2aHawaii
General Topics => Political Discussion => Topic started by: ren on November 03, 2020, 08:50:45 PM
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https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8912083/Welcome-party-Recreational-marijuana-legal-New-Jersey-Arizona.html (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8912083/Welcome-party-Recreational-marijuana-legal-New-Jersey-Arizona.html)
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Good idea.
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Good idea.
When the government starts legalizing hard drugs, they are signaling they are up to something.
When religion is no longer the opiate of the masses, they have to allow actual opiates.
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Good idea.
lol.
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When the government starts legalizing hard drugs, they are signaling they are up to something.
When religion is no longer the opiate of the masses, they have to allow actual opiates.
More like we can stop putting people in jail for having tiny amounts of drugs. Stop wasting endless money.
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More like we can stop putting people in jail for having tiny amounts of drugs. Stop wasting endless money.
Spin it however you must, but when YOUR future teen overdoses on heroin, you'll be asking why something so lethal isn't being controlled by government.
Sometimes a "tiny amount" is enough to kill.
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The Zombie Apocalypse has started in Oregon.
If you think Covid-19 spreads fast.......
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Spin it however you must, but when YOUR future teen overdoses on heroin, you'll be asking why something so lethal isn't being controlled by government.
Sometimes a "tiny amount" is enough to kill.
Jailing users doesn't really stop drugs....they can still jail dealers. You know the actual problem.
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Evolution is a theory I don't find very compelling,
BUT Natural selection seems to be a real thing.
I think that Fentanyl should be readily available to every
adult in America. Cheap and sold like candy.
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Jailing users doesn't really stop drugs....they can still jail dealers. You know the actual problem.
they passed a law just like this in seattle
the dealers just make sure they have less than the legal limit on them when they are on the street
after they make a sale, they get more, but still less than the legal limit
homelessness and drug abuse got worse (and this was before covid)...
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drug use disqualifies one from owning firearms
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they passed a law just like this in seattle
the dealers just make sure they have less than the legal limit on them when they are on the street
after they make a sale, they get more, but still less than the legal limit
homelessness and drug abuse got worse (and this was before covid)...
That kind of stance comes from folks who form their opinions and beliefs without knowledge of the situation or taking the time to look at the facts. Basically a stance from a position of ignorance.
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It is all.about money for state coffers.
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Spin it however you must, but when YOUR future teen overdoses on heroin, you'll be asking why something so lethal isn't being controlled by government.
Sometimes a "tiny amount" is enough to kill.
Interesting being a physician and I had to pay for a course and pay for an additional DEA license to prescribe suboxone for at most 35 patients a year. Suboxone being a medication that can treat opiate addiction and pain and is much safer by far than opiates.
So in order to treat addiction in this country I have to pay out of pocket to do extra training and get an extra license to prescribe a much safer medication to a few patients. But if I was to prescribe fentanyl or oxycontin or morphine, it is literally sky the limit.
Almost if the government wants me to continue to prescribe the highly addictive, dangerous pain meds and keep people addicted for the rest of their lives paying drug companies rather than get people off their addictions.
my partner had his phone bugged by the DEA and had them send in officers as fake patients trying to trip him up and catch him doing something wrong with that 35 patient suboxone license. They didnt find anything wrong but he refuses to deal with opiate addiction now because he might have his phones bugged again.
The government isnt saving us from heroin or opiates or anything else. We need to quit assuming they have us in their best interests.
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Interesting being a physician and I had to pay for a course and pay for an additional DEA license to prescribe suboxone for at most 35 patients a year. Suboxone being a medication that can treat opiate addiction and pain and is much safer by far than opiates.
So in order to treat addiction in this country I have to pay out of pocket to do extra training and get an extra license to prescribe a much safer medication to a few patients. But if I was to prescribe fentanyl or oxycontin or morphine, it is literally sky the limit.
Almost if the government wants me to continue to prescribe the highly addictive, dangerous pain meds and keep people addicted for the rest of their lives paying drug companies rather than get people off their addictions.
my partner had his phone bugged by the DEA and had them send in officers as fake patients trying to trip him up and catch him doing something wrong with that 35 patient suboxone license. They didnt find anything wrong but he refuses to deal with opiate addiction now because he might have his phones bugged again.
