Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally (Read 35264 times)

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #180 on: July 22, 2024, 06:00:46 PM »
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C9vJlS_uR7d/?igsh=c2Z2eW5ta29oNncx

Finally finished watching the SecSvc Director Hearing/Democrat Gun Control Ad.

As for that building, the answers are going to come out very slowly and from the FBI, not the SecSvc.  She said consistently that building which the shooter used was not identified as within the security perimeter for the SecSvc.  It was the local LEOs' job to secure anything outside the perimeter.

Which, if you think about it for 1/10 of a nanosecond, that makes no sense.  If it's not a place inside the perimeter (not a problem), why is it ANYBODY'S job to secure it? 

A - See that building?  Looks like a problem for Trump.  Direct line of sight, close enough for a good shot, 1 story building, easy enough to climb on.

b - I'm looking at the Secret Service security plan for the rally, and that building is outside of the perimeter they drew.

A - Oh.  Okay.  Never mind.  I didn't realize the feds had already looked at it and deemed it safe.

B - Yep.  Not out job to second guess the feds.  They've done this a helluva lot more than we ever will.

A - Great.  Lunch?  Your turn to buy!

 :geekdanc:
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

macsak

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #181 on: July 22, 2024, 06:56:13 PM »
whistleblowers now saying that the sniper team that was supposed to be on the roof abandoned their post because "roof too hot"

that's the secret service equivalent of "range too far"

hvybarrels

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #182 on: July 22, 2024, 11:45:50 PM »
whistleblowers now saying that the sniper team that was supposed to be on the roof abandoned their post because "roof too hot"

that's the secret service equivalent of "range too far"

If you dissolve your enemies in acid, technically that's turning your problems into a solution.

oldfart

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #183 on: July 23, 2024, 07:20:50 AM »
The ss director lady just resigned.
No surprise there.
What, Me Worry?

QUIETShooter

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #184 on: July 23, 2024, 08:18:28 AM »
It was the slope.  You know, the slope?

 :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Sometimes you gotta know when to save your bullets.

changemyoil66

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #185 on: July 23, 2024, 09:06:37 AM »
Finally finished watching the SecSvc Director Hearing/Democrat Gun Control Ad.

As for that building, the answers are going to come out very slowly and from the FBI, not the SecSvc.  She said consistently that building which the shooter used was not identified as within the security perimeter for the SecSvc.  It was the local LEOs' job to secure anything outside the perimeter.

Which, if you think about it for 1/10 of a nanosecond, that makes no sense.  If it's not a place inside the perimeter (not a problem), why is it ANYBODY'S job to secure it? 

A - See that building?  Looks like a problem for Trump.  Direct line of sight, close enough for a good shot, 1 story building, easy enough to climb on.

b - I'm looking at the Secret Service security plan for the rally, and that building is outside of the perimeter they drew.

A - Oh.  Okay.  Never mind.  I didn't realize the feds had already looked at it and deemed it safe.

B - Yep.  Not out job to second guess the feds.  They've done this a helluva lot more than we ever will.

A - Great.  Lunch?  Your turn to buy!

 :geekdanc:

I wonder if it's SOP for the SS to fully trust local LEO for security and no one is verifying. "Trust, but verify".

stangzilla

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #186 on: July 23, 2024, 09:32:30 AM »
The ss director lady just resigned.
No surprise there.

Chrashd

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #187 on: July 23, 2024, 01:36:13 PM »
I haven't read all the posts but so far haven't seen an answer.....how many shell casings were found on the roof with the dead shooter????

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #188 on: July 23, 2024, 03:30:08 PM »
I haven't read all the posts but so far haven't seen an answer.....how many shell casings were found on the roof with the dead shooter????

The FORMER Secret Service Director answered that in the hearing yesterday.

"I can't answer that until after the FBI has competed their criminal investigation."

If you have any other questions about that event, just copy and paste the above answer.  it'll be good for about 60 days -- the amount of time she said it'll take for her full investigation report.

