
Workplace shootings are often found to be related to having been fired or laid off.

I would put all of those into the category of unique revenge because they are often not trying to murder the person who wronged them but instead murder a bunch of innocent people.


If you can't see the difference between an angry spouse killing their partner over infidelity vs killing 20 innocent children at a school I don't see how you can ever grow to understand this.

eyeeatingfish

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #52 on: January 14, 2024, 01:54:37 AM »
It was nice and quiet to not see things being "objective" and made up.

The Columbine shooters targeted jocks because they bullied them.  But 1 jock was in the parking lot as they were loading up and this one wasn't a bully to either.  They told him to go home and he wasn't harmed.

With the weapons they used, there is no way that they can target only the jocks who were bullies to them.  But instead randomly shoot at anyone wearing a letterman jacket, uniform,  or hat.  How do they know that wasn't Brian who helped Dylan dry his hair after being swirlied by other jocks.

Gay club shooter, what was his "unique" motivation? Often not all at a gay club are gay.  I know lots of straight girls who go to gay clubs with their BGF because they don't want to get hit on all night.  heck, I even went to a gay club with my friend as a wingman in Vegas.  I left once he got his groove on and it was obvious he didn't me to keep him company.  Going to a club by yourself puts off a loser vibe.

So does "unique" exclude collateral damage?

A unique mass shooter would be someone who's doing one while standing on 1 leg, wearing a big foam cowboy hat, while eating an ice cream cone in his other hand.


Collateral damage would mean people you don't intend to hurt. That is different I would argue than killing a bunch of random, innocent people on purpose.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #53 on: January 14, 2024, 03:49:29 AM »
It is called summarizing. If you wanted a more in depth explanation, might I suggest simply asking for one instead of being an a-hole. Unless you are incapable of doing that?
Go listen to the interview, he lays out his whole revenge model and you can listen to it yourself better than I could explain it. In short, he was going to kill a bunch of innocent people to punish his mom for all the terrible things she did to him raising him.
In a California incident a guy stabbed and shot girls because he was upset women would not date him (he was an incel) and he took his revenge against innocent women he found.
Workplace shootings are often found to be related to having been fired or laid off.

I would put all of those into the category of unique revenge because they are often not trying to murder the person who wronged them but instead murder a bunch of innocent people.


If you can't see the difference between an angry spouse killing their partner over infidelity vs killing 20 innocent children at a school I don't see how you can ever grow to understand this.

Ok, Dr. Phil.  Compare:

the motives of a school mass shooter who targets random, innocent people

to the motives of a shooter who targets random, innocent people attending a concert in Vegas,

and the motives of a shooter who targets random, innocent people attending a church.

The act itself has nothing to do with the motive,  The underlying motive is THE PERSON IS A PSYCHOPATH and doesn't care who gets hurt. 

If the motive is revenge, then they would target the ones who wronged them, correct?  If they choose to shoot random students in a hallway instead, that's the act of a psychopath -- no direct line between the dead and the motive.

Same for the concert and church shooters.  No direct line between whatever transgression the shooter is basing the act on.  Just random, innocent people who happen to be there.

They are all psychopaths.  There are no "unique" OR common motives driving them.  They simply have no reason other than to kill -- and who they kill doesn't matter to them.

In most instances, the real motive is suicide, but they are too cowardly to off themselves.  So, they choose a time and place to be killed by the police.  Killing others is just incidental to the actual intent -- self destruction.

Now, if you want to delve into the INDIVIDUAL (not unique) circumstances that made them suicidal, that's fine.  But the motive to commit mass murder is not unique among them. 

The Newtown shooter may be an obvious example. He was diagnosed and treated for mental illness/autism.  He, along with other school shooters, left behind evidence/statements that they wanted to be famous -- to achieve a record-breaking body count on their way out of existence.   That in itself is not a motive, but a goal that gave them a rationalized objective to reach for in their ultimate desire to stop breathing themselves.  Did he seek revenge?  Don't know.  With his mental problems, I can only guess he was bullied at school.  Kids are cruel, and anyone they see as different or weak will be targets of some pretty nasty stuff.

