2aHawaii
General Topics => General Discussion => Topic started by: digital808 on April 05, 2013, 06:25:06 AM
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This mornings paper...Page A17 "Letters to the editor"......Check it out! This was written by Dave Kajihiro (Deputy Chief)......Hopefully the best is yet to come! :shaka:
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Thought this was another April fools joke.
Then I thought you actually had a letter head from hpd addressing this issue.
Hopefully they make great improvements like abolishing the registration process
What I'm really hoping is that something meaningful will actually be done in a timely manner to reduce the long lines.
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by the time they implement changes in the bureaucracy, lines will have gone down
automation would be a great help, for the officers too
Thought this was another April fools joke.
Then I thought you actually had a letter head from hpd addressing this issue.
Hopefully they make great improvements like abolishing the registration process
What I'm really hoping is that something meaningful will actually be done in a timely manner to reduce the long lines.
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Thanks for posting the story. Wasn't as great as I thought it would have been. Sounds like they just tryna show face since the news been reporting it. Line is occasionally long? It's almost always long. People wait for hours. Added staff and other measures such as? Ah dont worry about it. We have strict laws so just be patient, keep quiet and keep standing in line.
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Thanks for posting this. Flipped the image around because I had a hard time tilting my head :shaka:
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Other than posting the forms online to be downloaded and filled out at home (which I am in favor for), how do they purpose to "automate" the line? They need to open at the very least one more location to address the long wait times.
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The Japanese have a word for that: SHIBAI
I'll believe it when it actually happens.
HPD is saying that because of the Negative press it has been getting.
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Thanks for posting this. Flipped the image around because I had a hard time tilting my head :shaka:
Thanks! I was wondering why it rotated! Using my iPhone! :thumbsup:
Update: I rotated the pic! Figured it out!
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I'll remain optimistic yet skeptical.......actions speak louder than words!
I really hope this will be followed by actual progress!!
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I know this has been brought up before but.....They really really really need a permit pick-up line. Yesterday many of us waited ~3 hrs to just pick up a permit. What ever happened to someone coming out every once in a while for pick-ups. All they have to do is go outside every 1/2 hr or so and say "anyone just picking up?" Boom! Pau! C'mon HPD!
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What about putting those little old ladies to work at the registration window if not just to retrive your permit if thats all would help out alot. I dont know maybe im wrong.
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If and when they implement whatever they plan to do it will be too late as the panic registration tapers off. And when that does happen they'll take credit for the short line and call it a success.
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"In the future we hope to automate much of the registration process."
I would like to know what they mean by that statement. According to Webster's, it means to "convert to a largely automatic operation." This would mean the process is expedient and efficient, somethings that are sorely lacking with the current registration and permitting process.
Much "automation" is currently accomplished by allowing the purchaser to do a good portion of the work. We see this at gas stations with people pumping their own gas. We also see this at airports with people printing their own boarding passes and even checking in their own bags. This is how to "automate" processes.
How to "automate" the permitting and registration processes?
Permitting: Allow people to download, print and complete the permit forms before they get to HPD.
Registration: Allow people to download and print the forms before they go to the gun store to pick up and pay for their gun. The forms can be completed at the gunstore and then the dealer can fax these forms to HPD. Dealers already have to fax info to HPD after a customer picks up a gun so they would be adding just a couple more pages to the fax. Or, the buyer can fax the completed registration forms themselves. HPD can then type the registration forms before the gun owner arrives. The gun owner then arrives with the firearm for checking and to sign the registration form.
Lots of time can be saved with these two suggestions.
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Hmmm, actually now that I think about this letter, it doesn't actually say they are going to do anything. It says they've added staff and hope to do some stuff in the future. To me, that means they don't have any concrete plans. I guess we'll see..
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Why do we need that registration piece of paper?
Maybe the gun shops could send in the paperwork and we wouldn't have to do anything else. Hpd would have a record of who the firearms is sold to. Plus its not like the registration paper is used for anything.
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Why do we need registratiom at all!?
That too.
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I know this has been brought up before but.....They really really really need a permit pick-up line. Yesterday many of us waited ~3 hrs to just pick up a permit. What ever happened to someone coming out every once in a while for pick-ups. All they have to do is go outside every 1/2 hr or so and say "anyone just picking up?" Boom! Pau! C'mon HPD!
