Should we apply now?
 

-Rico

Any day now!!  The backlog for a Maine CCW permit has been horrible.  I sent the application in August, my payment cleared in October, and I was reading last week they had completed processing 5,000  backlogged applicant in January!     

holy smokes, i knew they had a backlog but when I got mine a year ago I got the permit maybe 2 weeks after they deposited the check. The biggest reason they have such a backlog is because I  believe it is the only state where you can get a non res permit basically through the mail without any prints or anything

So legally speaking what does this mean for Hawaii? We have to follow the 9th circuit so do we really have to wait for our own case or can it sort of just be determined that the case would win and concealed firearm permits then be issued?

The 9ths first 2 opinions appear to be a very complete and well grounded opinion. What are the chances the SCOTUS will hear only those circuit opinions in conflict with the individual right that placed State safety interests (a conjecture based position) above the individual right, effectively rending the second amendment archaic (isn't that legislating from the bench?). I don't understand how any justice can justify rendering (legislating) an individual right as archaic by virtue of taking a conjecture based position of State interest above an individual right.

After seeing how the SCOTUS ruled on the ACA accepting it as a Tax when originating from the Senate ( a rather dumbfounding contradiction), I'm not so sure I could trust the SCOTUS to make a legislative free decision on these matters either. 

So legally speaking what does this mean for Hawaii?

Looks like the Hawaii case is now a slam-dunk, unless the 9th contradicts itself.

This is great news Chris...thanks for all of your diligent effort!!! BTW is California worst than Hawaii from a 2A prospective...just curious on your take of two very liberal states that you have had the chance to live in?

This is great news Chris...thanks for all of your diligent effort!!! BTW is California worst than Hawaii from a 2A prospective...just curious on your take of two very liberal states that you have had the chance to live in?

Hawaii is no where near as bad as CA depending on where you live.  If "carry" is your biggest thing, then HI would be worse.  But gun / mag restrictions etc. here are way more of a pain in the ass (and more expensive).

Hawaii is no where near as bad as CA depending on where you live.  If "carry" is your biggest thing, then HI would be worse.  But gun / mag restrictions etc. here are way more of a pain in the ass (and more expensive).

I used to carry before Hawaii, so carry is a big thing, not sure about the biggest thing though. I have no love for CA gun laws, or Hawaii for that matter, and how's that micro-stamping gem of a law being embraced and enforced if at all, or is that in the courts? Again just curious since you have boots on the ground, sort of speak.

Just read through my NRA newsletter on the 9th circuit court. This is very encouraging! Funtimes, I've been trying to follow as much as possible and truly appreciate the work you've put in and continue to do. This is monumental for Hawaii's stand on the 2nd Amendment. I'll keep positive  thoughts flowing! Oh, so should we all be applying? Or do we wait?

If the 9th. Ruling is  in favor of  Baker, would it put weight on the present bills by Slom or Gabbard  to pass and force a signature from Abacraper.

Just read an article that says everyone in the 9th circuit (like hawaii) should apply for a concealed carry license before Feb 28th.  That's when the sheriff of San Diego has to decide whether to appeal to the entire 9th circuit.  If they do, the ruling would be stayed until the 9th circuit decides.   If HPD (or any other local official) denies the permit before the order is stayed, the person who was denied a permit would have standing in the 9th circuit. 

http://www.ammoland.com/2014/02/california-hawaii-time-to-apply-for-carry-permits/#axzz2tNkVjq7b

Any thoughts on this?

I'll wait until its actually official we can do it in Hawaii after Chris's case is upheld.  Maybe we can all get together there on a day to apply.

I'll wait until its actually official we can do it in Hawaii after Chris's case is upheld.  Maybe we can all get together there on a day to apply.

Great News !

Is it time to organize the Great Hawaii CCW application day ?

Boy, I'd like to see that!  (Talk about the "How's the line at Honolulu PD?" thread!)

Here's hoping it all goes as we're hoping.

Especial thanks to Chris for pushing on this subject as well.

Just read an article that says everyone in the 9th circuit (like hawaii) should apply for a concealed carry license before Feb 28th.  That's when the sheriff of San Diego has to decide whether to appeal to the entire 9th circuit.  If they do, the ruling would be stayed until the 9th circuit decides.   If HPD (or any other local official) denies the permit before the order is stayed, the person who was denied a permit would have standing in the 9th circuit. 

http://www.ammoland.com/2014/02/california-hawaii-time-to-apply-for-carry-permits/#axzz2tNkVjq7b

Any thoughts on this?

The IL court did not stay the order; they only gave the legislature time to make a policy.  I don't see any specific reason this should get stayed.  Many other places in California are shall issue already.   There are quite a few suggesting that it would only get stayed if En Banc was granted.

I'm Chris's lawyer along with RIck Holcomb. Do not apply for a CCW right now. You will just be denied. Wait until at least Baker comes out.
As for carrying long arms, that issue is going to be resolved in Young. Hawaii conceded that Hawaii's complete ban on carrying rifles and shotguns is unconstitutional.
Still you'll have to wait for a decision in Young for that concession to mean anything. 