I've said it before, video games don't make people killers, but they can have a desensitizing effect that makes killing less repulsive.  The military uses the same type of desensitizing techniques to train soldiers to kill other human beings -- an act any rational human being would find difficult.

None of this is "unique" to mass shooters, though.  I lived in Oklahoma after college.  My wife and I had a game we played every night when the news came on -- to see who could guess the number of deaths reported in that half hour.  Seemed like drug deals and robberies topped the motive category. There were also the occasional psychopath who came along and committed mass murder.

The term Going Postal was first coined with the mass murder just above my apartment complex in Edmond. 

The Sirloin Stockade steak house murder trial was just starting when we arrived in OK.  It was said to be a robbery that happened just as  the restaurant closed.  All employees and remaining guests were marched into the walk-in fridge and executed.

There was the Wynn's IGA 24 hour supermarket, also in Edmond.  It was robbery orchestrated by a former employee.  Took the 3 employees working that 3AM shift to a back room and executed them. 
https://www.newson6.com/story/5e3683962f69d76f620987b8/man-executed-for-1985-grocery-store-murders

There was rarely a night when a body wasn't found in a park, in a wooded area, or in an abandoned house.

There was a couple that went on a multi-state crime spree and happened to come through our area.  An Air Force Airman was going to visit a friend, but in the apartment parking area, she was abducted by the couple for her car and any money or credit cards she had.  Police found her body under an abandoned house days later.

Every single one was a psychopath.  It doesn't matter if they were 15 or 50.  They should be executed, because little can be learned from them and their "unique motives" which might prevent the next such crime. 

The human condition is what it is.  You can't raise kids outside of their family's influence, and even if you could, we see what foster care and orphanages can produce.  Some people should never be allowed to reproduce, but that's something that has and will always happen.

Are all psychopaths killers?  Of course not.  Many are productive leaders.  They rise quickly in their chosen professions -- lawyers, politicians, military leaders, etc. -- with much of the credit going to their psychopathy.  When you are a narcissistic megalomaniac with little regard for the feelings of others or the effects you have on them, it's easier to focus on what you want and say "fu" to everyone else.

i bet you even have worked with or do work with at least one or two psychopaths, and if you tried, you'd be able to document the things they do that are common traits for psychopaths.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2024, 04:32:26 AM by Flapp_Jackson »
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

eyeeatingfish

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #54 on: January 16, 2024, 09:44:02 PM »
Ok, Dr. Phil.  Compare:

the motives of a school mass shooter who targets random, innocent people

to the motives of a shooter who targets random, innocent people attending a concert in Vegas,

and the motives of a shooter who targets random, innocent people attending a church.

The act itself has nothing to do with the motive,  The underlying motive is THE PERSON IS A PSYCHOPATH and doesn't care who gets hurt. 

If the motive is revenge, then they would target the ones who wronged them, correct?  If they choose to shoot random students in a hallway instead, that's the act of a psychopath -- no direct line between the dead and the motive.

Same for the concert and church shooters.  No direct line between whatever transgression the shooter is basing the act on.  Just random, innocent people who happen to be there.

They are all psychopaths.  There are no "unique" OR common motives driving them.  They simply have no reason other than to kill -- and who they kill doesn't matter to them.

In most instances, the real motive is suicide, but they are too cowardly to off themselves.  So, they choose a time and place to be killed by the police.  Killing others is just incidental to the actual intent -- self destruction.

Now, if you want to delve into the INDIVIDUAL (not unique) circumstances that made them suicidal, that's fine.  But the motive to commit mass murder is not unique among them. 

The Newtown shooter may be an obvious example. He was diagnosed and treated for mental illness/autism.  He, along with other school shooters, left behind evidence/statements that they wanted to be famous -- to achieve a record-breaking body count on their way out of existence.   That in itself is not a motive, but a goal that gave them a rationalized objective to reach for in their ultimate desire to stop breathing themselves.  Did he seek revenge?  Don't know.  With his mental problems, I can only guess he was bullied at school.  Kids are cruel, and anyone they see as different or weak will be targets of some pretty nasty stuff.

I've said it before, video games don't make people killers, but they can have a desensitizing effect that makes killing less repulsive.  The military uses the same type of desensitizing techniques to train soldiers to kill other human beings -- an act any rational human being would find difficult.