Kealoha probably caught wind of the firearms department actually making it EASIER on gun owners, and put the kibosh on that.
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Some general problems with HPD's filing - first it's stll manual (mostly). They use carbon copies for PTA, Reg etc., which is why we don't print at home. We have some of the other forms, nothing says you can't print them. I'm pretty sure we made them available some where after battling it out with HPD and having ACLU step in to compel production of documents. I've also been threatened with arrest for "stealing government document" for trying to leave with PTA / CCW paperwork.
Chris
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Why do we need registratiom at all!?
So they know where to go to confiscate of course
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Some general problems with HPD's filing - first it's stll manual (mostly). They use carbon copies for PTA, Reg etc., which is why we don't print at home. We have some of the other forms, nothing says you can't print them. I'm pretty sure we made them available some where after battling it out with HPD and having ACLU step in to compel production of documents. I've also been threatened with arrest for "stealing government document" for trying to leave with PTA / CCW paperwork.
Chris
Were you allegedly stealing the same government documents Ive heard they place in a box outside the door in Hilo for folks to fill out before getting in line for permits?
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If and when they implement whatever they plan to do it will be too late as the panic registration tapers off. And when that does happen they'll take credit for the short line and call it a success.
hahah was gonna say almost the exact same thing :shaka:
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I don't know, cause I don't have any firearms to register....but Are the forms they give out in Hilo (If they do have them in a box on the door) the same carbon copy forms used here? Or are these things specific by county? If they are the same, I wonder what would happen if someone showed up at Hono w/ a permit app form already filled out? One legally acquired from Hilo?
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It's silly in this day and age that the permit and registration-information forms cannot be PDFs that can be downloaded and printed from any Internet-enabled computer. It would allow applicants to fill them out before coming to the window, reducing the wait time.
HPD is probably concerned or unclear about how to add the control numbers to these forms. Why not have their IT department set up a spreadsheet (Excel) or database (Access) program that allows them to assign numbers as needed. This control number can then be written on the permit forms.
A second control number assignment system can be created for the registration forms. Again, the registration-information forms should be posted online and people can download and complete them beforehand.
I wish HPD would move away from the old-fashioned carbon forms, which are too inflexible.
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maybe we could all start a write in program to the chief of police now that he has (kind of) openly admitted there could be some improvement to the registration process. It seems like now is the time to put the pressure on.
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I don't know, cause I don't have any firearms to register....but Are the forms they give out in Hilo (If they do have them in a box on the door) the same carbon copy forms used here? Or are these things specific by county? If they are the same, I wonder what would happen if someone showed up at Hono w/ a permit app form already filled out? One legally acquired from Hilo?
the forms are not the same. We had no issues retrieving the forms from Hawaii County police, Maui County Police. We threatened litigation with Kauai and Honolulu if they failed to produce the papers. Kauai took a little longer, but they folded once ACLU became involved. Further, contrary to state law, where the forms should be "uniform throughout the state" and promulgated by the attorney general, no such forms exist at that level.
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It's silly in this day and age that the permit and registration-information forms cannot be PDFs that can be downloaded and printed from any Internet-enabled computer. It would allow applicants to fill them out before coming to the window, reducing the wait time.
HPD is probably concerned or unclear about how to add the control numbers to these forms. Why not have their IT department set up a spreadsheet (Excel) or database (Access) program that allows them to assign numbers as needed. This control number can then be written on the permit forms.
There's no difference between writing a control number on a blank form versus an already completed form that was either downloaded and neatly typed or picked up at the LGS or HPD. They can easily do that now with no change in their current process.
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and of course the story runs next to a pic of empty hallways.
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Yes, the editorial may be HPD's attempt at, "damage control," and, yes, Deputy Chief Dave Kajihiro is typically the one who addresses the media and does press releases.
But, in my opinion, let's focus on the positives...
1. HPD is acknowledging that there is a problem.
2. HPD has publicly stated that they are trying to implement positive changes.
I think SB 69 (the one I sent testimony in opposition to!) might be the vehicle needed to appropriate funds to implement positive changes at HPD.