Well, i guess it's somebody else's investigation now.

 :thumbsup: :geekdanc:
« Last Edit: July 23, 2024, 03:44:02 PM by Flapp_Jackson »
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

rpoL98

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #189 on: July 23, 2024, 06:04:23 PM »
The FORMER Secret Service Director answered that in the hearing yesterday.

"I can't answer that until after the FBI has competed their criminal investigation."

If you have any other questions about that event, just copy and paste the above answer.  it'll be good for about 60 days -- the amount of time she said it'll take for her full investigation report.

Well, i guess it's somebody else's investigation now.

 :thumbsup: :geekdanc:
I saw that it was leaked there were 8 shell casings, leaked by two eye witnesses.  posted on arfcom news service.

here's the link to X (tweeter).

https://x.com/SenRonJohnson/status/1815823509714538712
« Last Edit: July 23, 2024, 06:27:29 PM by rpoL98 »

drck1000

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #190 on: July 23, 2024, 06:19:02 PM »
I saw that it was leaked there were 8 shell casings, leaked by two eye witnesses.  posted on arfcom news service
Say no more!  ;D

macsak

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #191 on: July 24, 2024, 01:23:01 PM »
"they" are now saying that SS didn't show up for a 9 am meeting with local LEO...

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #192 on: July 24, 2024, 01:44:25 PM »
Latest inconsistency is that the shooter didn't need a ladder to access the roof.  The AC and other mechanical fixtures on the outside provided plenty of access by climbing them.

Also, according to the former director, any area they identify as a risk (like a roof with a direct line of sight to President Trump) would be mitigated via "overwatch" in one or more of 3 ways:

1.  Barrier (fences, guards, locks, etc.)
2.  Tech (drones, cameras, etc.) and/or
3.  Tactical (sniper)

Obviously, none of those measures, if actually focused on the roof, worked.

Another thing was the method of intercommunication among Secret Service and local/state law enforcement.  Their high-tech solution is to put a liaison from each agency or department in a room together.  If something comes in from the local sheriff's people, they are supposed to relay that to the others who in turn should broadcast to their respective personnel.

Although there are reports being communicated about Crooks as suspicious to the local LEOs, the agents protecting Trump never once got a report of "a suspicious person" in the crowd. 

The Former director kept harping on the word "threat" when asked why Crooks wasn't more closely watched or followed.  She seemed to believe he was never a threat until he started shooting -- that he was merely "suspicious."  Sounds like the bar that identifies a threat is too low, and the actions taken for a "suspicious person" don't treat that person any differently than the rest of the crowd.

Not quotes -- just the feel for what was said:

Q: Why didn't the sniper shoot sooner?
A: He fired as soon as he identified the threat.
Q: Why was he not seen as a threat before he fired?
A: He was only considered suspicious.



it started to sound like the Secret Service considers all Trump Rally Attendees "suspicious", and they don't intend to try and single out one person who's "more suspicious" than everyone else.  Not until they are an active threat do the Secret Service act.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

changemyoil66

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #193 on: July 24, 2024, 02:49:04 PM »
FBI director states the rifle might have been not seen when he was walking around due to having a collapsible stock. Will they try to ban these, I mean, lets see what the DNC hates more, collapsible stocks or Trump.

Heavies

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #194 on: July 24, 2024, 03:09:13 PM »
FBI director states the rifle might have been not seen when he was walking around due to having a collapsible stock. Will they try to ban these, I mean, lets see what the DNC hates more, collapsible stocks or Trump.


Bet

macsak

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #195 on: July 24, 2024, 04:50:17 PM »

changemyoil66

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #196 on: July 24, 2024, 04:57:49 PM »
Latest inconsistency is that the shooter didn't need a ladder to access the roof.  The AC and other mechanical fixtures on the outside provided plenty of access by climbing them.