The government isnt saving us from heroin or opiates or anything else. We need to quit assuming they have us in their best interests.
interesting .
What is your medical opinion on the govt legalizing previously illegal narcotics?
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still schedule 1 narcotics on the federal level. So anyone who owns a firearm cannot consume.
The plan should be also the state should allow people to make them. This drives out the drug trade industry. So cartels and gangs lose money in OR and leave.
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still schedule 1 narcotics on the federal level. So anyone who owns a firearm cannot consume.
The plan should be also the state should allow people to make them. This drives out the drug trade industry. So cartels and gangs lose money in OR and leave.
Yes cartels and gangs are the issue and should be the focus. Not the users. Locking up users will just have someone replace them. Waste money and destroy lives. If someone wants to do drugs that's their body.
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We need to quit assuming they have us in their best interests.
Never did, and the DEA is the scum of fed agencies like the BATF. Goons too stupid for the more intelligent agencies.
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interesting .
What is your medical opinion on the govt legalizing previously illegal narcotics?
I'm not a doctor. I'm an engineer.
I have had members of my family that were full blown heroin addicts,
Pakalolo, tobacco, and alcohol addicted.
some are dead due to drugs. I've seen the stuff up close.
I still maintain that the government has NO business telling adults
what kind of drugs they can or cannot have or use.
I emphasize ADULTS.
We pay doctors for their professional judgement in our care,
letting the government interfere with that is STUPID!
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I'm not a doctor. I'm an engineer.
I have had members of my family that were full blown heroin addicts,
Pakalolo, tobacco, and alcohol addicted.
some are dead due to drugs. I've seen the stuff up close.
I still maintain that the government has NO business telling adults
what kind of drugs they can or cannot have or use.
I emphasize ADULTS.
We pay doctors for their professional judgement in our care,
letting the government interfere with that is STUPID!
I have to agree, freedom.
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Yes cartels and gangs are the issue and should be the focus. Not the users. Locking up users will just have someone replace them. Waste money and destroy lives. If someone wants to do drugs that's their body.
Also if someone ODing and they're obviously a drug user (needle marks on arms), then let them. Instead they get Narcan and free hospital stay cause they won't pay for it. And in the mean time, millions with diabetes pay for insulin.
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It will be an interesting experiment, especially when it comes to robbing the cartels of revenue. Oregon does not seem to be run that well, though, so most likely there will be a mass exodus of the cities as they descend into crime infested hellholes.
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Also if someone ODing and they're obviously a drug user (needle marks on arms), then let them. Instead they get Narcan and free hospital stay cause they won't pay for it. And in the mean time, millions with diabetes pay for insulin.
I agree, though this isn't politically correct by any sense lol
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I agree, though this isn't politically correct by any sense lol
True, but a drug addict will rarely get help and stay clean. In the mean time, steal, harm, and destroy property. So screw ODing druggy. My 2cents.
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Also if someone ODing and they're obviously a drug user (needle marks on arms), then let them. Instead they get Narcan and free hospital stay cause they won't pay for it. And in the mean time, millions with diabetes pay for insulin.
You don't know real druggies.
They inject in the Vagina, in between the toes all sorts of places
you won't normally look. Rat tracks on the arms is dead people walking.
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interesting .
What is your medical opinion on the govt legalizing previously illegal narcotics?
Since I used to live in Portland and would not go back under any circumstance I'd be happy if they built a 50 ft wall around Portland, delivered unlimited meth and heroin and let it simmer for a few months. I'd make sure to invite everyone from Salem and also all the leadership of the Oregon Health plan.
But I guess that is not really a medical opinion.
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Since I used to live in Portland and would not go back under any circumstance I'd be happy if they built a 50 ft wall around Portland, delivered unlimited meth and heroin and let it simmer for a few months. I'd make sure to invite everyone from Salem and also all the leadership of the Oregon Health plan.
But I guess that is not really a medical opinion.
so...bad govt decision?
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so...bad govt decision?
The Oregon state government could take the best looking plan on paper and ruin it. When they made the C&R FFL illegal I knew that there was no trusting any of them.