If the exact amount of funds has not yet been identified, it might be a bit premature for HPD to articulate what kind of positive changes (and within what kind of timeline) HPD is expecting to implement.
It's funny, but I keep reminding myself that I gotta look at the totality of the information and circumstances, because everything is inter-related...
Does HPD intentionally want to make it more difficult for individuals to register firearms, or could it be that individual firearm registrants and the HPD Firearms Registration Department are both falling victim to a "perfect storm" of 1) an explosion in the number of firearm registrations ; 2) outdated policies, practices, procedures, and legislation; 3) budgetary constraints at HPD; and 4) an absence of political will on the part of Hawaii's legislators?
Did SB 69 start out as a POS measure, but get "morphed" along the legislative process to potentially provide a benefit to individual firearm registrants?
Not sure if I have definite answers to either of these questions, but will keep posted for more information, and like bruddah Pizzo, I remain skeptically optimistic.
Just my $0.02 and keep your heads up, bruddahs!
Happy Aloha Friday! :shaka:
I wish I could be as optimistic as you, but I can't. We'll see...........as they say, action speaks louder than words.
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This is a little bit of damage control on their part. I would be shocked if they did anything that would actually reduce the waits. I suggest you do what I did, write the mayor.
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They should look into making internet registration and permitting a viable option. Waiting in line for over 2 hours sucks.
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HPD pulled back some officers who used to be in the firearms section from their current assignments in order to help out with the backlog. I recognized one of 'em who had been transferred out more than a year ago and asked. what he was doing back at firearms.
But the wait can still be brutal. A guy from work was happy because he didn't spend more than an hour in line to apply for his long-gun permit in early March and to pick it up two weeks later. But when he went to register his new long gun, it took him four hours. No one came out to take care of folks just picking up their permits. And the two guys in line just ahead of him were registering multiple firearms each. My coworker's registration didn't get typed until after theirs, of course. Having the carbon registration forms manually typed out at a snail's pace seems to be one of the bottlenecks.
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You don't suppose they're getting a little sensitive about the word...<whisper> ...."infringed"?
I'm not signing this one sonobody will know who posted it.
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So they know where to go to confiscate of course
:thumbsup:
That would be an awesome question for the "Upper Folk" to answer in front of the masses......
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They should address the the problem by simply getting rid of registration.....
Again and Again....theyre not worried about criminals.....
Theyre worried about the people that follow the law.....
There's no CONTROL without CONTROL.....
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next time there is some sort of public opportunity (say, a new bill or something), someone needs to ask Kealoha straight up, how many cases the registry was used in?
I have a feeling Rick Allen could count the number on his left hand.
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next time there is some sort of public opportunity (say, a new bill or something), someone needs to ask Kealoha straight up, how many cases the registry was used in?
I have a feeling Rick Allen could count the number on his left hand.
I don't know who Rick Allen is, but I'm sorry to hear he is missing some fingers on one of his hands....
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I don't know who Rick Allen is, but I'm sorry to hear he is missing some fingers on one of his hands....
Rick Allen is the drummer for Def Leppard.
He lost his arm in the 80ʻs.
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I have a college instructor who was with hpd for 25+ years and I remember him saying something about they were gonna do a warrant or something at someones house so they checked his file and saw he owned guns so they sent the swat team in
thats not solving a case though. i dunno.
i guess i should have been more clear. i didnt mean instances, i meant, how many times was the registry used to help solve a case.
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Registration sucks. Period.
But realistically, I don't think the registration process will be abolished.
If firearm registration is here to stay, HPD should do something to streamline and update the process and make it more efficient for everyone.
Just my $0.02.
we could all start to build our own guns out of 80%'s and not need to reg anything...
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we could all start to build our own guns out of 80%'s and not need to reg anything...
This may have been sarcasm, but just to make it clear, all firearms need to be registered, even ones made from 80%s.
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The Japanese have a word for that: SHIBAI
I'll believe it when it actually happens.
HPD is saying that because of the Negative press it has been getting.
Sorta like how T-Mobile keeps telling us they are working on getting a new cell tower in our area to improve cell reception,,,,been 5 years and counting,,,,
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I thought tmobile practically pulled everything out of Hawaii... no offices maybe a few stores and no one left to maintain their cells sites.....