Not to muddy the waters, but it just occurred to me.  Since every (legal) gun owner in HI has already jumped through the background checks, etc. to even own a  firearm (or maybe just handguns), wouldn't that make every owner in HI automatically eligible for a carry permit upon a "final" favorable decision by the Court(s)?

After all, haven't you already "presented yourselves in person," "at room so-and-so" at "such-and-such building," etc. and been pre-qualified  for shall-issue that way?

Dumb mainlander here, not very familiar with the hoops you've got to jump through,  asking what is probably a dumb question.

Terry

From an NRA link to a FOX News article on this subject:

While the 7th Circuit court of Appeals came to a similar decision as this court, cases for other states such as Maryland,
New York, and New Jersey have come out quite differently and let the states decide if people have a “good reason” to protect
themselves. This almost guarantees that a case will find its way to the Supreme Court.

Fox’s John Stossel, who has faced many death threats, was denied the right to carry a concealed handgun permit in
New York City (the segment on Fox News is almost amusing).

This case is unlikely to be the only time that courts step in to rein in California’s extreme gun control laws. While Californians
may soon have the right to carry a concealed handgun, the micro-stamping law, requiring a microscopic marking onto the tip
of the firing pin that etches a marking on the ejected cartridges, is proving impossible to comply with.

The ultimate question is: do only the most privileged have the right to defend themselves? Thursday's decision by the 9th Circuit says “no.”

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2014/02/13/it-may-soon-be-easy-to-carry-permitted-concealed-handgun-in-california/

Here is my email just sent to all the Hawaii State Senators, with the list of email addresses at the end. I'm curious to see what they will do, but given history there will be extremely serious foot dragging.   

Dear Senator,

As a public servant, I'm asking you to do your duty to uphold your sworn allegiance to abide by and enforce the Constitution.

Please support one of the currently pending "Shall Issue" Concealed Carry bills (SB2168 or SB2353) (hopefully) coming before the appropriate Senate Committees in the very near future.

Please use whatever influence you may have to encourage committee chairpersons to schedule hearings, and then encourage all committee members to recommend the bill(s) out of committee.

As I'm sure you know the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, which applies to Hawaii law, has ruled on February 13, 2014 in Peruta, et. al. v. County of San Diego that the necessity of showing "good cause" in order to acquire a concealed carry permit is unconstitutional. While the specific Hawaii case, Baker v. Kealoha decision has not been announced yet, the premises of Hawaii law regarding this issue are essentially the same ("exceptional case") as the unconstitutional "good cause" requirement. And the results are the same: NO PERSONS in the last 10 years in the entire state of Hawaii not employed as security company personnel have been granted concealed carry permits (to the best of the publics ability to ascertain such information). Thus the Hawaii "exceptional case" requirement, resulting in 100% denial of concealed carry permits to civilians, is unconstitutional, as it de facto bans the Second Amendment guaranteed right to self defense by "bear[ing] arms". The Ninth Circuit ruled that "self defense" alone is constitutional justification requiring issuance of a concealed carry permit (which allows "bearing"), assuming the applicant is not a prohibited person according to the other currently existing criteria for that classification.

It is thus your duty, as you have sworn to uphold the Constitution, to invalidate Hawaii's currently unconstitutional law, and replace it immediately with a constitutional one ("shall issue") that will allow law-abiding Hawaii citizens to carry a concealed weapon for self defense purposes.

The fact that there are over 8 MILLION current concealed carry permit holders in the United States, and that as a group they have a lower rate of criminal activity than both the general public and (even lower than) law enforcement officers. The rate of crime has almost always gone down when locales have instituted "shall issue" concealed carry laws, as one would suspect, given that criminals no longer know that every single person they view in public as a potential victim is unarmed, and thus the criminal is more likely to risk failure at their criminal enterprise, or even serious injury should they just happen to select a concealed carry permit holder as a potential victim. Thus the "public safety" interest is enhanced by concealed carry, and ought to be instituted as "shall issue" even if the overwhelming requirement of constitutionality was not present.

Do your job: Serve the public. Abide by the Constitution. Institute "shall issue" concealed carry.

thank you,


senbaker@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senchunoakland@capitol.hawaii.gov,
sendelacruz@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senenglish@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senespero@capitol.hawaii.gov,
sengabbard@capitol.hawaii.gov,
sengaluteria@capitol.hawaii.gov,
sengreen@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senhee@capitol.hawaii.gov,
sendige@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senihara@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senkahele@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senkeithagaran@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senkidani@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senkim@Capitol.hawaii.gov,
senkouchi@Capitol.hawaii.gov,
sennishihara@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senruderman@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senshimabukuro@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senslom@capitol.hawaii.gov,
sensolomon@capitol.hawaii.gov,
sentaniguchi@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senthielen@capitol.hawaii.gov,
sentokuda@capitol.hawaii.gov,
senwakai@capitol.hawaii.gov

thanks for clearing that up wolfwood. sure would be nice to have a legal truck gun