Just like being as friendly and hospitable to the homeless lead to giant homeless cities and garbage for miles on the highways. You could drive 60 minutes out of Portland into the wilderness and find a whole living room of furniture and garbage in the trees where the meth users would do drugs all day. We'd have to clean it up just to put a good light onto the gun owners who shot at public locations like that. Friends would have homeless living in trailers in front of their house and dumping garbage onto their lawn and if they called the police they would say the City wont let them deal with it.
So if it works as well as their lack of dealing with the homeless, Portland should be a tourist designation for drug users coming from all over the country to squat and do what ever they want.
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The Oregon state government could take the best looking plan on paper and ruin it. When they made the C&R FFL illegal I knew that there was no trusting any of them.
Just like being as friendly and hospitable to the homeless lead to giant homeless cities and garbage for miles on the highways. You could drive 60 minutes out of Portland into the wilderness and find a whole living room of furniture and garbage in the trees where the meth users would do drugs all day. We'd have to clean it up just to put a good light onto the gun owners who shot at public locations like that. Friends would have homeless living in trailers in front of their house and dumping garbage onto their lawn and if they called the police they would say the City wont let them deal with it.
So if it works as well as their lack of dealing with the homeless, Portland should be a tourist designation for drug users coming from all over the country to squat and do what ever they want.
Sounds like something a gallon of gas and a match could solve.
Nowadays we all look like ANTIFA with masks.
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The Oregon state government could take the best looking plan on paper and ruin it. When they made the C&R FFL illegal I knew that there was no trusting any of them.
Just like being as friendly and hospitable to the homeless lead to giant homeless cities and garbage for miles on the highways. You could drive 60 minutes out of Portland into the wilderness and find a whole living room of furniture and garbage in the trees where the meth users would do drugs all day. We'd have to clean it up just to put a good light onto the gun owners who shot at public locations like that. Friends would have homeless living in trailers in front of their house and dumping garbage onto their lawn and if they called the police they would say the City wont let them deal with it.
So if it works as well as their lack of dealing with the homeless, Portland should be a tourist designation for drug users coming from all over the country to squat and do what ever they want.
that's what I am seeing here in Hawaii. Treat homelessness with more personnel and money and the govt incentivized the homeless condition. It's a tough problem - I was almost homeless coming out of high school.
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that's what I am seeing here in Hawaii. Treat homelessness with more personnel and money and the govt incentivized the homeless condition. It's a tough problem - I was almost homeless coming out of high school.
Years ago my step-daughter was homeless. She ditched highschool with 2 weeks left to live with a homeless kid her age the moment she turned 18. She got pregnant and after coming home again we decided that in order for her to continue living at home she'd need to finish that highschool diploma with one 1/2 day class a week. Despite that only requirement, she felt this was too much work and went homeless again. She lived with several homeless young people who didnt need to be homeless, but they just did not want to do anything at all.
It was sure eye opening being exposed to that part of the homeless situation in Portland hearing about quite a lot of people who were homeless by choice. Her SNAP benefits were pooled by their little group to sell for cash so they could buy drugs or occasionally get food from it. All of them learned about loopholes to abuse the system. Several of them were getting food stamps from more than one state. They lived in the HHR I had bought her previously by a park and never once did the police interact with them.
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I have no problem with legal marijuana. As for legal heroine I figure if you want to go die using it then be my guest but I fear associated theft crime to pay for people's habits. However when it comes to meth I don't see any good arguments in legalizing that, thats just asking for trouble.
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I have no problem with legal marijuana. As for legal heroine I figure if you want to go die using it then be my guest but I fear associated theft crime to pay for people's habits. However when it comes to meth I don't see any good arguments in legalizing that, thats just asking for trouble.
This law is just designed to go after the dealers not the average drug user on the street. Arresting him does nothing to stop the drug trade. Just clogs up prison and wastes all our money. Just let them overdose and go for the real criminals.
Aka some young people do stupid things and get coke, police stop them. Throwing them in jail ruins their lives and wastes my money. And doesn't do anything really beneficial.
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Sounds like something a gallon of gas and a match could solve.
Nowadays we all look like ANTIFA with masks.