Also, according to the former director, any area they identify as a risk (like a roof with a direct line of sight to President Trump) would be mitigated via "overwatch" in one or more of 3 ways:

1.  Barrier (fences, guards, locks, etc.)
2.  Tech (drones, cameras, etc.) and/or
3.  Tactical (sniper)

Obviously, none of those measures, if actually focused on the roof, worked.

Another thing was the method of intercommunication among Secret Service and local/state law enforcement.  Their high-tech solution is to put a liaison from each agency or department in a room together.  If something comes in from the local sheriff's people, they are supposed to relay that to the others who in turn should broadcast to their respective personnel.

Although there are reports being communicated about Crooks as suspicious to the local LEOs, the agents protecting Trump never once got a report of "a suspicious person" in the crowd. 

The Former director kept harping on the word "threat" when asked why Crooks wasn't more closely watched or followed.  She seemed to believe he was never a threat until he started shooting -- that he was merely "suspicious."  Sounds like the bar that identifies a threat is too low, and the actions taken for a "suspicious person" don't treat that person any differently than the rest of the crowd.

Not quotes -- just the feel for what was said:

Q: Why didn't the sniper shoot sooner?
A: He fired as soon as he identified the threat.
Q: Why was he not seen as a threat before he fired?
A: He was only considered suspicious.



it started to sound like the Secret Service considers all Trump Rally Attendees "suspicious", and they don't intend to try and single out one person who's "more suspicious" than everyone else.  Not until they are an active threat do the Secret Service act.

Bodycam of local PD and SS on the roof states local PD spotted him 1 hr prior and sent pics to all due to suspicious. 18 minutes prior to Trump going on stage, same PD sniper said he lost sight of him.  At that point, Trump should not have went on stage until visually confirmed no threat.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #197 on: July 24, 2024, 05:32:05 PM »
Bodycam of local PD and SS on the roof states local PD spotted him 1 hr prior and sent pics to all due to suspicious. 18 minutes prior to Trump going on stage, same PD sniper said he lost sight of him.  At that point, Trump should not have went on stage until visually confirmed no threat.

Trump was asked whether anyone on his protection detail received ANY communications that a suspicious person, or potential threat, existed prior to him taking the stage.

He said No -- if there had been one, he would have been delayed going on until the situation was secure.

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #198 on: July 24, 2024, 05:44:46 PM »
FBI director states the rifle might have been not seen when he was walking around due to having a collapsible stock. Will they try to ban these, I mean, lets see what the DNC hates more, collapsible stocks or Trump.

If you separate the upper and lower receivers, an AR will fit in almost any medium to large size backpack.

I saw a Marine from MCAS bring an AR-15 to HPD for registration in a "book bag" size backpack.  Pretty easy to pull the takedown pin and pivot pin to separate the receivers.  Just as easy to reassemble.

A collapsable stock is irrelevant.

He might have had the gun under his shirt.

He might have had it in a backpack.

He might have hidden it next to the building during all the time he was walking around using his range finder.

Unless they obtain video or photo evidence showing exactly what he did, the FBI saying how he was able to get it onto the roof unseen is 100% speculation.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

changemyoil66

Re: Former President Trump, shot on stage at a rally
« Reply #199 on: July 25, 2024, 08:03:34 AM »
If you separate the upper and lower receivers, an AR will fit in almost any medium to large size backpack.

I saw a Marine from MCAS bring an AR-15 to HPD for registration in a "book bag" size backpack.  Pretty easy to pull the takedown pin and pivot pin to separate the receivers.  Just as easy to reassemble.

A collapsable stock is irrelevant.

He might have had the gun under his shirt.

He might have had it in a backpack.

He might have hidden it next to the building during all the time he was walking around using his range finder.

Unless they obtain video or photo evidence showing exactly what he did, the FBI saying how he was able to get it onto the roof unseen is 100% speculation.

This is correct, what I'm getting at is will this be used to ban collapable stocks?