None of this is "unique" to mass shooters, though.  I lived in Oklahoma after college.  My wife and I had a game we played every night when the news came on -- to see who could guess the number of deaths reported in that half hour.  Seemed like drug deals and robberies topped the motive category. There were also the occasional psychopath who came along and committed mass murder.

The term Going Postal was first coined with the mass murder just above my apartment complex in Edmond. 

The Sirloin Stockade steak house murder trial was just starting when we arrived in OK.  It was said to be a robbery that happened just as  the restaurant closed.  All employees and remaining guests were marched into the walk-in fridge and executed.

There was the Wynn's IGA 24 hour supermarket, also in Edmond.  It was robbery orchestrated by a former employee.  Took the 3 employees working that 3AM shift to a back room and executed them. 
https://www.newson6.com/story/5e3683962f69d76f620987b8/man-executed-for-1985-grocery-store-murders

There was rarely a night when a body wasn't found in a park, in a wooded area, or in an abandoned house.

There was a couple that went on a multi-state crime spree and happened to come through our area.  An Air Force Airman was going to visit a friend, but in the apartment parking area, she was abducted by the couple for her car and any money or credit cards she had.  Police found her body under an abandoned house days later.

Every single one was a psychopath.  It doesn't matter if they were 15 or 50.  They should be executed, because little can be learned from them and their "unique motives" which might prevent the next such crime. 

The human condition is what it is.  You can't raise kids outside of their family's influence, and even if you could, we see what foster care and orphanages can produce.  Some people should never be allowed to reproduce, but that's something that has and will always happen.

Are all psychopaths killers?  Of course not.  Many are productive leaders.  They rise quickly in their chosen professions -- lawyers, politicians, military leaders, etc. -- with much of the credit going to their psychopathy.  When you are a narcissistic megalomaniac with little regard for the feelings of others or the effects you have on them, it's easier to focus on what you want and say "fu" to everyone else.

i bet you even have worked with or do work with at least one or two psychopaths, and if you tried, you'd be able to document the things they do that are common traits for psychopaths.


Just because you say mass shooters are psychopaths repeatedly doesn't make it true though. I am sure some of them are actual psychopaths, I never said none of them are, but the evidence doesn't support your claim that ALL mass shooters are psychopaths.

In the large study of mass shooters I mentioned previously, they interviewed a number of shooters in prison. These people had remorse, real psychopaths aren't going to have any remorse. There was a video of a student who brought a shotgun to school to shoot the place up but a quick acting teacher grabbed it out of his hands before he shot anyone. I don't think you can tell on the video but the teacher said that the boy immediately started crying, not something a psychopath is going to do.

In the Jordan Peterson interview, the target of the guy's revenge was his mom but it was going to be accomplished by killing innocent people. That is why I called it a unique form of revenge because the target of his revenge was unrelated to the target of his violence. As opposed to the more common tendency to enact violence upon the target itself.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #55 on: January 17, 2024, 11:34:39 AM »

Just because you say mass shooters are psychopaths repeatedly doesn't make it true though. I am sure some of them are actual psychopaths, I never said none of them are, but the evidence doesn't support your claim that ALL mass shooters are psychopaths.

In the large study of mass shooters I mentioned previously, they interviewed a number of shooters in prison. These people had remorse, real psychopaths aren't going to have any remorse. There was a video of a student who brought a shotgun to school to shoot the place up but a quick acting teacher grabbed it out of his hands before he shot anyone. I don't think you can tell on the video but the teacher said that the boy immediately started crying, not something a psychopath is going to do.

In the Jordan Peterson interview, the target of the guy's revenge was his mom but it was going to be accomplished by killing innocent people. That is why I called it a unique form of revenge because the target of his revenge was unrelated to the target of his violence. As opposed to the more common tendency to enact violence upon the target itself.
Did you not read what I wrote?  You just wrote, 'That is why I called it a unique form of revenge because the target of his revenge was unrelated to the target of his violence. "

I posted, "They are all psychopaths.  There are no "unique" OR common motives driving them.  They simply have no reason other than to kill -- and who they kill doesn't matter to them."