Had a UC that was spotted in NY. Worst UC ever as he tried to pose as antifa. He was wearing a beanie instead of a hoodie. His black coat he wore also looked like something from Banana Republic, and he looked way to clean. So someone spotted him and was chatting. He ended up showing his badge that was on his waistband.
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I have no problem with legal marijuana. As for legal heroine I figure if you want to go die using it then be my guest but I fear associated theft crime to pay for people's habits. However when it comes to meth I don't see any good arguments in legalizing that, thats just asking for trouble.
Here's a super radical idea. If people or the government make the drugs legally they then push out the cartels bringing them in. Then in turn, pushes out the dealers. Thus puts them out of business in the USA. Drug crime goes down, cops are safer, saves money in court cases/police pay/ injury cost/etc...1 downside would be the antihistamine companies and battery companies will lose money.
Why buy from a drug dealer when someone can just go to the store and get better quality stuff for cheaper. There was a VICE documentary on the Colorado MJ legalization. Basically the MJ dealers all said they were going out of business. Some where getting out, others were going to sell harsher drugs.
And anyone besides a minor who is ODing, will not get any treatment from EMT or hospitals. I say minor because they may ingest the drugs due to their young age and not knowing any better. An adult made the choice almost all the time.
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Here's a super radical idea. If people or the government make the drugs legally they then push out the cartels bringing them in. Then in turn, pushes out the dealers. Thus puts them out of business in the USA. Drug crime goes down, cops are safer, saves money in court cases/police pay/ injury cost/etc...1 downside would be the antihistamine companies and battery companies will lose money.
Why buy from a drug dealer when someone can just go to the store and get better quality stuff for cheaper. There was a VICE documentary on the Colorado MJ legalization. Basically the MJ dealers all said they were going out of business. Some where getting out, others were going to sell harsher drugs.
And anyone besides a minor who is ODing, will not get any treatment from EMT or hospitals. I say minor because they may ingest the drugs due to their young age and not knowing any better. An adult made the choice almost all the time.
Where do you think the gov't will be buying their narcotics to sell legally? From the same people producing them now, only instead of using armed forces to intercept drug shipments, we'll be paying for them to protect drug shipments. :wacko:
This argument was used on many other vice-related products, like tobacco and alcohol. When the gov't starts taxing it, the bootleggers STILL have a market. Cigarettes and booze still flow through Canada, just without the US tax stamps. No tax revenue, no control over safety or quality, and the "dealers" are still in business.
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Where do you think the gov't will be buying their narcotics to sell legally? From the same people producing them now, only instead of using armed forces to intercept drug shipments, we'll be paying for them to protect drug shipments. :wacko:
This argument was used on many other vice-related products, like tobacco and alcohol. When the gov't starts taxing it, the bootleggers STILL have a market. Cigarettes and booze still flow through Canada, just without the US tax stamps. No tax revenue, no control over safety or quality, and the "dealers" are still in business.
OR, you know Nebraska can grow less corn and grow other crops. Its as if you think drugs can only be grown in Mexico by cartels. If you legalize it, people will create entire legal supply chains in America, not only stores, but manufacture, and transportation. Counterfeit alcohol and cigarettes are uncommon in America to my knowledge. You can tax them at the same rate.
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Here's a super radical idea. If people or the government make the drugs legally they then push out the cartels bringing them in. Then in turn, pushes out the dealers. Thus puts them out of business in the USA. Drug crime goes down, cops are safer, saves money in court cases/police pay/ injury cost/etc...1 downside would be the antihistamine companies and battery companies will lose money.
Why buy from a drug dealer when someone can just go to the store and get better quality stuff for cheaper. There was a VICE documentary on the Colorado MJ legalization. Basically the MJ dealers all said they were going out of business. Some where getting out, others were going to sell harsher drugs.
And anyone besides a minor who is ODing, will not get any treatment from EMT or hospitals. I say minor because they may ingest the drugs due to their young age and not knowing any better. An adult made the choice almost all the time.
One of the seemingly rare times I fully agree with you on. No tinfoil needed.
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OR, you know Nebraska can grow less corn and grow other crops. Its as if you think drugs can only be grown in Mexico by cartels. If you legalize it, people will create entire legal supply chains in America, not only stores, but manufacture, and transportation. Counterfeit alcohol and cigarettes are uncommon in America to my knowledge. You can tax them at the same rate.
Really? You know that how? Are you a NE corn farmer? Do you know whether or not the climate and soil will even support opium?
There just might be a reason the opium exporters are all within a similar distance from the equator. Just a "theory," but I bet you can find out why.
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HINT:
https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/top-opium-poppy-producing-countries.html
The best conditions in which Opium Poppies germinate is a soil temperature between 60 and 65 degrees
Fahrenheit and an air temperature around 55 degrees Fahrenheit. A good amount of air circulation is
recommended for the most prosperous growth of the poppy, as well as plenty of sunlight and sufficient rainfall.
I lived in OK for 5 years. If you look at a map, NE is just north of OK.
Corn grows well in warm-hot weather, but it's seasonal. You plant in the Spring, harvest in the Summer & Fall, and when the plants stop yielding, you plow the plants under and wait for next planting season.
Opium likes moderate climates. NE is anything but temperate. Very hot Summers and very cold Winters. Spring and Fall are tornado seasons, with weeks of hail and thunder storms.
But, you go ahead and tell us all which states should change to growing poppies and abandon the task of FEEDING the world.
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One of the seemingly rare times I fully agree with you on. No tinfoil needed.
If you agreeing with me, then I know my train of thought is off. Thanks. JK. :rofl:
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If you agreeing with me, then I know my train of thought is off. Thanks. JK. :rofl:
Same thing I say about Trump.
He's hated by all the right people, so he MUST be doing something right!
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If you agreeing with me, then I know my train of thought is off. Thanks. JK. :rofl:
You think enough to have a train? 😳
:rofl:
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You think enough to have a train? 😳
:rofl:
Just like most threads here, his train has been derailed. :geekdanc: :thumbsup: :stopjack:
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This law is just designed to go after the dealers not the average drug user on the street. Arresting him does nothing to stop the drug trade. Just clogs up prison and wastes all our money. Just let them overdose and go for the real criminals.
Aka some young people do stupid things and get coke, police stop them. Throwing them in jail ruins their lives and wastes my money. And doesn't do anything really beneficial.
I am somewhat with you there because I know that with the laws of supply and demand, as long as you have people wanting the drugs, someone will fill the market of selling it.
What bothers me is that I don't think this will help with crime rate numbers. If people are less afraid to use it and aren't locked up for using it then they may see increase in property crime rates for these users to pay for their habits.
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Here's a super radical idea. If people or the government make the drugs legally they then push out the cartels bringing them in. Then in turn, pushes out the dealers. Thus puts them out of business in the USA. Drug crime goes down, cops are safer, saves money in court cases/police pay/ injury cost/etc...1 downside would be the antihistamine companies and battery companies will lose money.
Why buy from a drug dealer when someone can just go to the store and get better quality stuff for cheaper. There was a VICE documentary on the Colorado MJ legalization. Basically the MJ dealers all said they were going out of business. Some where getting out, others were going to sell harsher drugs.
And anyone besides a minor who is ODing, will not get any treatment from EMT or hospitals. I say minor because they may ingest the drugs due to their young age and not knowing any better. An adult made the choice almost all the time.
With a decrease in price it would stand to reason that usage would increase and overdoses would increase. Crime may go down but I am not so sure, we have seen rich celebrities blow fortunes on drugs so I am sure even if heroin were cheap that we would still see people spending all their money and stealing to support their habit.
Marijuana isn't the best analogy though, people not eating peoples faces and doing weird violent stuff on marijuana. The chronic on meth is still going to be a problem and I would bet be a worse problem.
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I am somewhat with you there because I know that with the laws of supply and demand, as long as you have people wanting the drugs, someone will fill the market of selling it.
What bothers me is that I don't think this will help with crime rate numbers. If people are less afraid to use it and aren't locked up for using it then they may see increase in property crime rates for these users to pay for their habits.
I believe there was a study in Canada that after legalizing pot, rates of pot usage amongst teens and young people went down a decent percentage. There will always be a demand, unless people stop wanting it. Go after the source, or better yet legalize the source so you can tax and regulate like beer. Then no more cartels.