Show me how "the target of his revenge was unrelated to the target of his violence" is not the same as "...who they kill doesn't matter to them."

And just because you always disagree with me doesn't mean I'm wrong.

i offered evidence of what i'm saying is true.  You only offer the statements by someone else as if they will argue with me for you.

Just stop.  if you can't synthesize the interview and augment it with more than that, nothing you say matters.  i might as well be debating a brick wall -- or a recording of someone you posted a link to.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

changemyoil66

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #56 on: January 17, 2024, 11:45:00 AM »

Just because you say mass shooters are psychopaths repeatedly doesn't make it true though. I am sure some of them are actual psychopaths, I never said none of them are, but the evidence doesn't support your claim that ALL mass shooters are psychopaths.

In the large study of mass shooters I mentioned previously, they interviewed a number of shooters in prison. These people had remorse, real psychopaths aren't going to have any remorse. There was a video of a student who brought a shotgun to school to shoot the place up but a quick acting teacher grabbed it out of his hands before he shot anyone. I don't think you can tell on the video but the teacher said that the boy immediately started crying, not something a psychopath is going to do.

In the Jordan Peterson interview, the target of the guy's revenge was his mom but it was going to be accomplished by killing innocent people. That is why I called it a unique form of revenge because the target of his revenge was unrelated to the target of his violence. As opposed to the more common tendency to enact violence upon the target itself.

This is rhetorical , but do you read what you post before hitting the post button?

The kid didn't shoot anyone, so he's not a mass shooter.  There is no way to tell how he would react if he had gone thru with it. We only know how he reacted after the teacher took the gun away. Bad example.

How do you know a convict is telling the truth and having "remorse"?  Can you be sure they aren't acting just to get a better sentencing or parole in their favor later?

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #57 on: January 17, 2024, 03:31:54 PM »
This is rhetorical , but do you read what you post before hitting the post button?

The kid didn't shoot anyone, so he's not a mass shooter.  There is no way to tell how he would react if he had gone thru with it. We only know how he reacted after the teacher took the gun away. Bad example.

How do you know a convict is telling the truth and having "remorse"?  Can you be sure they aren't acting just to get a better sentencing or parole in their favor later?

I almost burned my ex's house down, but decided against it.  Can I get a grant to be studied to determine what motivates an (almost) arsonist and murderer?

What if the only thing stopping me was the price of gas?  Or my aversion to using fossil fuels that are killing the planet?

When does a motivation to do evil get overridden by another motivation that keeps you from acting on that first motivation?

Isn't that what we call a conscience?  Maybe the "almost mass shooter" failed to become one because he really isn't a psychopath, and his moral sense of right and wrong took over?

It almost sounds like going to church and learning about right and wrong could prevent crime.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

macsak

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #58 on: January 17, 2024, 03:56:23 PM »
you hardly ever commit arson?
#nuance
#objective

I almost burned my ex's house down, but decided against it.  Can I get a grant to be studied to determine what motivates an (almost) arsonist and murderer?

What if the only thing stopping me was the price of gas?  Or my aversion to using fossil fuels that are killing the planet?

When does a motivation to do evil get overridden by another motivation that keeps you from acting on that first motivation?

Isn't that what we call a conscience?  Maybe the "almost mass shooter" failed to become one because he really isn't a psychopath, and his moral sense of right and wrong took over?

It almost sounds like going to church and learning about right and wrong could prevent crime.

changemyoil66

Re: Interview with an (Almost) School Shooter
« Reply #59 on: January 17, 2024, 05:03:58 PM »
I almost burned my ex's house down, but decided against it.  Can I get a grant to be studied to determine what motivates an (almost) arsonist and murderer?

What if the only thing stopping me was the price of gas?  Or my aversion to using fossil fuels that are killing the planet?

When does a motivation to do evil get overridden by another motivation that keeps you from acting on that first motivation?

Isn't that what we call a conscience?  Maybe the "almost mass shooter" failed to become one because he really isn't a psychopath, and his moral sense of right and wrong took over?

It almost sounds like going to church and learning about right and wrong could prevent crime.

U could have almost burned it down by choosing to leave the stove on while taking a shit. But instead chose to turn it off, thus preventing the home from burning down.

#objective