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With a decrease in price it would stand to reason that usage would increase and overdoses would increase. Crime may go down but I am not so sure, we have seen rich celebrities blow fortunes on drugs so I am sure even if heroin were cheap that we would still see people spending all their money and stealing to support their habit.
Marijuana isn't the best analogy though, people not eating peoples faces and doing weird violent stuff on marijuana. The chronic on meth is still going to be a problem and I would bet be a worse problem.
Evolution and natural selection will run its course. Let the idiots die.
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I am somewhat with you there because I know that with the laws of supply and demand, as long as you have people wanting the drugs, someone will fill the market of selling it.
What bothers me is that I don't think this will help with crime rate numbers. If people are less afraid to use it and aren't locked up for using it then they may see increase in property crime rates for these users to pay for their habits.
Also, just like bootleg whisky and cigarettes, the black market will not go away. It' will just have fewer customers. Less demand means those still customers of it may pay more (can't get the same quality stuff in that quantity from legal sources). That means more competition, which equates to more gang violence.
You can never eliminate the underground market. It's there to serve the people the legal market wont, and to avoid government regulations and taxes. Passing the savings on to customers makes similar quality black market products attractive, especially for drug addicted users who can't hold down a job! O0
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I believe there was a study in Canada that after legalizing pot, rates of pot usage amongst teens and young people went down a decent percentage. There will always be a demand, unless people stop wanting it. Go after the source, or better yet legalize the source so you can tax and regulate like beer. Then no more cartels.
With the rise in demand for avocados, mexico has seen problems with gangs strong arming the avocado growers, legalization of marijuana may never completely eliminate the organized crime.
I really don't care about marijuana though, I am still worried about the real hard drugs like meth.
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With the rise in demand for avocados, mexico has seen problems with gangs strong arming the avocado growers, legalization of marijuana may never completely eliminate the organized crime.
I really don't care about marijuana though, I am still worried about the real hard drugs like meth.
Interesting but you still don't see cartels killing each other over avocados. It might be just a stop gap to slow decline till they eventually pitter out.
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Interesting but you still don't see cartels killing each other over avocados. It might be just a stop gap to slow decline till they eventually pitter out.
Wrong.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.newsweek.com/19-people-have-been-murdered-mexico-cartels-fighting-over-avocado-trade-1453925%3famp=1
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Wrong.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.newsweek.com/19-people-have-been-murdered-mexico-cartels-fighting-over-avocado-trade-1453925%3famp=1
I stand corrected. I guess cartels are going to kill regardless until they are killed or lose membership.
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Evolution and natural selection will run its course. Let the idiots die.
As long as it is adults.
One of the few times I mostly agree with you.
I don't accept evolution( it is that complexity thing), but definitely natural selection
is for real.
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I stand corrected. I guess cartels are going to kill regardless until they are killed or lose membership.
It's always amazing to see you adopt a completely different opinion after seeing the honest facts.
I recommend you start looking into the real facts PRIOR TO posting your opinions based on .... stuff you think is true and could have been easily checked using a search engine.
This new approach would save all of us a lot of time and typing -- even you (More time for bowel movements).
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As long as it is adults.
One of the few times I mostly agree with you.
I don't accept evolution( it is that complexity thing), but definitely natural selection
is for real.
I liked the series "1000 Ways to Die." People put themselves in some of the most unusual situations when it comes to accidental self-destruction -- normally situations which were 100% their choice. I usually ended each segment with the opinion, "I don't think they thought that all the way through." >:D
https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7q6eys
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I liked the series "1000 Ways to Die." People put themselves in some of the most unusual situations when it comes to accidental self-destruction -- normally situations which were 100% their choice. I usually ended each segment with the opinion, "I don't think they thought that all the way through." >:D
https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7q6eys
I didn't watch the whole thing,
I'm data limited and getting close to my monthly allotment.
but the cigarette guy is a classic.
I quit smoking 38 and some years ago, but I know Dakine.
I can never figure it out. Even emphysema won't stop them.
I quit because Reagan signed into law an additional tax
on cigarettes and it pissed me off.